help a gal learn how to dominate

[Kerrymdb]

Long time lurker finally ready to step out and ask for help from my peers.

I'm at the point where I can comfortably win a Cultural or Space Race victory at the noble level most of the time. Before I take that next step up to prince, I want to win one, just one, lousy domination victory.

Problem is, whenever I start a game with the intention on going after a domination victory, I build a stack of troops, lose some, get frustrated and decide to start a new game where I can build shiny wonders instead.

What I would like to do is play a game where the Civ experts can help me. I've seen other people do this, and I have always learned a lot from those posts.

First thing to do is decide on is a leader and map type of optimum warmongering. I usually play on a hemispheres map, but am more than willing to mix it up a bit.

Who's a good leader to start with? After I get a few opinions, I'll post the start and hopefully I can somehow manage to conquer the world! (or at least 50% of it and 66% of the population...)

Updated through turn ninety-eight

 

[DaveMcW]

My general rule is to spend 20 turns building military in every single city before you start a war.

 

[BalbanesBeoulve]

Play as the Romans, beeline ironworking, and build nothing but praetorians. On noble you should be able to take out at least 4 or 5 civs with only 2 or 3 cities. Raze everything else, except for maybe capitals.

Other than that, it really depends when you want to fight. I really like the ottomans for midgame wars, and England if I want to start warring later. Both have good unique units for their time period.

 

[eewallace]

I'm in the same situation--cultural, space race and diplomatic are easy enough for me on noble that I have trouble pursuing military victories. Here's my strategy (going to try this tonight)--the wonders diet! I can only build one wonder for each civ I've eliminated. I'm thinking I may play Shaka--he's the ultimate warmonger!

 

[Cam_H]

Kerry,

Welcome to CivFanatics!

Domination is a lot easier if you go with a Pangaea map ... you can just keep pushing onwards essentially without concerning yourself with getting to Astronomy and building a naval fleet with Galleons. You also quickly meet all the tribes and can engage in more trades and work some interesting diplomacy. Epic speed makes warmongering a bit easier than Normal speed too.

For me, I tend to go after one tribe in the Classical Era (ye olde Axe rush), make some headway during the Medieval-Renaissance period (Catapults, Maces, War Elephants), but really turn up the heat by getting Industrial Age units (one or two of; Rifles, Grenadiers, Cannons, Cavalry) to go on the rampage.

It's really important to specialise and ensure that you have several unit pumps churning out military on a (near) ongoing basis. It's a trap to become too 'builder oriented' ... try to confine your unit pumps to a Forge, Courthouse, Barracks, Stables, and Granary. As Oxford University emerges as a possibility, you may need to look at getting Library > University up so you can quickly meet your prerequisite number of Uni's for Oxford.

Be the bully! ... and welcome again!

 

[troytheface]

helping a gal to dominate is like teaching a butcher how to cut meat.

however, build axe, raze cities.

 

[Bandobras Took]

Choose a leader who is completely unsuited to peacetime of any sort. Tokugawa springs to mind; if you're not in military mode, you're not using him effectively. Above all, avoid Industrious leaders -- wonders become just too tempting when you have one of those. Also, give Spiritual leaders a miss, and use wartime civics, never changing back.

 

[BalbanesBeoulve]

Choose a leader who is completely unsuited to peacetime of any sort. Tokugawa springs to mind; if you're not in military mode, you're not using him effectively. Above all, avoid Industrious leaders -- wonders become just too tempting when you have one of those. Also, give Spiritual leaders a miss, and use wartime civics, never changing back.

I actually disagree with some of this. An important part of warfare is technology. Warfare becomes much easier if you have rifles and cannons while your opponents are still defending with longbows. Bureaucracy and Free speech are much better techs than vassalage because they allow you to tech much faster.

And you don't need both vassalage and theocracy. Running both gives you 7 xp with barracks, short of the 10 needed for 3 promotions. One or the other gives you 5, which is enough for 2 promotions. enough to get formation with aggressive civs, or pinch/cover/shock with non aggressive civs. It might be good to run them both for a little bit so you're that much closer to a level 4 unit for heroic epic, but they're definitely not something you want on full time.

The specialization tip is a great one though. Make it a priority to find 1 city that will produce almost exclusively nothing but units. Get as many hills as you can in its big fat cross, and preferably have it be a river city, farm any plains and grasslands also build plenty of workshops, don't build any cottages that you'll be tempted to work. Build a barracks, a stables, a courthouse once you get CoL, then build units, and more units and more units. Any other buildings will only be built if you need the happiness or health, after it's built you go back to building units until you're about to hit the happy or health cap again.

The pangaea tip is another good one. Anything other than a pangaea map makes military wins very very time consuming before flight and transports.




As for the leader, i'm a huge, huge fan of Ragnar. Financial means he can tech very well, and aggressive means he can also fight well. Unfortunately his UU and UB are mediocre on anything other than archipelago maps, so I always play with unrestricted leaders.


As for having your units die, you need to mix it up. You can't just build 1 kind of unit. In the middle ages for example you need to have crossbowmen to protect against enemy macemen, you need pikemen and/or elephants to protect against enemy knights. And you need knights with flanking to take down stacks of catapults and trebuchets. To take a city you also need plenty of trebuchets and catapults of your own to tear down the defenses, then you need to sacrifice a few to weaken the defenders.Prioritize trebuchets, though. They might be more expensive, but they are much better at attacking cities, and are more likely to survive to retreat. Then you have your macemen with city raider promotions take down the defenders. You should be able to take most cities losing only 1 or 2 trebuchets, and keeping most of your main forces alive. As you move through the enemy's territory make sure to stay in forests, jungles, and hills for the defense bonus.

 

[Andvare]

Play the 18 Civs earth map as Rome (epic or marathon). Beeline iron. Get Praetorians. Do not get open border agreements with anyone.
This forces you to expand heavily with military, besides, you can just continue expanding with the praets, and gain a domination victory early, just make sure you have COL first.
Or play Duuk's revised version, where it's really a terra map, that way you could easily do a conquest victory.

 

[Pe Ell]

If you want to dominated you got to bring out the whip. Half stupid joke, half serious advice in that one. Slavery and whipping are good tools for early warmongering. I'd suggest picking a pangea map, it's easier to keep track of the other AI's like that. The risk of a hidden continent running away in techs is less that way. Romans or Zulu are good choices for warmongering. Rome on a pangea map is almost ridiculously easy as you can spam preatorians who will dominate the battlefield unsupported for a thousand years.

Other than such suggestion you also has to work on getting into the warmongerers mindset. Start by making up silly excuses for war, like "they settled my spot!" is a good one. Force yourself to build troops instead of wonders. Imagine if the game didn't have any wonders and play it more like that. Don't build any of them at all, ever, for a few games.

I'm a converted wonderaddict who mostly win domination victories nowadays.

 

[Morgrad]

To learn domination wins, it's hard to go wrong with Rome or Boudica (or go unrestricted and go Boudica of the Romans). As long as you understand that praetorians are a crutch, you can still learn a *lot* about warmongering with Rome.

Asking "is this helping me militarily?" when you're making a decision is a good idea.

So.... as a learning game, set up a Normal size, Epic speed, Pangaea, Roman start, post the starting position for us, and we'll be happy to give you seven-hundred conflicting peices of advice.

 

[Gone Dark]

Who's a good leader to start with? After I get a few opinions, I'll post the start and hopefully I can somehow manage to conquer the world! (or at least 50% of it and 66% of the population...)

I think Charismatic is the best thrait for warmongering and a nice trait early on due to the extra happiness.

I love to wage war with Napoleon (ORG/CHA) or Hannibal (FIN/CHA). Both have traits that will help you to maintain a larger empire. If you are going for a specialist economy perhaps Lincoln (PHI/CHA) is a good choice.

Zulus are also good for war as someone mentioned with their cheap unique baracks also reducing maintance.

Romas are boring and overpowered if you ask me.

 

[Validator]

If the plan is to go for domination (as opposed to conqest) then it will be important to develop a strong economy. Large empires cost a lot in maintenance, and large armies cost a lot in support and supply. Nothing makes warfare harder than falling behind in the tech race (especially if you need to invade another continent).

For that reason I would suggest a leader that combines military and economic traits. Hannibal, Ragnar or Mansa would be good options.

A Pangea map would likely be the best option, but a continents type map would provide the opportunity for some advice on intercontinental invasions.

You might want to consider using the "No Vassals" option for this game as vassals can complicate warmongering. Like when the civ that you're beating down becomes the vassal of some other civ.

 

[bestbrian]

Shaka on a Great Plains map; 18 Civs; Epic; Aggressive AI. I like the Great Plains map for this better than Pangea for this purpose; you're just marching across the table. If you want to force yourself forward, WB your start so you begin in one of the corners and just keep pushing out without worrying about your rear.
HC is also a great leader for this strategy (and pretty much every strat for that matter) and has an awesome UU, but Shaka has a GREAT building/UU and, frankly, you're Shaka, you've GOT to bang heads.

 

[CivMcNut]

I think keeping those troops up is the hardest part. I keep finding myself wanting to take time to build something like a library or a market that'll help my economy out, and not building that axeman I sorely need. It's nice to have a big group of troops to start out with, cause you always seem to go through them pretty quick when faced with a city where you fight against the odds.

When I'm trying for domination, I like to keep my cities and eliminate an opponent completely that I have some conquered cities. The 64% of land is much harder to get than the 45% population for me usually.

I think aggressive trait helps the most on these kinds of victories. Having cheap barracks, and melee and gunpowder with a boost sure helps a bunch in all that fighting going on.

 

[madscientist]

Welcome to the forums, Some advice on proceeding to a domination victory from a peaceful player.

1) MAP; Pangea, standard size (6 AIs). Low sea level, essentially ignor ethe navy. After you learn to win that way, try archeopolego so you can learn naval warfare. Then you reayd to take any map type.

2) Leader. Interesting, you obviously know how to play. My suggestion is a leader with a good military trait and a good economic trait. Brennus (Spir/Char), Al (Ag/Phil), Ragnar (Fin/Agr), Hannibal (Fin/Char). Rag and Han are poorer for Pangea because of the UB, better for the Archeopolego board. Honorable mention to Julius (prats plus organized) And Monty (resourceless early UU).

3) Try to take one AI out at each age, Swords/axes/chariots, swords/horse archers/cats, maces/knights/pikes/trebs, rifles/cavalry/cannons, and modern tanks/airforce. If you start out well, take it slow and learn all the ages.

Enjoy!

 

[eewallace]

Shaka on a pangea map has worked really well for me. Take out the nearest civs (but don't keep cities that aren't in prime locations), build ikandhas and courthouses, hook up resources, then when macemen are available, take over the world! (Actually, in my game, I've kept one civ alive because I want to tech to Sid's Sushi--I haven't done much with corporations since the BTS patch and I want to check them out.)

 

[IglooDame]

There's a very simple solution: check the "always war" checkbox when you start up a game. You'll either win via Domination or lose.

I recommend Julius Caesar and pangea map for your first attempt.

 

[TheDS]

My 17 step plan for kicking major patootie in Noble:

1. Pick Elizabeth and England. Financial will ensure a rapid tech lead, Philosophical will get you your GPs sooner.
2. Make sure your starting map has Marble. This is best done with Advanced start, and if you don't find Marble after placing your cities, restart the map until you get it. BEST is if you also get Stone, but this is rare to have both nearby. Only seen it in two games.
3. Make your way to Bronze and switch to Slavery. This doesn't have to be a beeline, but it's good if it is.
4. Expand. Whip mercilessly.
5. Get your Marble (and Stone) hooked up quickly. Whip mercilessly.
6. You should be able to get the Oracle with a half-hearted effort, and if you've got Marble, it's in the bag. Pyramids is great for the switch to Representation, boosting your tech lead even more. Specialists increase GPPP too.
7. Beeline for the Great Library and Parthenon. These also require Marble.
8. Continue expanding and teching. Getting the ability to trade techs will help a little, getting the ability to steal them will help even more.
9. At some point, you need to beeline for Stock Exchange and Redcoats. You'll want to have and be in Nationalism by then so you can draft.
10. Go for MoM and Taj Mahal. A long Golden Age or two is good for the growth, and guess what resource helps you build them?
11. Once you're up to Redcoats (Rifling), build them like mad, drafting where you can get away with it. Save up some money to upgrade everything you can to Redcoat as fast as possible. Ideally, you'll have everything upgraded within a turn of getting Rifling.
12. Since you've already moved your older troops to the borders of an easy target and now upgraded them to Redcoats, invade!
13. Start working on Steel so you've got some Cannons for later. The use of a few cannons will reduce the burden of needing as many Redcoats pouring out of all your cities.
14. CAPTURE cities. Raze useless ones, but you want to have MORE territory. For enemies that are going to take an inordinate amount of time to conquer, allow them to capitulate.
15. As each falls, move your troops quickly to the next domino and after you've built up enough force, invade them.
16. Use any mobility advantages you can. Usually this means galleons and frigates (frigates to knock down defenses). The fewer troops you lose or injure taking a city, the sooner the next city will fall, so having cannons and naval support is useful.
17. Shouldn't take long in game turns to subdue a given opponent, but managing all these new cities will sap a lot of real time and game money. Cheaper than throwing down a bunch of settlers and getting in a race with other civs for the best spots.

All in all, you can play the first part of the game as you normally would, though you want to bypass Wonders that aren't doing you a whole lot of good. You need a strong economy to build an unstoppable juggernaut. But at some point, you're going to bee-line your Uniques - the Stock Exchange for a monetary bonus and the Redcoats for the military advantage. Simpy having the "best unit" isn't a guarantor of success; you need to have a strong enough economy to keep up with everyone, to defend yourself from surprises, and to make use of your gains.

It's cheaper to take cities with established populations and pre-built buildings and let them grow, than raze them, build settlers, and build all those buildings you just razed. And it saves you from accidentally razing Wonders. To keep from having to worry about revolts, just make sure there's no unfriendly cities whose culture would reach that city if not for its cultural border - esentially, if you take a city buried in enemy culture, vassalize that enemy or take the cities that are doing the burying.

It's also cheaper to NOT conquer every single city. For small enemies, sure, I usually wipe them out, but for large ones, once you've gotten the bulk of their important cities (the capital seems to be important too), they tend to want to capitulate. Let them. Now they fight FOR you, or at least NOT AGAINST you, and you can use their territory as if you'd conquered it (except for upgrading units). Of course, the downside is that only half of a vassal's territory counts as yours for Domination, but that's okay, you'll be conquering them anyway.

OTOH, you could just play on a small map with 18 civs.

And don't sweat losing a few units; you have to at some point, right?

The above is not guaranteed to work in all instances for all people or all playstyles.

 

[Daedal]

I like England/Lizzie for this. Not as overpowered as Rome (so you'll learn something along the way), but still pretty awesome. The trick is to build a huge stack of macemen and wage war with them. Get a stack of them to CR3 and upgrade to Redcoats when you get rifling. Hopefully you can leverage your traits to get a nice tech lead.. CR3 Redcoats vs anything that comes before them is so nasty it almost feels like cheating.