Historical Argument That Was In the Wrong Forum

I belive while the Tutsi are in the power in Rwanda, the genocide never will happens again. But the only way the Tutsi stay in power is by no democratical means. Because Hutus are majority in the society

Sounds like the mentality and way of justifying Government and law of the National Party of South Africa, the Rhodesian Front, or the Southern Democrats in African-American-majority states like Mississippi or South Carolina....
 
Sounds like the mentality and way of justifying Government and law of the National Party of South Africa, the Rhodesian Front, or the Southern Democrats in African-American-majority states like Mississippi or South Carolina....
And we are lucky about Black South Africans don't want revenge against the white minority. South Africa is lucky to have a leader as Nelson Mandela who sponsered the idea of a union with Blacks and Whites as just one country.

Tha same don't happens in Rodhesia (Zimbabwe), where there is discrimination against the white minority.
 
Given our past antagonism, I never thought I'd be agreeing wholeheartedly with a post you'd made, @Ajidica. But, here we are. But a lot has changed in a year or so...
The world changes, and it's always nice to get along with other posters.

That is a serious acusation that I never heard about, please share some source of it.
Propably Paul Kagame kill some Hutus when conquer Kigali, but a reverse genocide is too much.
I'd like to be very careful with this, but I did not say there was a reverse genocide or a double genocide. I said the RPF engaged in mass killings with the intent/effect of removing the Hutu population.
Wiki said:
During the genocide and in the months following the RPF victory, RPF soldiers killed many people, although the number of casualties is disputed. Alison Des Forges was one of the first researchers to conclude that RPF committed atrocities in a systematic fashion that were directed by officers with a high level of authority. She estimated that RPF killed around 30,000 people considered enemies of the Tutsi.[12][227] Some witnesses blamed Kagame himself for ordering killings.[228] After ICTR investigators reportedly discovered two layers of bodies in a mass grave in Kibuye in early 1996—one of Tutsi victims of the genocide and another left by RPF killings of Hutu civilians—further forensic investigations were prohibited by the Rwandan government.[229] French scholar André Guichaoua charged the post-genocide government with deliberate destruction of evidence regarding killings of Hutu in order to avoid prosecution by the ICTR.[230] Some critics have suggested that these crimes should have been prosecuted by the ICTR,[231] or even amounted to genocide under international law.[232][233][234] In contrast, the post-genocide regime maintains that killings by RPF soldiers were perpetrated by undisciplined recruits seeking revenge and that all such transgressions were promptly punished.[235]

The first rumours of RPF killings emerged after 250,000 mostly Hutu refugees streamed into Tanzania at the border crossing of Rusumo on 28 April 1994.[236] The refugees had fled before the Tutsi rebels arrived because they believed the RPF were committing atrocities. A spokesperson for the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) observed that "There's a lot of propaganda by the Government radio aimed at the Hutu" which "makes them feel very anti-Tutsi."[237] After the RPF took control of the border crossing at Rusumo on 30 April,[238] refugees continued to cross the Kagera River, ending up in remote areas of Tanzania.[239] In early May, the UNHCR began hearing concrete accounts of atrocities and made this information public on 17 May.[240][241][242]

After the RPF took power in Rwanda, UNHCR sent a team led by Robert Gersony to investigate the prospects for a speedy return of the nearly two million refugees that had fled Rwanda since April. After interviewing 300 people, Gersony concluded that "clearly systematic murders and persecution of the Hutu population in certain parts of the country" had taken place. Gersony's findings were suppressed by the United Nations.[243] The Gersony Report did not technically exist because Gersony did not complete it,[244] but a summary of an oral presentation of his findings was leaked in 2010.[245][246] Gersony's personal conclusion was that between April and August 1994, the RPF had killed "between 25,000 and 45,000 persons, between 5,000 and 10,000 persons each month from April through July and 5,000 for the month of August."[86] The new authorities categorically denied the allegations of Gersony,[247] details of which leaked to the press.[248] According to an RPA officer, "There was not time to do proper screening. ... We needed a force, and some of those recruited were thieves and criminals. Those people have been responsible for much of our trouble today."[235] In an interview with journalist Stephen Kinzer, Kagame acknowledged that killings had occurred but stated that they were carried out by rogue soldiers and had been impossible to control.[249]

The RPF killings gained international attention with the 1995 Kibeho massacre, in which soldiers opened fire on a camp for internally displaced persons in Butare prefecture.[250] Australian soldiers serving as part of UNAMIR estimated at least 4,000 people were killed,[251] while the Rwandan government claimed that the death toll was 338.[252]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide#Killings_by_the_Rwandan_Patriotic_Front

The Gersony report is an important document due to its proximity to the time of the killings and that he was commission to write the report to support the RPF and demonstrate it was safe for Hutu refugees to return.
 
What the objective of speak against Xi Jinping? Of course is it to lead to a anti-revolution moviment.
The only difference between China and USA, is the China supress it before it starts.

I don't think the censure in China is something wrong. Because want to avoid unrest as the conquer of Capitólio in USA, because if it happens in China, propably the US will aid the rebelds and bring even more unrest.
Still think China good US evil?
 
Yes, I love China. 我爱中国.
Meanwhile I still believe USA is the evil of the planet

Manichaean thinking is something that should fervently be avoided, and is, as a mentality, the source of much ruin, distortion, and unnecessary conflict. I highly suggest you disabuse yourself of this way of viewing the world.
 
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Manichaean thinking is something that should fervently be avoided, and is, as a mentality, the source of much ruin, distortion, and unnecessary conflict. I highly suggest you disabuse yourself of this way of viewing the world.
Okay okay maybe not he evil of the planet, but the good guy they aren't
But I can still loving China? And still beliving China governement is a model of sucess?

If you say Biden sucks! He is evil. You won't be arrested ( although you may be called off by people who like him but hey its their right)
However if you say Xi sucks...

You use the same argument over and over again, but still ignoring my argument about Guantanamo bay...
Have you ever read the Plato's book "The Republic"?
This book also speak against the freedom of speech.
Socrates, in this book, try to figure out how to make the perfect society and says, in a perfect society, we shouldn't allow the poets to say however they want because they can say bad things as "kill your self" or "use drugs". And, if we allow poets in the society, this society don't will be perfect never.
It is a hard choice, says Socrates, but we need to choice if we want a perfect society or not.
 
Okay okay maybe not he evil of the planet, but the good guy they aren't
But I can still loving China? And still beliving China governement is a model of sucess?



You use the same argument over and over again, but still ignoring my argument about Guantanamo bay...
Have you ever read the Plato's book "The Republic"?
This book also speak against the freedom of speech.
Socrates, in this book, try to figure out how to make the perfect society and says, in a perfect society, we shouldn't allow the poets to say however they want because they can say bad things as "kill your self" or "use drugs". And, if we allow poets in the society, this society don't will be perfect never.
It is a hard choice, says Socrates, but we need to choice if we want a perfect society or not.
Here is 5 reasons why America is better than China.
1. Freedom of speech. You don't go to jail for speaking out against government.
2. Better soft power. Hollywood is very influential across the world as nearly every one watches Hollywood films and is very successful. Most Chinese films are bad because of censorship.
3. Better diplomacy- America has more allies than China. In fact most countries around China ( Korea, Japan Vietnam ect) HATES China.
4.(kinda related to 3) almost no censorship. Government doesn't censor media.
5. Almost no human right abuses. US tries not to commit any human right abuses. It isn't perfect but at least you are allowed to call out government if they commit an abuse
 
5. Almost no human right abuses. US tries not to commit any human right abuses. It isn't perfect but at least you are allowed to call out government if they commit an abuse
...Guantanamo bay should disagre with this argument...
1. Freedom of speech. You don't go to jail for speaking out against government.
As I said, freedom of speech isn't an universal value. Just read the Plato's book, the "Republic".


2. Better soft power. Hollywood is very influential across the world as nearly every one watches Hollywood films and is very successful. Most Chinese films are bad because of censorship.
That's a serious argument? I don't watch both. The best cineography industry is Bollywood by far.


3. Better diplomacy- America has more allies than China. In fact most countries around China ( Korea, Japan Vietnam ect) HATES China.
China have better allies, as Brasil, Russia, India (the Brics for short).
USA is just ally with white countries with the same democracy ideology.
 
Guantanamo bay should disagre with this argument...
people DO write and protest about it and they are NOT slienced.
As I said, freedom of speech isn't an universal value. Just read the Plato's book, the "Republic".
Kinda funny about it... you are USING freedom of speech. If America didn't gave you a freedom of speech on the internet you would've been booted out of internet! You HAVE freedom of speech to speak against USA and you are using it. If you are in China you cannot speak against CCP. You can call USA a Demon and monster in any state in America and no FBI will NOT arrest you.
That's a serious argument? I don't watch both. The best cineography industry is Bollywood by far.
you might say that but more people around the world watches Hollywood films than Bollywood films. I mean here in Korea many people are fans of Hollywood films like MCU and Pixar animated films. Heck I can say same for Europe, Japan...
China have better allies, as Brasil, Russia, India (the Brics for short).
LOLZ you series? Brazil is poor. Russia is bankrupted because of recent war and has SERIOUS inflation. India HATES China. (
Meanwhile USA have... Most of G7 as close allies. Most American nations are allies to US, Most of Europs are Allies, Most of South East Asia ( S.Korea Japan ) is close allies. Most Ocarina nations ( Australia & New Zealand) are close friends to US.

seriously you only know one thing and thinks that that is only truth. We Koreans call it "a frog in a well"
 
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Kinda funny about it... you are USING freedom of speech. If America didn't gave you a freedom of speech on the internet you would've been booted out of internet! You HAVE freedom of speech to speak against USA and you are using it. If you are in China you cannot speak against CCP. You can call USA a Demon and monster in any state in America and no FBI will NOT arrest you.
I don't have freedom of speech in this forum, this forum have some rules (some rules that I disagree). I was already censured a thousand times in a lot of threads and even you (Patine and Kupe) have being baned from this forum for while. (me too)

Moderator Action: This is a private forum with an established rule set you agreed to. Please re-read the forum rules concerning PDMA. leif

Brazil is poor.
Brazil isn't poor, please don't forget I'm Brazilian.


India HATES China
I know India and China have some boarders disputes, but they work together in favour of Russia (about Ukranian war) both was neutral in ONU poll about this issue. And the BRICS countries are working together in a lot of fronts, exactly to make front against USA and his Western allies.
 
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I don't have freedom of speech in this forum, this forum have some rules (some rules that I disagree). I was already censured a thousand times in a lot of threads and even you (Patine and Kupe) have being baned from this forum for while. (me too)
so? this is private forum. when you sign up you AGREED to obey the rules of this forum. Do you not have responsibility? Heck even if you go to glossary stores there are rules to not act like jerks or they can ask you to leave. If some insane people threw things around and cause a scene and staff asked them to leave... are they being silenced?
Brazil isn't poor, please don't forget I'm Brazilian.
one word: favela
I know India and China have some boarders disputes, but they work together in favour of Russia

No they don't. India actually works with USA and are close allies with US. In fact India is part of newly created alliances against China called Quad
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrilateral_Security_Dialogue
Why would India join it if it is friends with China.
 
so? this is private forum. when you sign up you AGREED to obey the rules of this forum. Do you not have responsibility? Heck even if you go to glossary stores there are rules to not act like jerks or they can ask you to leave. If some insane people threw things around and cause a scene and staff asked them to leave... are they being silenced?
I do not say to the forum don't need to have rules, I just say I don't have total freedom of speech here.
When I was banned, it was because I was speaking about racial issues, I was not a jerk. But it violated the forum rules "what I disagree".

Moderator Action: If you have an issue with something that happened on this site, you know how to contact me. Please do not post about moderator actions in public forums. leif

one word: favela
I'm also from one favela called K11, I'm happy to live here, I don't see any problem with that.
And Brazil is a powerhouse, the most power country of South America.
 
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I do not say to the forum don't need to have rules, I just say I don't have total freedom of speech here.
When I was banned, it was because I was speaking about racial issues, I was not a jerk. But it violated the forum rules "what I disagree".
well in society there are rules/laws and if you break them you get punished. that is not a lack of freedom. it is called being responsible.
And Brazil is a powerhouse, the most power country of South America.
only cause rest of South America isn't.... great let's be honest. But Brazil is no G7. Heck I'll even say S.Korea and New Zealand is richer than Brazil.
 
only cause rest of South America isn't.... great let's be honest. But Brazil is no G7. Heck I'll even say S.Korea and New Zealand is richer than Brazil.
If we look the GDP list of countries, Brazil is 12th richest country in the world, meanwhile New Zealand is in the 50th position.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)
500px-Nominal_GDP_of_Countries_Crimea_edited.svg.png


well in society there are rules/laws and if you break them you get punished. that is not a lack of freedom. it is called being responsible.
It isn't being responsible, it is lack of freedom of speech. But I'm cool with it, because I believe we don't need to have freedom to speak however we want, it need to have some limits. For example, any country should allow Nazism.
 
If we look the GDP list of countries, Brazil is 12th richest country in the world, meanwhile New Zealand is in the 50th position.
I stand corrected on NZ but South Korea is higher and according to this: https://globalpeoservices.com/top-15-countries-by-gdp-in-2022/
top 10 GDP Nations are pro-America and only 11 and 12 are somewhat Pro China.
It isn't being responsible, it is lack of freedom of speech. But I'm cool with it, because I believe we don't need to have freedom to speak however we want, it need to have some limits. For example, any country should allow Nazism.
I don't get what you are saying?
 
I don't get what you are saying?
First I say about censure in this forum, there is censure it is undeniable. But them I said it isn't a problem for me, because I don't believe we should have all freedom of speech.
In the end I gave an example about governements, they need to never allow freedom of speech if the speaker want to speak about pro-Nazism.

Moderator Action: The forum rules are clear and you agreed to them, please cease the Public Discussion of Moderator Actions. leif
 
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Yes, I love China. 我爱中国.
Meanwhile I still believe USA is the evil of the planet
Thinking the United States is bad and hypocritical does not require you to think China - a nation with many, many problems - is good.
 
Thinking the United States is bad and hypocritical does not require you to think China - a nation with many, many problems - is good.
But I really loves China. I study chinese language, I love history and philosophy of China. I believe the communism of China should be a model for all world how a country should be.
 
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