Homophobia in Russia

[garric]

It's not just about sex though, it's about gays being treated as sub-humans, being abused because of their sexuality.

No one is being abused. They are merely not allowed to get married to another man.

 

[ComradeDavo]

No one is being abused. They are merely not allowed to get married to another man.

Which means they are not treated equally. And the report says...

Meanwhile demonstrators representing nationalist and Orthodox Christian groups chanted anti-gay slogans and shouted abuse.

Eyewitnesses said several foreign gay rights activists were beaten by protesters

which is clearly abuse.

 

[tomsnowman123]

No one is being abused. They are merely not allowed to get married to another man.

This is completely against human rights. How can anyone think it's right to define how someone can not live based on their sexuality? It's not like they can help it.

 

[aussieboy]

There was nothing illegal about those marches. And they were for a cause that is admirable. Don't try to equate gay rights with the civil rights marches, you are only offending African Americans and you're not helping your cause either way.

Jesus Christ in Heaven!!! Gay rights are not my cause. I am against gay marriage, garric. You're preaching to the choir in that respect.

 

[GenMarshall]

That's even worse. The authorities should not have banned the rally. They should have just sent riot police to monitor the situation.

I feel the police should be there to ensure that there are no violence between the demonstrators and the spectators, as well as preventing violcence between demonstrators pro and anti-whatever, and also to prevent demonstrators from rising into a rioting mob.

They are there to keep order, not to suppress people.

 

[aussieboy]

I feel the police should be there to ensure that there are no violence between the demonstrators and the spectators, as well as preventing violcence between demonstrators pro and anti-whatever, and also to prevent demonstrators from rising into a rioting mob.

They are there to keep order, not to suppress people.

That's what I suggested - Keeping in between the two groups, and dispersing it if it gets out of hand.

 

[Lambert Simnel]

Lovely thread. Brings back all my memories of being harassed by the police in Red Square a couple of months ago. (And makes me depressed that I'll have to go back next month...)

 

[CaptainF]

No one is being abused. They are merely not allowed to get married to another man.

Why do you only think of male homosexuals?

I see that a lot in anti-gay rambling. People don't want to see strapping young men in each others' arms, but they are indifferent/apathetic if two photogenic young women want to kiss each other.

 

[Rik Meleet]

Lovely thread. Brings back all my memories of being harassed by the police in Red Square a couple of months ago. (And makes me depressed that I'll have to go back next month...)

That remark came out of thin air. Care to explain it ?

 

[Lambert Simnel]

That remark came out of thin air. Care to explain it ?

Oh, lord. I did post about it here when I got back, but probably only Ram read it.

Basically I was visiting Moscow in February on a business trip and got harassed by the police in Red Square at midnight - they took my passport and made me stand outside the Kremlin for an hour or two. I think they thought I was cottaging* outside Lenin's Tomb, but, what with their English, and my Russian, I never found out. All in all, they were probably just looking for a bribe, but I was very reluctant to make the first move on that front when I hadn't actually done anything wrong.

The levels of intolerance suggested by some of our Russian posters here reinforce my impression of this as being a socially backward nation.

* i.e. soliciting for gay sex. An interpretation of events offered by one of our auditors, and much better than the truth.

 

[GenMarshall]

Meanwhile demonstrators representing nationalist and Orthodox Christian groups chanted anti-gay slogans and shouted abuse

Hmm, this is something to ask our Eastern Orthodox bretherans about this issue. I know Roman Catholics dont allow same-gender marrages but Catholics are suppost to accept homosexuals as individuals and avoid any unjust discrimination against them.

This is something interesting to look into since I dont know what the Eastern Orthodoxy belief on homosexuality would be. I know that they are against same-gender marrages.

 

[ironduck]

Sure, Russia doesn't have the influence of the USA, but it is still one of the more influential nations of the world. In the G8 council, I doubt that France, Germany, Japan, or the other countries have more power and influence compared to Russia.

Wrong again.

Russia is a shadow of the Soviet Union. They were accepted into the former G7 (now G8) in 1997 as a reward for not resisting the expansion of NATO too much. They are not even a member of the real G7, only of the G8 which is really 'G7+Russia', which doesn't include all meetings, and they are the smallest economy of the G8 club.

http://usinfo.state.gov/ei/economic_issues/group_of_8.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G8

 

[Fox Mccloud]

I'm pretty sure Russia is bigger that Japan or France, even if they are just a shadow of the USSR.

 

[SuperBeaverInc.]

I'm pretty sure Russia is bigger that Japan or France, even if they are just a shadow of the USSR.

Nope

GDP of G8 countries (2005)

Canada - $1.023 trillion
France - $2.068 trillion
Germany - $2.764 trillion
Italy - $1.694 trillion
Japan - $4.848 trillion
Russia - $740.7 billion
United Kingdom - $2.218 trillion
United States - $12.47 trillion

 

[Fox Mccloud]

Russia's economy is growing very fast, though, at about 6.5% a year, if I recall correctly. It has more potential then most of those countries. Give it time.

 

[warpus]

What does Russia's GDP have to do with homosexuality?

 

[Favorius]

What I have seen in all 6 pages of discussion is different views of different cultures in conflict. Russian perceptions are a lot different different that Western perceptions. I think a Russian actually will support basic human and civil rights but to an extent. They are not ready to grant gay rights. This is similar with here. Our society is not ready for such a commitment too, whether they do not see homosexiality as a normal phenomenon due to their religious beliefs or cultural background.
I support homosexuality but not because of human rights stuff: it is simple maths, if we allow gays to have their freedom, then competiton for girls will be easier because number of real man will decline. Horray! (just kidding)

 

[Shaihulud]

Russia has nukes, large army and oil, therefore its in a league of its own. Noone will make Russia do what they don't want, so just admit it "Russia is a Homophobic country", i don't see why the resident russians on this forum try to argue against this fact. Then say "Russia is an intolerant country", undeniable because surely a large portion of their citizens, the gays are denied their due rights and are discriminated against. DOn't worry because noone will do a thing.

 

[AndyTerry]

What's there to imagine? Around 4-10% of the planet's population is homosexual - there are bound to be gay cops, teachers, politicians, priests, etc.

Not in Russia. Teachers - yes (my friend had one in his school), politicians - yes, singers - of course. But priests and cops - no. In Russia - no.

 

[AndyTerry]

Toleration doesn't mean that I have to support it. I can tolerate gays having sex, they can do what they want. When gays try to change my country that's when I draw the line. It's not intolerance, it's having my own beliefs.

I agree here