How to deal with former Communist agents

I think the time to have made this move was during the change of government when the Eastern Bloc collapsed, not now.

I agree, I said it's too late for that now. But it always upsets me when I see that these rats live a perfectly pleasant lives now and pretend that it's all in the past and they've moved on, while the former dissidents who struggled for years barely make a living.

Yeah, justice alá Czech Rep. - the bastards get away, the victims are forgotten and nobody cares anymore.
 
You consider spying on your friends and colleagues a small crime? Do you have any idea how you ended up if the regime decided you were a threat?

Well I never lived under communism, but something tells me you didn't want to be the guy that didn't snitch either.

The real question is, should a person be punished for putting their and their families lives above others in a horrible government system forced upon them?

As for myself I think you should just let bygones be bygones, but then again it's also easy for me to say that.
 
Well I never lived under communism, but something tells me you didn't want to be the guy that didn't snitch either.

The real question is, should a person be punished for putting their and their families lives above others in a horrible government system forced upon them?

As for myself I think you should just let bygones be bygones, but then again it's also easy for me to say that.

OK, one more time:

95% of the informers were not some poor fathers who didn't have any choice but to spy on their friends in order to save their families. They were people who just didn't give a damn about other people - in fact they were the only real entrepreneurs in a communist system :crazyeye:

It was perfectly doable to stay under regime's radar, without snitching, spying and ratting people out. There were 3 sorts of people in Communist Eastern bloc:

- the proponents of the regime, the party leaders, agents etc., simply put those who wanted to preserve the regime and who were responsible for its crimes,
- the indifferent majority of people who just wanted to survive and preferably have as good a life as staying uninvolved in the politics allowed them,
- the dissidents, who wanted to bring the regime down and who were paying the price.

I am targeting the first sort.
 
Winner, I don't think anyone is bothered by the idea of going after the worst offenders - leaders of the regime, those who put the policies in place and those who carried them out, ie, the secret police themselves. But the big problem with going after the bulk of the informants, even if the vast majority were as opportunistic as you say - and I tend to doubt that, I would imagine that more people informed out of fear than you are letting on - is a logistical nightmare.

It's simply not possible to punish that many people, and even if it were, I imagine that most of the worst offenders were probably never kept on any sort of filing system. What's the point of having secret informants, if you put their name in four different files, and triplicate the lot of them? And for that matter, I sincerely doubt that 5% of the population, or whatever it was in Czechia, is just going to lay down and let themselves be sent to prison or forced labour camps. Even the hint that harsh punishment is coming their way will cause a mass exodus, riots, or likely both. And that's leaving aside the legal considerations completely.

I agree with Arwon's suggestion of a Truth and Rconciliation Commission, a la South Africa. It may not be pretty, but amnesty to all but the absolute worst offenders is about the best that can be achieved, and it's far better to admit the wrongdoings of the past and mose on, than to launch a mad crusade of vengeance against the wrongdoers. Do that, and you're likely to fall right back into some other form of "-ism."
 
Ahh, that's not how it worked. StB was't running around forcing random people to report on their neigbours. The informants were usually ardent communists who were more than happy to help the party by ratting out "traitors", "imperialist agents", "counter-revolutionary elements" etc.
and
I am talking about people who willingly cooperated with the secret police and reported on people they knew - simply put, spineless opportunists who didn't give a damn about what would happen to the people they gave out, they only cared about their reward.

It seems here you are describing 2 distinct motivations here. There are those who did what they did because they believed in the communist system, and those who did it for personal gain. While the second group sound pretty reprehensible to me, the first group are harder to criticize. The secret police was seen as necessary by most communist theorists (including Marx?) so I would find it hard to punish these people. To distinguish legally between the people who did it for personal gain and communist belief would seem impossible.
 
I have a wonderful solution:
In 10 to 20 years time execute anyone who was born under communist regime in former commie countries.
This is great for several reasons.
- In 10-20 years there will be enough people to fill in the gaps once you shoot the older generation. High-end specialists can come from pure capitalist countries.
- This lowers the chances of anyone ever even thinking that communism was a good period in a country's history and thus wanting it back or speaking it its defence. You'd win in every ideological battle from then onwards!
- All traitors are naturally punished.
- New generation of ideologically cleansed people with the right set of mind can be bread without any stupid old influences.

On a serious note, this article looks like a desperate fight to cleanse the divided crew on an alreday sinking ship. Get over ideology and self-importance of being the last crusader, start plugging those holes!
 
That doesn't sound very practical. ):
 
But it would fulfill need for justice for some people and ensure the defeat of communism!!! What are a few million lives compared to the glory of anti-commie crusade!
 
Completely off topic, but Gelion, your avatar and sig are awesome. Just watched The Fall of Centauri Prime today. Or yesterday now.
 
Completely off topic, but Gelion, your avatar and sig are awesome. Just watched The Fall of Centauri Prime today. Or yesterday now.

Thanks! Don't know if you noticed, but I even talk like some characters. I hahve th show in my blood.
 
Thanks! Don't know if you noticed, but I even talk like some characters. I hahve th show in my blood.
I'd notice if you started a post with: "Millions of years ago, the First Ones walked among us."
 
and
It seems here you are describing 2 distinct motivations here. There are those who did what they did because they believed in the communist system, and those who did it for personal gain. While the second group sound pretty reprehensible to me, the first group are harder to criticize. The secret police was seen as necessary by most communist theorists (including Marx?) so I would find it hard to punish these people. To distinguish legally between the people who did it for personal gain and communist belief would seem impossible.

As I said earlier I don't think punishing everybody who worked as an informant is the best answer. But I completely disagree with the above.

Just because one may believe in a criminal ideology we should not forgive them for commiting imoral acts. This goes for the nazis as it does for the communists, and other sociopathic ideologies as well.
 
Back
Top Bottom