How would you change history?

[Azale]

FWIW, Robert Service concludes in his biography of Trotsky that many similar policies would have been implemented concerning the economy and such, but that the USSR would have dodged the megalomaniacal killing sprees and state terror that characterized Stalin's reign. After all, Stalin adopted the policies promoted by most of his opponents, including Trotsky, once he had successfully eliminated them or removed them from power and respectability.

How respectable a writer is Service? What should I buy, avoid, look out for?

 

[Terxpahseyton]

I'd kill Wilhelm II and make Friedrich III. live 50 years longer.
IMO one of the best ways to try to prevent WWI with as little effort as possible (and as a pleasant side-effect it would give Germany the chance of a more glorious history).
But even if it just prolonged some great war I am curious how this had changed history.

 

[Uncle Anton]

Is this your paternal grandmother?

Where is your Y chromosome going to come from, then?

Dude, I'm pretty sure Sharwood was just making a Futurama joke - to which I lawl'd. I wouldn't read too much into it.

 

[Lord Baal]

Is this your paternal grandmother?

Where is your Y chromosome going to come from, then?

If you don't get a Futurama reference, you don't belong on the interwebs.

 

[ParkCungHee]

I'd kill Wilhelm II and make Friedrich III. live 50 years longer.
IMO one of the best ways to try to prevent WWI with as little effort as possible (and as a pleasant side-effect it would give Germany the chance of a more glorious history).

More importantly, this would mean we'd have had a cure for cancer for the past 120 years.

 

[Lord Baal]

More importantly, this would mean we'd have had a cure for cancer for the past 120 years.

What you talkin' 'bout, Willis?

 

[ParkCungHee]

Friedrich III died of throat cancer. If you went back in time to fix that, even if we still had a world war, at least we got that fixed.

Also, if Friedrich III is going to live to be 107, it seems cruel an unncecesary to kill Willie, since I can't imagine he'd do much damage if he were allowed to live.

 

[Lord Baal]

Friedrich III died of throat cancer. If you went back in time to fix that, even if we still had a world war, at least we got that fixed.

Also, if Friedrich III is going to live to be 107, it seems cruel an unncecesary to kill Willie, since I can't imagine he'd do much damage if he were allowed to live.

Maybe SiLL's plan was simply to stop him contracting throat cancer?

 

[ParkCungHee]

A vaccine for cancer would be even better!

 

[LightSpectra]

What would Friedrich have done to prevent WWI that Wilhelm didn't?

Perhaps successfully attain the coveted Anglo-German alliance, but you still have that messy issue of French revanchism, as well as the love triangle between Germany, Austria-Hungary and Russia. I maintain that the war was inevitable (not in a deterministic sense, but in a political one).

 

[Lord Baal]

What would Friedrich have done to prevent WWI that Wilhelm didn't?

Perhaps successfully attain the coveted Anglo-German alliance, but you still have that messy issue of French revanchism, as well as the love triangle between Germany, Austria-Hungary and Russia. I maintain that the war was inevitable (not in a deterministic sense, but in a political one).

And you'd be wrong. The War was actually a pretty startling result of an unexpected chain of events. Not the least of which was Wilhelm's incredibly piss-poor diplomacy.

 

[LightSpectra]

And you'd be wrong. The War was actually a pretty startling result of an unexpected chain of events. Not the least of which was Wilhelm's incredibly piss-poor diplomacy.

He had an unconditional alliance with Austria-Hungary, and (much of) Britain and France were eager to go to war. Wilhelm was rather locked in place. The one thing that you could poke him about would be the expiration of the non-aggression pact with Russia, though given what Wilhelm knew at the time, I don't think it was a bad decision sans foresight.

As I already said, perhaps Friedrich could've won an Anglo-German alliance, though as I said before, the other political voids are still there.

 

[Lord Baal]

He had an unconditional alliance with Austria-Hungary, and (much of) Britain and France were eager to go to war. Wilhelm was rather locked in place. The one thing that you could poke him about would be the expiration of the non-aggression pact with Russia, though given what Wilhelm knew at the time, I don't think it was a bad decision sans foresight.

As I already said, perhaps Friedrich could've won an Anglo-German alliance, though as I said before, the other political voids are still there.

You could also poke him for having such a horrendously bad foreign policy overall, which seemed almost designed to antagonise Britain, despite the fact they wanted it as an ally. As for the alliance with Austria-Hungary, he should have used it to bully Austria-Hungary into not acting so stupidly with regards to Serbia. Germany backed itself into a corner; it wasn't pushed there by France, Russia, Austria-Hungary or anyone else.

 

[ParkCungHee]

If we're going to be poking him, I'd mention the fact that he let the Dreikaiserbund, which effectively made general war unlikely, lapse.

 

[LightSpectra]

You could also poke him for having such a horrendously bad foreign policy overall, which seemed almost designed to antagonise Britain, despite the fact they wanted it as an ally.

I've already conceded this point. Wilhelm mistakenly thought that Britain would want to take Germany as its ally to avoid naval cold war. That's the most significant reason Britain joined the Entente.

As for the alliance with Austria-Hungary, he should have used it to bully Austria-Hungary into not acting so stupidly with regards to Serbia. Germany backed itself into a corner; it wasn't pushed there by France, Russia, Austria-Hungary or anyone else.

I don't think they did act so stupidly with Serbia. The Austro-Hungarian royal heir was assassinated on behalf of the Serbian government -- that's about as serious a diplomatic crisis as you can get. Perhaps you could criticize Bismarck for establishing the unconditional alliance, being that the Balkans were dangerously unstable. Wilhelm vainly tried to prevent outbreak of war, because he was well aware of the consequences of the alliance webs in Europe. Hence the Willy-Nicky correspondence.

If we're going to be poking him, I'd mention the fact that he let the Dreikaiserbund, which effectively made general war unlikely, lapse.

Dreikaiserabkommen. Yes, well, I would blame Nicholas II for this more than Wilhelm. Pursuing pan-slavism knowing it would antagonize the most powerful nation in the world was a rather poor choice. I mean, what was Wilhelm supposed to do? If he had sided with Russia against Austria, then that would've just pushed Britain further away.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

Dude, I'm pretty sure Sharwood was just making a Futurama joke - to which I lawl'd. I wouldn't read too much into it.

If you don't get a Futurama reference, you don't belong on the interwebs.

I am insulted that you all think I didn't get the reference; that is one of my favorite episodes.

But - the question still remains, where did Fry get his Y chromosome? It is one of the great ontological paradoxes (along with the origins of Marty McFly's first name and CMOT Dibbler's catchphrase.)

(Hey, "catchphrase" has 6 consecutive consonants! I don't know if it is normally spelled as one word though, but it should be . . .)

 

[Dachs]

He had an unconditional alliance with Austria-Hungary, and (much of) Britain and France were eager to go to war. Wilhelm was rather locked in place. The one thing that you could poke him about would be the expiration of the non-aggression pact with Russia, though given what Wilhelm knew at the time, I don't think it was a bad decision sans foresight.

The alliance with Austria-Hungary was nothing if not conditional. Also on the subject of public opinion and "eagerness for war" I suggest Strachan, The First World War Part 1: To Arms, which contains a better summary of the relevant scholarship on the subject - needless to say, as lukewarm as world opinion (insofar as such a beast exists) was on the subject of fighting a war in July and August 1914, the same can hardly be applied to world opinion in 1888.

 

[trickofthehand]

How to change history... the trick would be to alter history so that the Germans completely crush Russia during WW2 (as they were very well doing until it got cold and Hitler got dumb) but are still snarled up enough to not be able to dedicate all of their forces to the western front. Then with Russia in complete disarray after WW2, America scoops up all, and not just part, of the brilliant german scientific community. With no communists to challenge US foreign interests, the US vassalizes war-torn Europe, puts a man on the moon in 1955, crushes the fledgling communist government of North Korea, enjoys a wonderful partnership with a democratic China, and assumes leadership of a one world government by 2005.

Unabashed, unapologetic and unrelenting American Imperialism. Too bad this is just a 'what if' scenario and not reality.

 

[Phrossack]

But if we conquered the world and in doing so fulfilled the ultimate goal of all nations, there would be nothing left to accomplish and life would become meaningless.:suicide:

 

[bestrfcplayer]

It would be interesting to see Germany conquer Russia. How the world would change!


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