Immortal Minimalism, Chapter I - Hatshepsut

[futurehermit]

I agree that the corncow city should have been placed 1 NE. Good start so far though. Unfortunate that you're playing Hatty, have horses, but can't go to war.

 

[Um the Muse]

More on grammar

Spoiler :

Ok, after reading all this again this morning, with a fresher mind, I come up with few other examples

Go practice to get better (at it)
Go train in order to be able to win

or

You have to practice to get better (at it)
You have to train to win

are those sentences correct?

If so, I think I got it a bit. yatta!

Yep, those sentences are right.

I'm a bit confused about what the word "practice" is in the first two cases : _noun_ or _gerund_ (without -ing)?
No big deal of course, as long as I got the sentence syntax correctly.

Yeah, it really doesn't matter. On the other hand, it got me a little curious, so I looked it up. Yes, I looked up the word "go" I was surprised by all the many definitions that it has. The definition that seemed to come closest is using the verb as an intensifier, I think. In that case, it doesn't actually mean anything, you're just trying to emphasize your command. Btw, I could be wrong, but I believe that you can only use this on commands (Go+verb, without the "to") and that it technically becomes a "compound verb," or a verb that is made up of multiple words.

@all: Reply only if you have some free time to spend and you would like to further discuss the subject. I mean, egoistically speaking, I hope so: it is useful for me to know better, but I don't wish to be annoying.

No problem. Getting this stuff is helpful for me, too, since I'm thinking about teaching English in foreign countries anyway.

@Um the Muse:Thinking about my previous reply, I hope it didn't sound rude.

No problem. I didn't really understand the joke, since I didn't even think about using the site for lessons; I really just thought of it as a reference site. You know, like you'd use Google, a dictionary or something to look something up. I'm not big on organized lesson plans either, as long as you've got some of the basics down.

So far I'm fine with just the excellent explications and tips from you guys.

Explications is a fine word, but it's not very common. A native speaker would probably use "explanation."

I mean, if someone find an error in my writings, and has some time to help, either dropping a couple of lines about it or giving a full explanation on the subject (as you excellently did), is very useful, welcome and appreciated. That's it!

Another word that is perfectly alright but a little weird sounding: "Writings" is a little awkward. A better way of saying it is something like, "If I make a spelling or grammar mistake, please don't hesitate to correct me." Writings usually refers to a collection of works. I suppose a series of posts could be considered a collection, but it's definitely going to stick out.

Oh, one last word that is alright to use but is uncommon: "definitively" vs. "definitely." Use the second one. "Definitively" is actually more like completeness, "the definitive works of Shakespeare," vs. "these are definitely all of Shakespeare's works."

On the "Greetings, Yatta" thing, I thought it was cute, but if you're trying to get better, you should probably know that a greeting is a way of starting a conversation, not ending it. The only ending I've seen on these message boards is, "cheers!" which, I think, is a British thing.

 

[yatta77]

I agree that the corncow city should have been placed 1 NE. Good start so far though. Unfortunate that you're playing Hatty, have horses, but can't go to war.

Murphy's Law always applies. In Civ IV it applies more.

Spoiler :

like 2 horses and 3 irons, when all you need is a copper
(for space ship components)

More on grammar

Thanks! I noted everything. Appreciated.

Spoiler :

By the way, a personal note on on-line tools, in case this might be somehow useful to your students in your (future) teacher job:
+ a spell-checker might be useful to improve the orthography;
+ an on-line dictionary might help when reading an unknown word;
+ a search engine, to search the meaning of a specific sentence, might be useful too.
- No matter how poor the grammar, lexicon and syntax might be, a "written from scratch" text is, always, understandable way better than an "on-line translated then retouched" one. And you can easily tell the difference.
ehm... cheers!

---

Session 3, turn 85, 750BC

Mansa Musa was first to alphabet for just 2 turns

Spoiler :

This is what we got for alphabet from Asoka

Spoiler :

Mansa is teaching like crazy (was someone doubting it?): 7 turns to Aesthetics, while I'm 22 turns away (and I need that Great Library). Look at all that beautiful Iron! Right where I was planning my next cities!

Spoiler :

Oh, well. Montezuma showed up (can you see the little scout?). And he is already annoyed for opening borders to Mansa and Asoka. Considering that: (a) Mansa missed defending my cities from barbarians, and (b) I have only domestic trade routes at the moment, this is a bit too ironic.
My plan was to start 3 settlers next. I fear it is a bit too risky now. I stop here, I have to think about it.

Spoiler :

Thebes (worker >> warrior >> warrior >> started Pyramids >> at Pop 5 settler >> Pyramids >> library >> at Pop 5 worker >> worker >> settler?)

Spoiler :

Memphis (settler >> library >> at Pop 3 settler?)

Spoiler :

Heliopolis (library >> warrior >> at Pop 2 settler?)

Spoiler :

Totals: Cities 3; Workers 3; Warriors 4.
I didn't trigger a revolution to representation and/or slavery yet.

---

I might play (and post) another quick session later tonight.

 

[Mylene]

Monty isn't annoyed from the open borders, it's cos of tech trades
Only techs can result in "you traded with our worst enemies".

Any other trades like open borders, ressources etc. can just lead to "you refused to stop..." if you tell him to shove it
Oh and almost forgot, only the one worst enemy matters for this. You can trade as much as you want with the others, even if he should be furious towards them it doesn't matter.

 

[yatta77]

Monty isn't annoyed from the open borders, it's cos of tech trades
Only techs can result in "you traded with our worst enemies".

Any other trades like open borders, ressources etc. can just lead to "you refused to stop..." if you tell him to shove it
Oh and almost forgot, only the one worst enemy matters for this. You can trade as much as you want with the others, even if he should be furious towards them it doesn't matter.

Ah... Thanks. I forgot the Tech trade with Asoka! How silly, I was talking about it just before.
Any advice? I have Masonry and another cheap tech he doesn't have, I was thinking if gifting them might help to bring him a bit closer to "cautious"...
...or maybe close the borders to Mansa and/or Asoka?
(edit: whichever is worst enemy, I guess Asoka for sure, Mansa maybe...)

 

[Dhoomstriker]

What does the F4 -> GLANCE screen show? Does anyone treat Monte as their Worst Enemy? If yes, then gifting things to Monte may just end up angering someone else. If no, then sure, gift him a tech or two and then continue with your expansion plans (although you might want a couple of more units to spawn-bust before sending Settlers into the unknown).


You actually can get a "You Traded with our Worst Enemy" penalty from Opening Borders with an AI, but you're unlikely to see that situation in this game. In order for it to happen, you must have 10 more Cities than an AI's Worst Enemy, followed by Opening Borders with their Worst Enemy. Then you'll see a -1 "You Traded with our Worst Enemy" penalty, but it is a pretty rare occurrence to have happen.

 

[Um the Muse]

@Dhoomstriker: 10 more what? Cities?
I think I've gotten this penalty in a no tech trades allowed game. Can you get it from trading maps? A lot of the nuts and bolts of diplomacy is so arcane!

 

[Optical]

This looks interesting, will be, er, lurking this.

Going into lurk mode... now.

 

[yatta77]

Thanks to Mylene and Dhoomstriker for correctly pointing out where the penalty is from: trading technologies rather than opening borders.

Since the turn Montezuma showed up (which is the last turn at the moment) I just toke few screen shots and saved the game, in my previous post I couldn't be more precise on the "who is worst enemy of who" issue.

I'm reopening the save only now, just to take few more screen shots.

Spoiler :

What does the F4 -> GLANCE screen show? Does anyone treat Monte as their Worst Enemy? If yes, then gifting things to Monte may just end up angering someone else. If no, then sure, gift him a tech or two and then continue with your expansion plans (although you might want a couple of more units to spawn-bust before sending Settlers into the unknown).

Thanks for confirming my idea might have some merit.
Asoka is Montezuma('s) worst enemy. Right now Montezuma is the Worst Enemy of nobody.
Of course, gifting a/few technology/ies to Montezuma, still might be an issue if one/some of the other Civilization/s, unknown at the moment, will pick Montezuma as worst enemy.

On the unescorted settlers issue, they are not really being sent in the unknown: all the next 3 cities are 2-3 tiles away from the capital and inside the actual cultural borders (see last post screen shots).
That said, each of them will be escorted by a military unit, also to garrison the city.

By the way, this is a case where Archery would be a welcome technology: now I'm undecided, to garrison the cities, between training:
(a) warriors (15, 2, +25% city, +25% fortify, (+50% hill in the northern city); or
(b) war chariots (30, 5, more mobility, stronger attacking, no defensive bonuses).
For example: if attacked by a barbarian spearman, which one would defend better?

I guess I'll end up with a warrior each city plus a couple of war chariots in the (central) capital ready to move anywhere.

If someone wonders why I didn't yet switched to representation with the spiritual trait (no anarchy): as soon as my capital is ready to gain a citizen, or I will run a scientist somewhere, I will; but until then, since representation (medium) won't give me any advantage at the moment, I'll stick with the maintenance cheaper despotism (low). Probably it doesn't make any difference in the maintenance costs of this so small empire, but you never know.

This looks interesting

Thanks

---
I'm playing the next session later, tonight. Other comments or advice on my next moves?

 

[yatta77]

Spoiler :

I exist, you exist, and Chuck Norris exists. However, some say Chuck Norris dosen't exist.

Spoiler :

Chuck Norris can switch between "exist", "exists" and "doesn't exist" at his own will.
And without facing any anarchy: Chuck Norris always runs chucknorrisism.
If not existing, Chuck Norris is.
When existing, Chuck Norris can prove he doesn't exist.
When not existing, he can prove his existence.
Chuck Norris can also, obviously, exist and don't exist at the same time, if he wishes to.
And be careful: Chuck Norris knows what you just posted.

---

Session 4, turn 91, 600BC

The 3 settlers plan was confirmed. Masonry was gifted to Montezuma, with positive results: he went cautious.

Spoiler :

And accepted a nice technology trade deal.

Spoiler :

Open borders in the next turn.

Spoiler :

As well as another technology trade: archers and granaries are possible now.

Spoiler :

Mansa discovered Aesthetics.

Spoiler :

Asoka doesn't complain.

Spoiler :

Obviously, all good things come to an end.

Spoiler :

Oh well, Murphy's Law, same old, Huayna Capac is annoyed from the trades to Mansa Musa.

Spoiler :

And now Asoka and Mansa Musa picked Montezuma as worst enemy: you know what?

Spoiler :

All this hate might also be positive in the end; managing to stay out of wars, of course.

Spoiler :

A little gift to Huayna Capac to boost diplomatic relations?
(he is nobody's worst enemy at the moment).

Spoiler :

End session is here. I have to meditate about it. Any thought?
I might play a bit more later tonight.

 

[yatta77]

Yep, here I am with another short session.
(sorry, I don't have too much free time to play it, and I play quite slow anyways (and my PC too btw): I need to think and ponder, if I want to have a chance to win in this way on immortal. By the way, and I'm just wondering, not complaining here: is anyone still interested in this series?)
---

Session 4, turn 98, 425BC
(first attempt, no cheats, no reloads, screen shoots in the spoilers).
I'll better win this game.

Checking out the map portion the warrior exploring the south unveiled, it was decided to switch the southern city position from ironriver to IRONCOW to include in the city('s) fat cross those cows.



As planned, here a little gift to Huayna Capac: Priesthood.



Huayna Capac is cautious now. Nice, let's open borders.



They are not technology trade deals possible with writing.



Here the glance: all + for Hatshepsut!



The turn Thebes trained the settler, the exploring warrior, in his last step, discovered 2 fishes in the south.



The city positioning plans changed again: IronFish and CowHorse will be founded.



Thebes next will build a granary.
(worker >> warrior >> warrior >> started Pyramids >> at Pop 5 settler >> Pyramids >> library >> at Pop 6 worker >> worker >> settler >> granary)



Huayna Capac is ready now to trade technologies: monotheism and sailing are in for the alphabet.



The technology screen: pretty good so far, huh?



Same as the glance screen. Still 2 pleased, 2 cautious, and all +



A quick look to the empire map.



Elephantine (CowHorse) is founded: let's make a library here as well.



A quick technology trade with Montezuma: Meditation is, Monotheism out. There are not religions in my cities, and it's not planned to adopt a state religion, so this is not really a breaking news in Egypt.



But the technologies screen looks even better.



No Montezuma, Egypt won't stop trading with Asoka.



And yes Montezuma, Egypt knows this doesn't make you happy. Please forgive.



Mansa discovered monarchy, and is already researching currency. As long as it is not literature, that's fine.



The settler from Memphis was ready, next a worker: with all those new cities, a fourth worker is definitely() needed!
(settler >> library >> at Pop 3 settler >> worker)
A bit of micro to give the cows to Heliopolis.



And hurry up a bit the next settler.



Glance: +2, +2, +2, and +4 for Montezuma: he is not so mad after all.



Granary ready in Thebes: next archer >> archer >> build research
(worker >> warrior >> warrior >> started Pyramids >> at Pop 5 settler >> Pyramids >> library >> at Pop 6 worker >> worker >> settler >> granary >> archer >> archer >> research)



Quick Civ IV mastery test: What did I miss to do here?

Spoiler :

spiritual + pyramids: a quick switch to police state to save few hammers and one turn on those archers.
I built the 'mids for _nothing_ so far!

Two new pastures ready in Elephantine.



The settler from Memphis finally arrived to IronFish.



And founded Alexandria: workboat >> library the building queue.



The settler from Heliopolis is ready: next a granary.
(library >> warrior >> at Pop 2 settler >> granary)



A quick look to the Egyptian empire.



And here the session ends, 3 turns from discovering Aesthetics, and with the settler from Heliopolis ready to found IronWood in the next turn.



---

Comments?

 

[vranasm]

well this game will be painful for you... being peaceful with the MM $#@#$ will really hurt you once he starts to skyrocket in techs as he certainly know (if I were playing this game I certainly would slowly start sharpening my knifes and guns for cuirs/cavs ).

You have to hope that Monty will decide his rolls on him instead of you.

One personal remark about the reports. Since you decided to run it as your personal venture I would think that going with unspoilered pictures could be better for me as a reader. But that is mine opinion... others may differ.

 

[yatta77]

well this game will be painful for you... being peaceful with the MM $#@#$ will really hurt you once he starts to skyrocket in techs as he certainly know (if I were playing this game I certainly would slowly start sharpening my knifes and guns for cuirs/cavs ).

You have to hope that Monty will decide his rolls on him instead of you.

Yeah... I hope I can manage diplomatically to have Montezuma messing up somewhere else. Cautious at +4 doesn't really mean anything yet, but it is a start.

One personal remark about the reports. Since you decided to run it as your personal venture I would think that going with unspoilered pictures could be better for me as a reader. But that is mine opinion... others may differ.

Good call! I'll fix that.

 

[Um the Muse]

I'm a little confused at Elephantine: why did you decide against building on the coast for Elephantine? Where you built it will permanently block the clams. That's ok. But not building on the coast will keep you from having a coastal production city, and you'll never want to use many of the tiles in the city since you'll never have a lighthouse there. I thought it was to borrow food from the capital, but then you didn't do that either.
Good job keeping up in techs btw. Once you steal metal casting, the world is your oyster

 

[yatta77]

I'm a little confused at Elephantine: why did you decide against building on the coast for Elephantine? Where you built it will permanently block the clams. That's ok. But not building on the coast will keep you from having a coastal production city, and you'll never want to use many of the tiles in the city since you'll never have a lighthouse there. I thought it was to borrow food from the capital, but then you didn't do that either.
Good job keeping up in techs btw. Once you steal metal casting, the world is your oyster

You ought to be (confused)! It toke me 5 minutes to click on that "settle" icon!

To grab clams + cow in the fat cross, the only option I had was to settle on the horses. I gave up on clams in order to gain the production of the horses + the 4 hammers hill (2w from the city).

I decided so considering the desperate need of hammers in building space components. And the fact that I have no copper. I lost the space race in the IU game #55 from a lack of hammers (and distract playing in the last turns), no matter if I discovered fusion an eternity earlier than all the other AIs!

Water tiles doesn't give hammers. The Maoi Statues will be built in Alexandria (2 fishes + iron), which, btw, will also train a workboat for those clams (just to gain an health resource). And the dikes are not Egyptian.

I talked a bit about this kind of quite unusual city placement also few posts above, discussing the choices for the two northern cities.

Another example on something you might wonder: I'm probably going to build a fort instead of a plantation on the silk, this in order to build a lumbermill later; as well once the ivory gets obsolete, I'll build workshops there.

If I was going for culture, I would chose differently. I'm giving up on many commerce tiles in order to gain production in the end game. That's why in the beginning I pointed out to don't take this too much as an example of a generic gameplay: this game is all about colonizing Alpha Centauri with 6-8 cities (taking many risks, btw), and if I'll miss that, no plan "B".

---

Here another quick session I played tonight.

Session 6, turn 107, 200BC

Ok, think, meditate, ponder... Hatshepsut is not phi after all.
With 3 turns left to aesthetics, and 24 turns needed for the great engineer, the Great Library will be built already when the great engineer will be born (if phi, the great engineer would born this turn).



But Hatshepsut is spi! So yep, time for the first no-anarchy revolution: representation.



For 6 scientists, in both Memphis and Thebes.



The settler founded the ironwood city: Pi-Ramses.



Pi-Ramses starts building a library.



Thebes finished training the archers, it's time to build research and run two scientists: 6 turns to the first great person, this looks better, huh?



Glance: so far, so good.



350BC: aesthetics already in, literature will be in 6 turns. An overview of Egypt.



The AIs discovered mathematics and currency, besides monarchy and metal casting: no big deal with that, we'll catch up soon I believe.



Here it is! Deal with Huayna Capac: mathematics in for aesthetics.



Buddhism spreads in Thebes and Memphis.
First great person: a great engineer, like it was supposed (in %) to be! Yay!
A bit of micro to get literature one turn earlier: this is Thebes.



And this is Memphis. The Worker is ready: the next task is one turn building research.



Elephantine finished up with the library: it's time to build a granary.
(library >> granary)



Montezuma unveiled the mysteries of horseback riding: here the techs screen.



250BC: literature in, the great engineer hurries the Great Library in Thebes.
Heliopolis finished the granary and started building research.
(library >> warrior >> at Pop 2 settler >> granary >> research)



Memphis stops building research and running scientists: it's time to build a granary here too.
(settler >> library >> at Pop 3 settler >> worker >> research >> granary)



Buddhism spreads in Heliopolis.
Done with the Great Library, Thebes is building the National Epic now.
(worker >> warrior >> warrior >> started Pyramids >> at Pop 5 settler >> Pyramids >> library >> at Pop 6 worker >> worker >> settler >> granary >> archer >> archer >> research >> Great Library (GE Hurry) >> National Epic)



Tech situation: Egypt has the monopoly on literature.
Asoka and Mansa discovered the calendar.



Heliopolis reached size 3, Pi-Ramses is size 2: some micro has to be done up there.
And Montezuma still cautious... I stop here for now.



---

Two doubts I have:

1. How many great engineers are needed for the Hoover (3 some stuff in Civ 4) Dam?

2. With 4 warrior and 2 archers, and (if I remember the last glance correctly: Mansa PL+2; Asoka PL+2; Capac CA+2; Monty CA+2) all the time, what is the % of being attacked in say the next 100 turns?
Is there an easy formula to calculate it?
I'm wondering how risky would be to don't build an army before rifling in this game.

Thanks in advance for any help on this.

 

[Dhoomstriker]

How do you plan to get a lot of Commerce without Coastal Cities and without warring (warring would give Gold plus additional Resources)? It's not that it can't be done, I'm just asking for your plan... Cottage spamming?


I fail to see how Ironwood helps you. Settle it 1E or 1NE of there. At least moving to one of those locations will:
1. Stop you from wasting a Grassland Hills square
AND
2. Allow you to grow the City larger and be able to work some Commerce (Coast) squares later in the game
AND
3. Not remove any land squares that could be worked, since the currently-planned location only adds squares that are shared with other Cities, while none of those added squares are even Resource squares

EDIT: I cross-posted with your last message, that shows that you already settled the Ironwood location.


By the way, it's nice when you have low-width screenshots (like your screenshots are) outside of spoiler tags. Less clicking = more viewing. It's only when people play on much larger screen resolutions that the images really need to be spoilered.

 

[Dhoomstriker]

Hmmm, if you have a Great Engineer to build The Great Library, then it's probably better to build it in a City that is suitable to be a Great Person Farm than in your capital. Preferably, you'll have a greater focus on Cottages in your capital than you will on Specialist-generation, at least in a game like this one where you aren't spamming Wonders in your capital.


Also, I kind of hope that you're not going for a Cultural game here. The Great Library is one of the few Wonders that you do not want to build in a Cultural game, as the minor boost in Science and Culture do not make up for the fact that you will "use up" many Great People slots that should have otherwise been Great Artists. "One Great Scientist" is more than enough in a Cultural game, and sometimes you can get by with having 0, if you have good tech-trading partners.

If you ARE going for a Cultural game, then I'd strongly suggest building the National Epic elsewhere, such as by chopping it out in your 2-Fish City. If you're going for Space then sure, build the National Epic where you've built The Great Library. Now is basically the time to decide on your Victory Condition.


It would be nice if one of the AIs attacked you, so that you could get a war going. As you said, you have access to Police State. Maybe it is worth angering Monte or Huayna (well, maybe not intentionally angering them, since it wouldn't hurt to get on their good side after a war, but more where you simply don't put any effort into pleasing htem), so that one of them will attack you, giving you the excuse to make gains via a war.

1. How many great engineers are needed for the Hoover (3 some stuff in Civ 4) Dam?

Do you perhaps mean The Three Gorges' Dam? If yes, then I wouldn't even bother to build it unless you manage to get involved in a war and capture more Cities.

Factories + Coal Plants will be a far better investment, given your small amount of land (and thereby small number of Cities).

As for how many Great Engineers, open up a test game. The key facts are that:
1. On a given game speed, the Great Engineer will give you base X number of Hammers plus Y number of Hammers per population point.

2. X and Y will vary depending upon the game speed (and perhaps on other factors like map size--I am not sure--but just run a test game with the same game settings and you won't go wrong).

3. To figure out "Y," simply give yourself a tech that unlocks the Wonder that you want to build, give yourself a Size 1 City and a Size 2 City, one Great Engineer in each, then find out how many Hammers each City would get from the Great Engineer. The difference in values will tell you "Y," which will allow you to predict how many Hammers you will get after growing your City's Size.

4. Unlocking the Wonder itself (by givng yourself the appropriate tech or techs) will tell you how many Hammers are required to complete that Wonder based on your game settings. Then, it's just a bit of math to figure out the number of Great Engineers that would be required.

 

[yatta77]

How do you plan to get a lot of Commerce without Coastal Cities and without warring (warring would give Gold plus additional Resources)? It's not that it can't be done, I'm just asking for your plan... Cottage spamming?

Nope. No one cottage! All 6 scientists, everywhere possible, settling all them in the academy capital.
Representation+Oxford+Academy+Library+University = +27 each GS settled!
Even more with Monasteries, Observatory, Laboratory!
The strategy missed the target for just 1 turn (yep, Gandhi colonized Alpha Centauri 1 turn before the arrive of my ship) in IU game #55, if you have a bit of time and wonder about it, there are many saves and screen shots. I got to Fusion like 30 turns before everyone else, and I had Internet, but I screwed up the lats 40 turns and undervalued the bonus on building the SS the AIs take.

I could replay from 1844AD save, but I prefer restart from scratch. This time I'm playing Hatshepsut which IMO is a bit better than Ramses, and try to have few more hammers and few less coastal cities. We'll see.
On Emperor I colonized Alpha Centauri many times, even with 6 cities (never less because of Oxford). This game I will have 8 if I can hook Copper somehow, keep 6 in the other case.

I'll have 100% science after currency from selling resources, but this won't be nothing compared to the representation scientists output.

I fail to see how Ironwood helps you. Settle it 1E or 1NE of there. At least moving to one of those locations will:
1. Stop you from wasting a Grassland Hills square
AND
2. Allow you to grow the City larger and be able to work some Commerce (Coast) squares later in the game
AND
3. Not remove any land squares that could be worked, since the currently-planned location only adds squares that are shared with other Cities, while none of those added squares are even Resource squares

I know, apparently it doesn't make sense. If things goes the way I wish in the end game I hope my choices will pay.

By the way, it's nice when you have low-width screenshots (like your screenshots are) outside of spoiler tags. Less clicking = more viewing. It's only when people play on much larger screen resolutions that the images really need to be spoilered.

Good! Thanks for the feedback (without "s" )!

Hmmm, if you have a Great Engineer to build The Great Library, then it's probably better to build it in a City that is suitable to be a Great Person Farm than in your capital. Preferably, you'll have a greater focus on Cottages in your capital than you will on Specialist-generation, at least in a game like this one where you aren't spamming Wonders in your capital.

My capital _is_ my major GP farm.

Also, I kind of hope that you're not going for a Cultural game here.

Nope: if I was going culture, then Parthenon and Sistine Chapel would be built also (see my IU game #54 cultural victory with 4 cities, my _only_ immortal victory so far, if you wonder about).

The Great Library is one of the few Wonders that you do not want to build in a Cultural game, as the minor boost in Science and Culture do not make up for the fact that you will "use up" many Great People slots that should have otherwise been Great Artists. "One Great Scientist" is more than enough in a Cultural game, and sometimes you can get by with having 0, if you have good tech-trading partners.

Uhm... I guess we agree
For a cultural victory IMO Sistine Chapel better than Parthenon, which is better than Taj Mahal, which is better than Great Library.

If you ARE going for a Cultural game, then I'd strongly suggest building the National Epic elsewhere, such as by chopping it out in your 2-Fish City. If you're going for Space then sure, build the National Epic where you've built The Great Library. Now is basically the time to decide on your Victory Condition.

I did decide as soon as I sow I could get the land to built 6 cities without wars: my target is colonize Alpha Centauri

There are not plan B.

It would be nice if one of the AIs attacked you, so that you could get a war going. As you said, you have access to Police State. Maybe it is worth angering Monte or Huayna (well, maybe not intentionally angering them, since it wouldn't hurt to get on their good side after a war, but more where you simply don't put any effort into pleasing htem), so that one of them will attack you, giving you the excuse to make gains via a war.

This is minimalistic game! I want to win with the minimum quantity of land possible!
And I prefer not fight defensive wars, if I can avoid them.

---
EDIT

Do you perhaps mean The Three Gorges' Dam? If yes, then I wouldn't even bother to build it unless you manage to get involved in a war and capture more Cities.

Factories + Coal Plants will be a far better investment, given your small amount of land (and thereby small number of Cities).

As for how many Great Engineers, open up a test game. The key facts are that:
1. On a given game speed, the Great Engineer will give you base X number of Hammers plus Y number of Hammers per population point.

2. X and Y will vary depending upon the game speed (and perhaps on other factors like map size--I am not sure--but just run a test game with the same game settings and you won't go wrong).

3. To figure out "Y," simply give yourself a tech that unlocks the Wonder that you want to build, give yourself a Size 1 City and a Size 2 City, one Great Engineer in each, then find out how many Hammers each City would get from the Great Engineer. The difference in values will tell you "Y," which will allow you to predict how many Hammers you will get after growing your City's Size.

4. Unlocking the Wonder itself (by givng yourself the appropriate tech or techs) will tell you how many Hammers are required to complete that Wonder based on your game settings. Then, it's just a bit of math to figure out the number of Great Engineers that would be required.

Wow! Thanks! Appreciated.
//EDIT
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Any chance you can tell how probable it is that Montezuma or Capac attack in like the next 100 turns? As I asked in the post above?
To whoever can, thanks in advance!

EDIT: by the way, I have not "borders tensions" with any AI, I settled my cities very close to my capital.
IIRC Egyptian borders only "touch" 3 tiles of Mansa territory, and that's it, no others tile "contacts"!

 

[Dhoomstriker]

Well, for starters, Huayna does not like you very much by default and Monte REALLY does not like you very much by default.

For example, at +2 total Diplo relations, Asoka and Mansa are already Pleased with you, while Huayna is only Cautious. Monte is STILL Cautious even as high as +4.


It would be great if you uncovered (revealed the hidden squares) of a Coastal path to an AI that is not anyone's Worst Enemy. Then, you could Open Borders with that AI for Foreign Trade Routes but Close Borders with everyone else who is a Worst Enemy of someone else (so that others don't ask you to Stop Trading with their Worst Enemy).

Oddly enough, Monte tends to attack more AFTER receiving Open Borders... presumably because he can then scout your land... but more likely because the code "pretends" that Monte can scout your land, even if he doesn't actually do so.

Of course, getting the AIs up to being Pleased with you would certainly help, and you'd get positive Diplo modifiers via Open Borders, but you'd also get negative Diplo Modifiers for having Refused to Stop Trading with their Worst Enemies.

It's not an easy answer, and normally, when you have a ton of Cities, you'd prefer the Open Borders approach, for the extra Trade Routes, then use the positive Diplo modifers from Open Borders to counter-act the negative Diplo modifiers from Refusing to stop Trading with their Worst Enemies. Here, with less Trade Routes required, you can be more selective about whom you Open or Close Borders with.


Asoka won't attack you if he is Pleased with you, but the other 3 have a chance to attack you even if they are Pleased with you. Monte also has a very good chance of attacking you if he is only Cautious towards you (more than doubly likely to attack you--almost three times as likely to attack you--as him being Pleased towards you).

So, if there is anyone whom you DO want to Open Borders with AND to NOT TRADE with their Worst Enemy, it would be Montezuma. Getting him up to Pleased would help you a lot in avoiding war.


Also, where is your Ironworks National Wonder going to go? Normally, I will build it in a City that I capture from an AI. In your current empire, I don't see a lot of good options.

 

[vranasm]

I too would not bother with 3GD because it comes sooo late in the game.

You will probably have a bit of trouble with health resources once the industrial era hits (you don't have enough land to have enough resources for trading).

Tough call on corporations, with small compact empire they should be useful, but they are run based on number of resources you have.

I think you should strongly keep your eye on the Broadway, Hollywood, Rock'n'Roll combo because it offers you 3x4 resources for trading around.

this minimalistic approach is against my thinking so I am interested how it will play out...