Iraqis more optimistic then Americans

Fox Mccloud

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March 07 - Despite viоlence only 26% preferred life under Saddam

One in four (26%) Iraqi аdults have had a family relative murdered in the last three years, while 23% of those living in Baghdad have had a family/relative kidnapped in the last three years.

These are among the findings released today from the largest poll into Iraqi opinion ever to be published. Carried out by UK research firm ORB, which has been tracking public opinion in Iraq since 2005, the poll shows that despite the horrendous personal security problems only 26% of the country preferred life under the previous regime of Saddam Hussein, with almost half (49%) preferring life under the current political system. As one may expect, it is the Sunnis who are most likely to back the previous regime (51%) with the Shias (66%) preferring the current arrangements.

Carried out amongst a nationally representative sample of 5,019 Iraqi adults aged 18 years+ and coming just days before the fourth anniversary of the invasion of Iraq, the poll reveals that despite the large number of civilian deaths each month, largely as a result of militia activity, only 27% believe that their country is actually in a state of civil war. Opinion here is clearly divided, as 22% feel “we are close to a state of civil war but not yet in one” while 18% argue that the country is “still some way from civil war”.

Regionally, 43% of those in the Shia dominated South believe “Iraq will never get as far as civil war”. The corresponding figure in the Sunni dominated North plummets to 5% where the strongest sentiment (voiced by 42%) is that the country is already in a state of civil war.

Regionally there are also significant differences in attitudes regarding the security situation and the influence of Multi National Forces (MNF). Nationally a small majority (53%) feels that the security situation in Iraq will get better in the immediate weeks following a withdrawal of the MNF. A quarter (26%) believes the situation will deteriorate with the remainder predicting no change or answering "Don't know."

It is in the South where people most strongly believe that the withdrawal of the MNF will see the security situation improve. By a ratio of nearly seven to one the Shia dominated South feels that the situation will get "a great deal/little better" (69%) rather than "worse" (10%). In the Sunni North however opinion is more evenly divided – 46% feel it will get better and 37% feel it will get worse.

What about talk of creating a federal Iraq? With the exception of the Kurdish population in the North of the country a majority (64%) support Iraq remaining as a single country run by a central national government. On this point Sunnis (57%) and Shias (69%) agree that the country should continue as one nation.

Note:

The opinion poll was conducted by ORB and the survey details are as follows:

•Results are based on face-to-face interviews amongst a nationally representative sample of 5,019 adults aged 18 years + throughout Iraq.
•The standard margin of error on the sample size is +1.4%
•The methodology uses multi-stage random probability sampling and covers every one of the eighteen governorates within Iraq.
•Interviews conducted 10th – 22nd February 2007.

Source: http://www.opinion.co.uk/Newsroom_details.aspx?NewsId=67

http://www.opinion.co.uk/Documents/FINALTables.pdf

a few more articles to go with it:

Iraqis: life is getting better

MOST Iraqis believe life is better for them now than it was under Saddam Hussein, according to a British opinion poll published today.

The survey of more than 5,000 Iraqis found the majority optimistic despite their suffering in sectarian violence since the American-led invasion four years ago this week.

One in four Iraqis has had a family member murdered, says the poll by Opinion Research Business. In Baghdad, the capital, one in four has had a relative kidnapped and one in three said members of their family had fled abroad. But when asked whether they preferred life under Saddam, the dictator who was executed last December, or under Nouri al-Maliki, the prime minister, most replied that things were better for them today.

Only 27% think there is a civil war in Iraq, compared with 61% who do not, according to the survey carried out last month.

By a majority of two to one, Iraqis believe military operations now under way will disarm all militias. More than half say security will improve after a withdrawal of multinational forces.

Margaret Beckett, the foreign secretary, said the findings pointed to progress. “There is no widespread violence in the four southern provinces and the fact that the picture is more complex than the stereotype usually portrayed is reflected in today’s poll,” she said.

Source: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article1530762.ece

Viоlence slashed as troop surge hits Baghdad

KARADEH used to be an affluent shopping area of Baghdad. It boomed for a while after the American invasion as goods flooded into Iraq after years of sanctions. But as sectarian violence intensified, the store fronts became shuttered and shell-pocked.

In a vote of confidence in the surge by US troops, the shops were reopening last week. Hareth Salah, a 24-year-old student, said he had stopped attending courses at his technical college when the surge began last month.

“One of my friends was killed by the terorists,” he said, “but now there are a lot more Iraqi army checkpoints and I’m feeling more secure. I feel better; I can go out and do my shopping. More people have opened their stores and the markets are open longer.”

As the fourth anniversary of the Iraq war approaches on Tuesday, progress remains uncertain but trends are hopeful.

“This is a bit of a rollercoaster ride,” said General David Petraeus, the US commander in Iraq. “You’re trying to do what is necessary to keep the rollercoaster generally going up, despite the ups and downs and the bumps.”

Murderous sectarian checkpoints have melted away as the Iraqi security forces and American troops extend their grip on the capital. Abu Mohammed, a 34-year-old taxi driver, who lives in the largely Shi’ite Sha’ab district in northern Baghdad, said: “Sometimes I would stop and wait for an hour or two rather than take a chance on passing a fake checkpoint with a customer.

“We were so scared; anybody could be followed and assassinated.”

Figures released last week by Brigadier Qassim al-Moussawi, an Iraqi military spokesman, showed civilian deaths down from 1,440 in the four weeks before the surge began on February 14 to 265 in the four weeks that followed, although there may have been some undercounting. According to the American military, assassination attempts were down by 50%.

The number of US deaths was also down, from 87 to 66, although the concentration of troops in Baghdad led to an increase of 12% in fatalities in the capital.

Frederick Kagan, a military historian and leading advocate of the surge, said: “It is very early days but I’m very encouraged by what is happening. America only has two brigades out of five there and we haven’t even started our major operations yet. I had not expected this little resistance.”

Residents of the Iraqi capital are holding their breath. For each hopeful piece of news there seems to be a car bombing or attempted assassination - such as one on the Shi’ite mayor of Sadr City last week - that threatens their security.

“At least I don’t see bodies thrown here and there on the road, as in the days before the security plan,” said Ramya Ahmed, 35, a Shi’ite living in Adamiya, a largely Sunni neighbourhood.

A demonstration on Friday by militants loyal to the Mahdi army of the Shi’ite cleric Moqtada al-Sadr shouting “No, no to America” has raised fears of a new outbreak of hostilities with the cleric’s blackshirts.

Vali Nasr, an American expert, said Sadr was still growing in authority. “It is very clear the Mahdi army made a strategic decision not to engage the Americans in Baghdad,” he said, “but it has not been defeated. It is a tactical withdrawal.”

Roughly 700 members of Sadr’s militia have been arrested and others have fled to Iran. “Only the smaller people are left, so everyone is feeling more safe,” said one relieved resident.

American forces have moved with relative ease to install joint security stations with the Iraqis in Sadr City’s teeming slums. The number of these “mini forts” in Baghdad is due to reach 30 in the coming weeks. Some families displaced by ethnic cleansing have returned to check on their homes, although few have felt confident enough to stay.

Car bombings in Baghdad rose to an “all-time high” of 44 last month, according to a Pentagon spokesman, but troops are now fanning out to the suburbs and to outlying towns such as Baqouba in an effort to uncover bomb-making factories.

The Americans’ Stryker Brigade combat team was redeployed last week to the area, where there has been a sharp rise in attacks amid signs that Sunni insurgents are regrouping.

An extra combat brigade and more than 2,200 military police are being dispatched to Iraq, which by the end of May or early June will bring the number of additional US troops involved in the surge to 30,000. But James Carafano, a defence expert at the conservative Heritage Foundation, cautioned that an increase in violence was likely during the spring and summer.

“The first thing you would expect the bad guys to do is to go to ground, map things out, do some reconnaissance and figure out how to screw things up,” he said. “You have to get through to next winter before you can say the surge has worked.”

Suicide gas attack

Three suicide bombers using lorries loaded with chlorine gas killed eight people and caused 350, including six American soldiers, to fall ill in Fallujah and Ramadi this weekend.

The attacks prompted warnings that the insurgents are turning to new weapons to spread panic. Symptoms ranged from minor skin and lung irritations to vomiting.

Insurgents have detonated three other lorries carrying chlorine since January. Major-General William Caldwell, the American army’s spokesman, called it “a crude attempt to raise the terror level”.

Chlorine gas was deployed as a weapon in the first world war but its use has particular resonance in Iraq. Saddam Hussein turned chemical weapons on Kurdish areas in the 1980s during the Iran-Iraq war. Extra US troops have seen civilian deaths drop from 1,440 in the month before to 265 after

Source: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article1530529.ece
 
Tday seems to be a day of competing polls. The USA Today poll shows very little patience on the part of Iraqis. It just shows what poll design will do to the results.

For my money, I lean to this one. Its a lot more in line with the experience I have had with Iraqi workers.

J
 
Tday seems to be a day of competing polls. The USA Today poll shows very little patience on the part of Iraqis. It just shows what poll design will do to the results.

It's getting to the point where I hardly trust any news source at all.

But if the polls are true, good for the Iraqis. Here's hoping their quality of life greatly improves with the demise of their dictator.
 
It's getting to the point where I hardly trust any news source at all.

But if the polls are true, good for the Iraqis. Here's hoping their quality of life greatly improves with the demise of their dictator.
Hey Pug. Long time no talk.

If one thing is clear about the Iraqis, its that they like it better without Saddam, except for those that lost privileges. I remember one kid, maybe 17 years old. He spoke no English, but one of his friends translated. He was making motions of cutting off an ear. He said that if he refused to join the Republican Army, they would have mutilated him that way. Another pointed to a twisted wreck of a truck, and said, in scathing voice, "Saddam."

J
 
Hey Pug. Long time no talk.

If one thing is clear about the Iraqis, its that they like it better without Saddam, except for those that lost privileges. I remember one kid, maybe 17 years old. He spoke no English, but one of his friends translated. He was making motions of cutting off an ear. He said that if he refused to join the Republican Army, they would have mutilated him that way. Another pointed to a twisted wreck of a truck, and said, in scathing voice, "Saddam."

J

Wow, a first-person perspective too. Thanks, I really appreciate the good news. :)
 
Here's a question, why do we care/why should we fight wars around what other countries think?
 
Tday seems to be a day of competing polls. The USA Today poll shows very little patience on the part of Iraqis. It just shows what poll design will do to the results.

For my money, I lean to this one. Its a lot more in line with the experience I have had with Iraqi workers.

J
Interesting the way the organisation reporting on the poll findings dictates the conclusions drawn. Unless someone is making things up, it appears many news organisations are cherry-picking results to support their over all view.

I guess the truth is out there sonewhere, and is neither the 'good news' reportage above nor the sensationalist 'disaster' reporting of the doom-mongers...
BFR
 
well, in a war on "terrorism", it helps not to make more.
So you would support say, a U.S. led invasion of Taiwan to ensure its in PRC control, because more foreigners are in agreement of it then not. Or an Invasion of Israel because it would win us some high fives amongst the Middle East? I don't care if the Iraqis love or hate the occupation, if your looking to make life better for Iraqis at the expense of America, that is the very definition of treason.
 
ooh, how witty

Why complain? We did a good thing and got rid of a dictator. Life is improving. Admittedly this whole operation hasn't gone anywhere near perfect, but what war plan does?

Life is (hopefully) improving, and will only continue to do so

Don't try to rain on it by whining about Americans meddling, when in fact the people feel they benefitted
 
So you would support say, a U.S. led invasion of Taiwan to ensure its in PRC control, because more foreigners are in agreement of it then not. Or an Invasion of Israel because it would win us some high fives amongst the Middle East? I don't care if the Iraqis love or hate the occupation, if your looking to make life better for Iraqis at the expense of America, that is the very definition of treason.

all that i'm saying is, if they dont want us in there then why are we doing it? because all of a sudden the whole world is ready for democracy?

if this makes them hate us more and someone is pushed to bombing something else, i'll see it as a direct growth of this war.
 
It's getting to the point where I hardly trust any news source at all.

But if the polls are true, good for the Iraqis. Here's hoping their quality of life greatly improves with the demise of their dictator.
You're not the only one pug.
 
Don't try to rain on it by whining about Americans meddling, when in fact the people feel they benefitted
How many Americans feel like they benefitted. I'm not concerned with Iraqis, and the fact that you say I'm "whining about Americans meddling" shows you didn't even read, or at least didn't comprehend, my posts. I don't care what Iraqis want, we are not their servants, and the U.S. army is not at the beck and call of the Iraqi people. So tell me, how many Americans feel they have benefited?
 
The vast majority of the ones in the military for starters

The compassionate ones who actually care about those around them and about helping others.

If we were their servants we would have done everything Saddam asked. Rather, we took what we thought at the time to be defensive measures, which resulted in great benefits for the Iraqis and very little harm, if any, to America as a whole

Maybe discontent selfish people don't feel like the war accomplished anything. Maybe a lot of people feel that way. Idk..but I find it selfish and inhuman, not to mention unamerican to not want to protect the civil rights of mankind.

Furthermore your first post was irrelevant as the war had nothing to do with what another nation thought, and the other posts were relatively incoherent and illogical to my viewpoint. Maybe I didn't comprehend them.
 
the civilized world left imperialism in the dust for a good reason.
Ironic, since I'm not the one arguing in this thread in favor of invading countries when we decide to. I'm saying that American blood is being spilled to benefit Iraqis. The idea of basing your moves around what Iraq wants is absurd. Your own logic demands that we should have supported the Invasion of Kuwait by sending troops to be directly under Iraqi control. It certainly would have been popular in Iraq, but its not the purpose of the American army and it would not have been a good move, nor would it have made much sense to aid them in a military invasion and then invade them later, as you suggest we should have followed.

If we were their servants we would have done everything Saddam asked. Rather, we took what we thought at the time to be defensive measures, which resulted in great benefits for the Iraqis and very little harm, if any, to America as a whole
It cost us 1 trillion dollars, 3000+ dead, thousands more wounded. If we percieved it to be a defensive measure, then the task is done, we have broken the back of any Iraqi military threat, and theres no reason to stay.
Maybe discontent selfish people don't feel like the war accomplished anything. Maybe a lot of people feel that way. Idk..but I find it selfish and inhuman, not to mention unamerican to not want to protect the civil rights of mankind.
No, its Un-Trotskyist. I find it unamerican to put other countries ahead of our own. Being as I have Washington, Jefferson, Jackson, and Lincoln on my side on the policy of Isolationism that America maintained for over a hundred years, I at least have the side of precedent on my side. If you are willing to argue that they were unamerican, thats your perogitive.
 
no, we help kuwait because that's what kuwaities wanted.

and tell me where i suggested to aid them in a military invasion and then invade them later. :haha

why do we stay in iraq when they dont want us? the more discontent we spread over there, the more terrorists we'll see down the road, why are we side tracked in this pointless war instead of the war on terrorism? and dont tell me this was a part of the war on terrorism, if it is then we made it that way by spreading terrorism. please, tell me how anyone has benefited from this war.
 
Trotskyism=the American way of life?

when did this happen?

We aren't going to leave until we finish the job. There is plenty need to stay, but now it's not a selfish motive, but one of international service and brotherhood.

You don't have them on your side, because they would have defended themselves against such terrorism in this situation as well.

and Jackson isn't a very good one to list anyways ;)
 
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