ISIS's Plan for World Domination: Use Victoria II

[Kyriakos]

I know you know but for trivia:





Funny you mentioned it; that flag is also used by Al-Shebaab.

I am not typing about the letters though (didn't know their meaning but i supposed they would have a religious theme), but of the peculiar shape of the surface they are placed inside of.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

Would you have also shown Churchill and FDR to the gallows?

Mebbe.

 

[Tahuti]

Mebbe.

Hey, the only thing to fear is fear itself!

 

[gay_Aleks]

Hey, the only thing to fear is fear itself!

What about insane people taking over your country and then wrecking it for the next years?

 

[Tahuti]

What about insane people taking over your country and then wrecking it for the next years?

FDR and Churchill aren't one of them?

 

[gay_Aleks]

FDR and Churchill aren't one of them?

You could make the case for Churchill - he was quite, well, uh, insane, discriminatory and anti-Semite.

But far as I believe, FDR attempted to avoid the war. Sadly, the Japanese did not want the same.

 

[Traitorfish]

I'm not sure how many points you get for attempting to avoid war when your first reaction to its outbreak is setting up concentration camps.

 

[gay_Aleks]

Oh well. Concentration camps, as terrible and tasteless as it might sound, were all the rage during the 40s. Afterwards, slightly less.

 

[Tahuti]

Oh well. Concentration camps, as terrible and tasteless as it might sound, were all the rage during the 40s. Afterwards, slightly less.

I got scared of that tawk about boncentration bamps.

Ah well, vote National Bozialist! Mr. Hilter for PM!

 

[classical_hero]

Would you have also shown Churchill and FDR to the gallows?

Are they their primary target? No they weren't but groups like ISIS are attacking civilians when they didn't need to. You case of moral equivalence is rather shocking, and this goes for TF also. Unfortunately civilians die in war due to collateral damage, but they are not the prime target, but the fault for their deaths should be on those that put them in danger.

 

[Traitorfish]

See? "Killing civilians is unfortunate when we do it, actively evil when they do it."

 

[Borachio]

Are they their primary target? No they weren't but groups like ISIS are attacking civilians when they didn't need to. You case of moral equivalence is rather shocking, and this goes for TF also. Unfortunately civilians die in war due to collateral damage, but they are not the prime target, but the fault for their deaths should be on those that put them in danger.

I suggest you read up on Churchill and Bomber Harris, before stating categorically that they didn't deliberately target civilians, because.... you know... they did.

Professor Frederick Lindemann (later ennobled as Lord Cherwell), appointed the British government's leading scientific adviser with a seat in the Cabinet by his friend Prime Minister Winston Churchill, in 1942 presented a seminal paper to Cabinet advocating the area bombing of German cities in a strategic bombing campaign. It was accepted by Cabinet and Harris was directed to carry out the task (Area bombing directive). It became an important part of the total war waged against Germany.

Lord Cherwell's paper advocated attacking major industrial centres in order to destroy as many homes and houses as possible (dehousing). Working class housing areas were to be targeted because they had a higher density and firestorms were more likely. This would displace the German workforce and disrupt and reduce their ability to work. Lindemann's calculations showed that Bomber Command would be able to destroy the majority of German houses located in cities quite quickly; these calculations were based on the Luftwaffe's bombing campaign over Britain, but Lindemann had skewed the calculations to hugely overstate the effects.[citation needed] The plan was highly controversial even before it started, but the Cabinet thought bombing was the only option available to attack Germany directly (a major invasion of the continent was years away) and the Soviets were demanding that the Western Allies do something to relieve the pressure on the Eastern Front.

Harris said at the start of the bombing campaign that he was unleashing a whirlwind on Germany.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Arthur_Harris,_1st_Baronet#Second_World_War

I see no reason to think the Americans didn't continue with this strategy when they got involved in the bombing campaign against Germany.

 

[Traitorfish]

They utilised similar tactics in Japan, so they clearly had no moral objections to it.

 

[Kyriakos]

They utilised similar tactics in Japan, so they clearly had no moral objections to it.

Nor did they have moral objections to granting immunity to the Japanese human-experiment groups (eg unit 731) as long as the latter would supply them with info on their work (maybe even run some new experiments..).

 

[Old Hippy]

Are they their primary target? No they weren't but groups like ISIS are attacking civilians when they didn't need to. You case of moral equivalence is rather shocking, and this goes for TF also. Unfortunately civilians die in war due to collateral damage, but they are not the prime target, but the fault for their deaths should be on those that put them in danger.

unfortunatly they were the prime target...
there is a reason it took 50 odd years to give medals to the bomber command people

Many felt that the Germans deserved to reap the whirlwind they had sown. Yet Bomber Command's policy of targeting residential areas clearly contradicted Chamberlain's pre-war statement in parliament that it was 'against international law to bomb civilians as such and to make deliberate attacks on the civilian population'. How could a nation so proud of its high moral standards drop bombs on women and children?'.

Consequently, in February 1942, Bomber Command was instructed to shift the focus onto the 'morale of the enemy civil population'. This new policy came to be called 'area bombing
The aiming points thereafter, for bombing raids, were no longer military or industrial installations, but a church or other significant spot in the centre of industrial towns. And since fire was found to be the most effective means of destroying a town, the bombers now carried mainly incendiary bombs.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwtwo/area_bombing_01.shtml

 

[apotheoser]

Paradox OT at least is full of fascists, Randists, and other lunatics.

100% true. The Russian ultra-nationalists is extremely strong there, too. The Ukraine/Crimea thread is absolutely mindblowing.

 

[FriendlyFire]

unfortunatly they were the prime target...
there is a reason it took 50 odd years to give medals to the bomber command people

Ironically 70,000 french civilians died to Allied bombing in France but it was deemed strategically necessary to paralyses the German logistics.

I found it funny that Bomber command was publicly castrated from bombing Dresden which they did so at the Russians request and killed an estimated 25,000 Germans.

 

[Old Hippy]

Ironically 70,000 french civilians died to Allied bombing in France but it was deemed strategically necessary to paralyses the German logistics.

I found it funny that Bomber command was publicly castrated from bombing Dresden which they did so at the Russians request and killed an estimated 25,000 Germans.

it just annoys me that we always have to be saints in white hats, when compared to the bad guys, I think it's a dangerous assumption to make ... we can do nothing wrong, just make the odd regretable mistake

 

[Borachio]

Who's this we? Do you personally identify with Bomber Command for some reason or other?

 

[Old Hippy]

Who's this we? Do you personally identify with Bomber Command for some reason or other?

not particularly, but being a Londoner, the family has some association with the blitz,
the we, well I do personally identify with the western democratic alliances, NATO, Anzus etc, and sentiments like this "Unfortunately civilians die in war due to collateral damage, but they are not the prime target" seems like a cop out, considering I am part of the process that leads to collateral damage, it's worth remembering that we do not always wear the white hat,