Italy vs Romania pt 2

[Mirc]

Ah, Comrade Mirc! Have no fears; we shall stride out and fix the problems that are Gypsy-crime and word manipulation!

Dr Schabbs would be proud.

*sniff*

Fixed that for you.

 

[Bill3000]

Hmm... last time I checked, racism is believing that a person belonging to a certain ethnicity is automatically inferior to someone else.

Yes, and it is a result of what I said - refusal of assimilation. That was the basis behind antisemitism - jews had refused to assimilate into mainstream society, even after their emancipation.

 

[Mirc]

Implying that the natural tendency of gypsies is to not wash and that most of them stink "two meters away" is "very, very, very, far from insulting all gypsies"?

THAT IS NOT THE NATURAL TENDENCY OF THE GYPSIES. I did not imply that it is the natural tendency of the gypsies. Why do you keep putting words into my mouth?

 

[Che Guava]

Hmm... last time I checked, racism is believing that a person belonging to a certain ethnicity is automatically inferior to someone else.

Yeah, but most racists (and I'm not calling you one or geting into this fray...) back up thier illogical generalizations with colourful anecdotes about how a couple of 'those people' did some terrible wrong to them.

You know the type: "I hate blacks. They're all thiefs. I've been mugged twice and both time it was blacks"

EDIT: hmmm...on second read, I may have misread your post Well, no matter...

 

[Masquerouge]

Mirc, what you said about gypsies are collective insults.
I make no difference between what Alessandra Mussolini said about Romanians and what you say about gypsies: it's the same kind of collective insults, based on generalizations and stereotypes

 

[Mirc]

Yes, and it is a result of what I said - refusal of assimilation. That was the basis behind antisemitism - jews had refused to assimilate into mainstream society, even after their emancipation.

No no no, it's not that easy. I do not believe gypsies are inferior in any way, and I never claimed anything remotely related to that. So if you agree that is the definition of racism, and I did not claim that, none of my remarks were even close to racist.

Stop playing with "that is the basis of racism", lots of sexual abusers are so because they were abused themselves, doesn't mean that whoever was sexually abused is going to become an abuser.

 

[Tycoon101]

Fixed that for you.

Fabulous!

I'll ring up Otto and ask for a Giftkreig in rather short fashion, eh wot wot?

If these criminals are not part of the cure, they must be part of the disease.

 

[Gogf]

THAT IS NOT THE NATURAL TENDENCY OF THE GYPSIES. I did not imply that it is the natural tendency of the gypsies. Why do you keep putting words into my mouth?

So if I said this, you would be okay with it?

Romanians are OKAY if:

- They wash at least once a week so that their stench wasn't quite as bad.
- They don't commit terrorist attacks against America.
- They don't collaborate with Nazis and Soviets.
- They don't tell me what to think.
- They work so that I don't have to send my tax dollars to help support their country.

Sound fair to you?

 

[Mirc]

Mirc, what you said about gypsies are collective insults.

This is insane. How is that true, when YOU were the one who quoted this post?

And I have nothing against gypsies as long as:

- they WASH (so that they don't STINK from 2 METERS away)
- they WORK (and do not try to steal your phone - BTW I got 2 phone stolen by them, and 2 bikes, in one year)
- they do not INSULT me (or my family, my father, etc)

Here they constantly call everyone with a light skin "Filthy/Ugly Romanian" ("Roman Spurcat", I don't know exactly how to translate).

Now you're running away from the posts you quoted yourself thinking that they were in your favour?

 

[Mirc]

So if I said this, you would be okay with it?



Sound fair to you?

Do you even need to ask? Of course it's okay with me, it's perfectly in line what I think, if I met any Romanian like that I would never even consider staying too long around him/her.

I think it's true for any person in the world! Maybe with the exception of some people in war-affected zones that really do not have access to the water needed for personal hygiene.

 

[Masquerouge]

What about if I say this?

No because I know 'blacks' actually hold jobs and go to school, while Romanians do neither.

And black people actually wash themselves.

Would you be okay with that?

 

[Gogf]

This is insane. How is that true, when YOU were the one who quoted this post?



Now you're running away from the posts you quoted yourself thinking that they were in your favour?

Maybe he's talking about this one.

 

[Mirc]

What about if I say this?


And black people actually wash themselves.

Would you be okay with that?

Yes, I would be perfectly ok with the ANSWER (and X people wash themselves), but not with the quoted post. Which was not posted by me, but by Cleric.

Edit: spelling and grammar

 

[Mirc]

Maybe he's talking about this one.

Maybe, but in that case the point is very easy to combat. I also said I hate Romania (which I hate much more than that particular person that actually stole my bike - whoever he was). Does it mean I'm also racist against the "race"* that I was born in?

*I would never call it a race but the context forces me to, as otherwise it wouldn't make sense near the word the word "racist".


So, to sum it up: I DO hate Romania, but I am not racist towards any of the people that live here (would be kinda strange since I'm such a mix myself).

 

[Masquerouge]

Yes, I would be perfectly ok with the ANSWER (and X people wash themselves), but not with the quoted post. Which was not posted by me.

I will drop the subject because it's not OT, but before that I'll just add one last thing.

You know, Mirc, I like you. You're a cool guy and I like to discuss with you, it's always interesting. And that's why I'm disappointed and surprised when you write such things about gypsies.

And as you can see, I'm not the only one to think what I think about the things you say, and I'm not the only one to see a contradiction between the things you say about gypsies and the fact that you find Mussolini's comments about Romanians ridiculous.

Now maybe in your opinion you're perfectly justified, but do not be surprised if in the future you'll get flak for it.

 

[Gogf]

Nevermind, I'll drop it.

 

[Mirc]

I will drop the subject because it's not OT, but before that I'll just add one last thing.

You know, Mirc, I like you. You're a cool guy and I like to discuss with you, it's always interesting. And that's why I'm disappointed and surprised when you write such things about gypsies.

And as you can see, I'm not the only one to think what I think about the things you say.

Now maybe in your opinion you're perfectly justified, but do not be surprised if in the future you'll get flak for it.

No worries Masque, I didn't take anything here personally, though other people might have done it (and despite the :mad: smiley - I never turn red in real life ). I only think that you are wrong in your belief that I am biased against gypsies (collectively), so I want to clear out the misunderstanding.

I think many people have had such bad experiences with racism recently that they are trying to demolish anything that could suggest to anyone an attitude that could give birth to racism. But I think we need to look more carefully before deeming someone or something as racist.

 

[Whomp]

Moderator Action: This has not started off well. Discuss or it will close.

 

[Che Guava]

What the hell do you guys think you're doing, solving your arguments with civility and mutual respect?!! You'll give all of CFC a bad reputation with attitudes like that!

 

[Whomp]

I'll add my opinion here. If people simply could empathize with another's beliefs/plight/circumstance then our life as humans would be much easier.