Kerbal Space Program

[Thorgalaeg]

I am starting a career with a lot of mods as usual. List of installed mods:

KSP: 1.3.1 (Win64) - Unity: 5.4.0p4 - OS: Windows 10 (10.0.0) 64bit
000_AT_Utils - 1.5
Filter Extensions - 3.2.0.3
Toolbar - 1.7.16.5
AlmostFreeLaunchClamps - 0.2.1
AllYAllContinued - 0.11.13.2
AugmentedReality - 0.2.1.1
AutoAction - 1.9.3
B9 Animation Modules - 1.1
B9 Part Switch - 2.1.1
B9 Aerospace - 6.4
B9 Aerospace - 6.4
B9 Aerospace HX Parts - 6.4
BetterTimeWarpContinued - 2.3.9
CIT_Util - 1.4.1
BAM - 1.3.1
Community Category Kit - 2.0.2
Community Resource Pack - 0.8
CommunityTechTree - 3.2.1
Connected Living Space - 1.2.5.7
Contract Configurator - 1.23.3
Contract Pack: Field Research - 1.2.1
Contract Pack: Bases and Stations - 3.7.0.1
Contract Pack: Tourism Plus - 1.5.2
CorrectCOL - 1.6.3
CriticalTemperatureGauge - 1.3.1
Crowd Sourced Science - 4.1.2
CryoEngines - 0.5.11
CryoTanks - 0.4.9
DangIt - 0.7.16
Deadly Reentry - 7.6.2
DistantObjectEnhancement - 1.9.1
DMagic Orbital Science - 1.3.0.11
CapCom Mission Control On The Go - 1.0.2.7
Contract Parser - 1.0.7
Contracts Window Plus - 1.0.8.1
Progress Parser - 1.0.8
DynamicBatteryStorage - 1.2
Easy Vessel Switch - 1.5.6471.31118
EditorExtensionsRedux - 3.3.16
EVAEnhancementsContinued - 0.1.12.1
EVAFuelContinued - 1.6.3
ExtensiveEngineerReportContinued - 0.1.2
FASA Launch Clamps - 1.1.3
Firespitter - 7.6
Flexible Docking - 1.0.5
FMRS (Flight Manager For Reusable Stages) - 1.2.6
GroundConstruction - 1.2.1
Hangar - 3.3.3
HeatControl - 0.4.4
HideEmptyTechTreeNodes - 1.0.1
HullcamVDSContinued - 0.1.8
Interstellar Fuel Switch - 2.10.3
JanitorsCloset - 0.3.3
K2CommandPodContinued - 1.1.8.2
RasterPropMonitor - 0.29.3
Kerbal Attachment System - 0.6.3
KerbalAtomics - 0.4.11
Kerbal Engineer Redux - 1.1.3
Kerbal Foundries - 2.1.2.12
Kerbal Joint Reinforcement - 3.3.3
HyperEdit - 1.5.6
Kerbal Inventory System - 1.9.6571.274
<b><color=#CA7B3C>Kopernicus</color></b> - 1.3.1.6
KRASH - 0.5.26
KSP-AVC Plugin - 1.1.6.2
KSPRescuePodFix - 1.2.0.8
KSPWheel - 0.10.5.23
KWRocketryRedux - 3.1.4
LaunchCountDown - 1.7.9.1804
Lights Out - 0.2.2
Infernal Robots - 2.0.14
Infernal Robotics Sequencer - 1.0.3
MandatoryRCS - 1.4
ModularFlightIntegrator - 1.2.4
MunarIndustries Fuel Tank Expansion - 0.9.6
NavBallDockingAlignmentIndicatorCE - 1.0.3
Docking Port Alignment Indicator - 6.7
NearFutureConstruction - 0.8.4
NearFutureElectrical - 0.9.8
NearFutureLaunchVehicles - 1.1.3
NearFutureProps - 0.3
NearFuturePropulsion - 0.9.5
NearFutureSolar - 0.8.8
NearFutureSpacecraft - 0.7.5
Final Frontier - 1.3.6.3189
S.A.V.E - 1.4.7.2860
NRAP - 1.5.10
PatchManager - 0.0.13
Precise Maneuver - 2.3.2
QuickSearch - 3.2
RealChute - 1.4.5
Recovery Controller - 0.0.2
RemoteTech - 1.8.9
DeepFreeze Continued... - 0.23.7
SCANsat - 1.1.8.4
SETI-RemoteTechConfig - 1.3.0.1
ShipManifest - 5.2
ShipSectionsContinued - 0.1
SpaceY Expanded - 1.3.1
SpaceY Lifters - 1.16
StateFundingContinued - 0.6.13
StationPartsExpansion - 0.5.2
StationPartsExpansionRedux - 1.0
StationScienceContinued - 2.3
Stock Visual Enhancements - 1.2.8
Stock Visual Terrain - 2.0.9
TAC Fuel Balancer - 2.14
TakeCommandContinued - 1.4.11.1
ThrottleControlledAvionics - 3.5
Kerbal Alarm Clock - 3.8.5
Alternate Resource Panel - 2.9.2
Transfer Window Planner - 1.6.2
TweakScale - 2.3.7
Universal Storage - 1.3.0.1
EVAParachutesAndEjectionSeats - 0.1.15
KSP Interstellar Extended - 1.16.7
Waypoint Manager - 2.7
[x] Science! - 5.11

Plus Kerbalism, tweakscale limiter and some other that doesnt appear in the list.

I am already sending probes to mimus and everything woks fine. Lets see how long it takes this time.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

That's a cool design, I would have totally overengineered a mission like this. Is it possible to pick up a soil sample on an unmanned mission?

I am having big problems during Laythe landing tests. I took out all the ore out of the sub, outfitted it with a lot of chutes, and it makes it all the way to the surface just fine, but then crashes into it. It's impossible to orient and/or control the craft, so I can't use boosters to slow down during descent. I might just turn to a mod for submarine designs instead and start from scratch.

Speaking of mods I am now running mods. Visually everything is looking better, so I'll probably return to the game sooner rather than later to design a new sub. I'm not sure what I was doing wrong yesterday, but last night there was much joy when I saw popups when I launched the game asking me yes/no questions about the mods I installed

It's not really possible to do a true sample return mission without astronauts. There may be a mod that allows for this but I haven't found it - and I've installed a few mods that give extra science parts and reports.

This is Starbase Minmus II. It was built to satisfy contracts to build a base on Minmus and to shuttle some tourists out there.

Spoiler :

I accidentally managed to launch directly into a Minmus flyby without actually trying to line up the orbits. It just happened and it saved me a ton of fuel. I did run into a couple of big problems on my way to land, however.

For one, I dramatically underestimated the TWR of the base stage. It was just barely over 1:1 and this meant I collided with Minmus at about 40 m/s. I was frantically trying to mash F9 but somehow the base just hit the ground and bounced without any damage. It was nuts, I was flipping end over end but managed to reorient and bring it down without damage. For once a glitch in the game worked in my favor!

This is the second issue I encountered:

Spoiler :

It's hard to tell from this image but the engine bell is a bit longer than the landing legs. I did a fit check in the VAB but I did a crappy job because sure enough, the lander was not able to rest on its four legs. It's a good thing the nozzle is quite sturdy because it did not end up like this:

Spoiler :

That's the Apollo 15 lander engine bell, crushed on impact. During the later Apollo missions, they lengthened the skirt of the engine bell (you can see the nozzle is two different colors) in order to increase performance so they could haul more gear like the moon buggies. They designed the nozzle to crush and absorb energy on impact in the case where they made a rough landing or landed at an angle (I think they were at 15 degrees or so on Apollo 15).

I do intend on building up a permanent base eventually but since this flight was for tourists, it had to come back. Liftoff!

Spoiler :

I did not have enough fuel for an unassisted circularization at Kerbin so I had to execute a series of powered aerobraking maneuvers.

Spoiler :

I've gotten into the habit of waiting to see how slow the decent parachutes can get my bases before deciding whether or not to drop the fuel tanks and engine. In this case, I was able to land the whole base back on Kerbin which saved me about 25% of the total cost of the mission.

Spoiler :

I just launched a Duna sample-return mission and an accompanying relay probe. I'll post photos of that after someone else posts something.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

hat's the Apollo 15 lander engine bell, crushed on impact. During the later Apollo missions, they lengthened the skirt of the engine bell (you can see the nozzle is two different colors) in order to increase performance so they could haul more gear like the moon buggies. They designed the nozzle to crush and absorb energy on impact in the case where they made a rough landing or landed at an angle (I think they were at 15 degrees or so on Apollo 15).

Lol. That is so kerbal. I suppose the crushed nozzle was part of the landing stage and was of not use for taking off and returning to the service module.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Correct, it was only used during descent. For ascent, the top of the lander came off while using the bottom as a launch pad.

Go to 2:50 for the lift-off.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

Well after several landing attempts at mum with a nuclear powered lander i found it has not enough TWR to make it. With around 1.3 the deceleration is so slow it is almost impossible to stop the descent at the proper time. It is always too soon so you must keep it on a long time spending lots of fuel or too late (= big crash). So i will leave mum and try it at mimus. That is a big pro for nuke engines. You can change your plans at the fly.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Do you have Kerbal Engineer installed? It has a neat feature called the 'suicide burn' which tells you when you need to begin throttling at 100% to reach 0 altitude at 0 velocity. That's your most efficient landing profile for a planet/moon without atmosphere. Always start your burn a bit early though because as the terrain changes under you, you may get a nasty surprise. I.e. if you fly over a mountain, all of a sudden you should have started your burn a few kilometers higher than if you are landing on a lowlands.

I find that a TWR of 1.3 is sufficient for most landings though it does depend on how much fuel you have. Minmus won't be a problem though. The most efficient transfers to get to Minmus only require marginally more fuel than getting to the Mun. Though my approach (to get to Minmus orbit then burn full retrograde so that I fly backwards until I run into Minmus) is very inefficient. It's a lot easier than lining up orbital alignments though so I always use it except for the few times I accidentally launch into an aligned orbit.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

Yep, i have KER of course. Didnt know what the suicide burn was though. Seems just what i was looking for.

Another issue is i dont use reaction wheels. I find them very unrealistic so i use a mod to reduce its power to about 1% of its power in the stock game. So i have to use RCS for everything. That makes power landings with fixed-nozzle engines much more difficult.

 

[cardgame]

That's probably way more fun to learn and master as long as you can remember to quicksave so you don't get frustrated by crashing a lot. I've thought about installing an Reaction Wheel nerf mod as well, but haven't done it.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

You'd be suprised at how fast a set of bottom-shelf reaction wheels can slew a small satellite. Not the bigger ones, of course, but a cubesat can whip around quite fast.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I managed to pull off a robotic Duna sample-return mission. Here's the transtage and lander stack in Duna orbit, breaking apart for descent:

Spoiler :

The transtage is powered by quad-ion drives and a buttload of solar cells, batteries and capacitors. The transtage was dramatically underpowered (even for an ion drive) and it took several months of game time to reach an escape trajectory. The cycle would go: burn, discharge capacitors, stop burn, recharge at apoapsis, burn again. Over and over and over again. It probably took 2 hours of real-time to make it through, even with the 4x warp on. The system was sized to be able to run purely off solar power but unfortunately, a Duna trajectory requires burning on the nightside of Kerbin.

After arrival at Duna, I was able to burn in daylight but only with 3 of the 4 engines lit. Settling into a low orbit also took several in-game days and about half an hour or so in real time. Ugh so somehow I forgot to take pictures on the surface. Anyways, the landing was easy thanks to the parachutes and I got a ton of science. The transtage remained in orbit to function as a relay but it turns out that the antennas I selected for the lander were powerful enough to be able to talk directly to Kerbin. The relay should be useful for future missions though.

Here's the lander on ascent, before and after it dropped the quad monopropellant fuel tanks.

Spoiler :

The flight back was a bit tricky. I did not have enough fuel for a circularization burn or anything, so I had to very, very carefully do all my burns to set up a direct encounter with Kerbin. Somehow I was able to line up a flyby that would drop me down to 35 km in Kerbin's atmosphere from across the solar system. That was pretty neat. In the end, I wasn't sure if I was going to burn up so re-entry was definitely a scary moment:

Spoiler :

It worked and I ended up with 10k science and about a million dollars just from this one trip. Oh and during my initial Duna intercept, I wound up doing an Ike flyby which also got me a lot of science and cash and helped me bleed off some speed before my capture burn.

As part of this mission, I sent out a very simple relay at the same time. It ended up not being useful and to make matters worse, one of my mods ended up massively nerfing the NERVA engine before breaking it entirely (core meltdown). I removed the offending mod and the engine went back to normal but now I've lost access to all of the other neat nuclear engines I could once use. Oh well. I would like to find some new mod with nuclear engines that does not use fancy fuels or is a reactor simulation.

Spoiler :

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I am going to attempt an Eve manned landing and return mission. The contract I just took to finance it stipulates a five-person base. This is going to be tough.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

Extremely.

BTW my game already got corrupted or something. Performance is very pool. Time counter is always yellow (meaning it is not running at real time anymore). Funny part is it is using about a 12% of my CPU (not a single core of my 7700k is being fully used) and about a 2% of my 1080ti only! In vanilla mode KSP is a bugfest but with mods it is an utter mess.

 

[warpus]

I am going to attempt an Eve manned landing and return mission. The contract I just took to finance it stipulates a five-person base. This is going to be tough.

Good luck!

 

[hobbsyoyo]

CKAN stopped working. I will have to delete it and try and re-install it and hope that fixes it.

One thing that really bugs me about this game is the lack of high-efficiency engines. This game really doesn't have any good upper-stage engines other than the NERVA which has its own problems. It annoys the crap out of me that everything tops out at <350s. Even the aerospike gets a terrible ~375s Isp.

 

[cardgame]

hobbs, have you looked at Realism Overhaul?

 

[hobbsyoyo]

No I haven't. I assume it would make the game harder to play and break my computer. Does it have better engines?

I launched my Eve mission. I have a nuclear-reactor powered, ion-engined space tug in a 200 km orbit, waiting to be docked with the lander. It will drag it out to Eve, put it on a de-orbit path, boost itself back into a stable orbit and wait for the lander to return.

The lander will fall down to the surface with minimal use of the engines. Then it will land on chutes, take off and dock with the tug which will take it back to Kerbin. The tug has over 40 km/s of delta-v. The lander itself has about 10k. They were both launched on beast-mode rockets though it turns out that the launch vehicles for both were overbuilt. There was probably an extra 1 km/s of delta-v in the launch stages left over. I'm using that fuel for docking and then I'll use whatever's left to begin the trans-Eve injection burn.

Here's the tug on the pad and in orbit, and while still attached to the 2nd stage:

Spoiler :

Here's the lander, still attached to its 3rd stage, on its way to rendevouz with the tug:

Spoiler :

If I were to do this over again, I would replace that third stage with a nuclear-powered transit stage and ommitted the tug altogether. Docking these beasts won't be fun and the burns will be stupid long. I'm not looking forward to that, but at least with the nifty nuclear power plant I don't have to worry about running out of power. There are a ton of radiator panels on the tug (the white/beige panels) to cool the reactor to keep it from exploding.

I wish the decouplers would match the diameter of the stage under them.

 

[cardgame]

I figured it would be straight up your alley and you would have at least looked into it, given your occupation.

Realism Overhaul is a mod that makes Kerbal Space Program behave more like real life. If you're interested in seeing what it's like to fly rockets in the real world, this is the mod for you! Realism Overhaul does this by modifying other mods and stock parts to perform as their real-life equivalents. You can expect things to be a little harder, and rockets to be a bit bigger, but the scenes far more epic, and the accomplishment that much greater.

Overview of the changes you can expect to see:

• Engine performance - Engines use real fuels, real sizes and real performance values. Check out the Wiki for guides on how to use engines!
• Modified ElectricCharge system - 1EC/s = 1kW.
• Solar Panels don't produce magical amounts of electricity, but they are much lighter.
• RTGs don't produce magical amounts of electricity, but many systems don't need as much electricity.
• Reaction wheels aren't magically powerful anymore, just like real life.

It can be thought of as a total conversion mod, so what I do with it is I create a backup of GameData with all my usual mods, then I uninstall them and get RO and its dependencies.

RO is seriously, seriously difficult. I made it to Jool and its moons in .17, when they were first added. I've gone back in future updates. In RO, I have sent a sputnik into LEO and that's it. Running a real Apollo mission in RO is on my bucket list. It's gonna be as intense or more so than my very first Mun landing in 0.13

 

[Thorgalaeg]

Is Realism Overhaul compatible with last ksp version? It was not last time I checked. Btw ckan has had issues lately with the online repository due to some changes in GitHub. Reinstalling a newer version should solve them.

Also @hobbsyoyo there is a mod which allows rescaling parts including decouplers and even engines. I would recommend using another mod to limit it though. I like being able to rescale tanks and structural parts but not engines and such since that defeats the purpose of advancing in the career and get more powerful engines. It feels like cheating.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I figured it would be straight up your alley and you would have at least looked into it, given your occupation.



It can be thought of as a total conversion mod, so what I do with it is I create a backup of GameData with all my usual mods, then I uninstall them and get RO and its dependencies.

RO is seriously, seriously difficult. I made it to Jool and its moons in .17, when they were first added. I've gone back in future updates. In RO, I have sent a sputnik into LEO and that's it. Running a real Apollo mission in RO is on my bucket list. It's gonna be as intense or more so than my very first Mun landing in 0.13

Thanks for the suggestion but no thanks. That sounds waay too intense for me!

Is Realism Overhaul compatible with last ksp version? It was not last time I checked. Btw ckan has had issues lately with the online repository due to some changes in GitHub. Reinstalling a newer version should solve them.

Also @hobbsyoyo there is a mod which allows rescaling parts including decouplers and even engines. I would recommend using another mod to limit it though. I like being able to rescale tanks and structural parts but not engines and such since that defeats the purpose of advancing in the career and get more powerful engines. It feels like cheating.

I have the rescale mod and use it for tanks too. What I meant though is that the shroud that the decoupler places over the engine defaults to the diameter of the engine itself, not the size of either the decoupler itself or the stage below it. Look at the very skinny sections of my rockets above, that's where the decoupler shroud over the engine defaulted to the engine size.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

Mmm... you could use an structural adapter above the tank below the engine to go from the size of the tank to the size of the engine and then a smaller decoupler that fits the engine diameter.