Traitorfish
The Tighnahulish Kid
Am I misguided in feeling that having separate pride flags for bisexuality and pansexuality is a bit like having separate flags for America and the United States?
LGBT flags and the Political Left (split from Random Rants LXXIII)
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Snerk
Smeghead
TBH I didn't know the different sexualities had their own flags at all. But that only goes to show how little I know. I though the lovely rainbow flag was the only banner in play.
Synobun
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A little. Bisexuality is sexual attraction to men and women. Pansexuality is sexual attraction to anyone (intersex, non-gender conforming, transgender, etc). Bisexuals suffer from the same bias as straights do re: transgender folk. Even if you recognize and acknowledge that a transwoman is a woman, for example, many/most people would still be unwilling to date them if they were into women. The transition part/"what they used to be" often ends up a problem. Pansexuality is explicitly okay with any sort of configuration in the trans debate because pansexuality is attraction to anyone regardless of what's between their legs, what gender they are, what their past history is, and so on.
Traitorfish
The Tighnahulish Kid
No, I understand the stated definitions. I just don't understand why we would imagine that these constitute two distinct political constituencies. (Which is what a flag surely represents?)
Outside of the internet, they mostly don't. But the internet has a habit of leaking into meatspace, so you will occasionally see them in the wild.
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Synobun
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The flags aren't meant to be political, they're meant to be communal. They serve different purposes. You don't fly the flag and become a card-carrying bisexual with a seat in the senate. It's meant to easily identify others who are like you and that you could come to recognize as an ally in a world that frequently considers you less.
After I got snarled at awhile back for daring to suggest that people actually explain what the various flags mean, rather than ranting because people (ie. general public people) don't automatically know what they mean, I've decided I can't be bothered. I give courtesy where it's offered, and what I got was a virtual slap in the face.
Rainbow flag? Sure, that's been around for decades, so most people should have some awareness of what it stands for. Canadian flag? Of course. But don't talk to me about any others. At least not without some manners.
Rainbow flag? Sure, that's been around for decades, so most people should have some awareness of what it stands for. Canadian flag? Of course. But don't talk to me about any others. At least not without some manners.
Snerk
Smeghead
"You wanna front your banners, you best learn some manners!!"
"Peace"
"..."
"Peace"
"..."
Traitorfish
The Tighnahulish Kid
You make it sound like we've collectively confused "flag" with "team colours".
Traitorfish
The Tighnahulish Kid
I'm quite serious. The original pride flag was absolutely intended as a political symbol. It represented a defined constituency, the rights and liberties of that constituency, and the movement to secure those rights and liberties. In a very broad sense, that makes it a flag in the same sense as, say, the Irish tricolour. If the alternative pride flags are assumed to have been broadly derived from the classical pride flag, we'd reasonably expect them to have inherited this purpose. That they're almost universally constructed as a set of horizontal bands, and mostly bands of non-repeating colours, certainly suggests such a derivation. So, it seems strange to design separate flags around what amounts to the nuances of individual sexuality. Is that something that it's possible to clearly articulate with this sort of symbolism, let alone useful or necessary?
Honestly, I'm mostly annoyed because the bisexual flag is objectively terrible, but the pansexual flag is pretty solid, so it seems blindingly obvious to me that they should just share the latter. But I also think they should put the orange back in the Dutch flag, so I accept that I'm a bit of a crank when it comes to this stuff.
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Sorry, I am not very fluent in modern internet slang, or much modern slang, period.
I think it's reasonable to expect people to explain what a flag or banner means, if people express confusion about it, rather than snarl at them and insult them because they don't already know.
If this form of basic courtesy isn't going to be extended to me, why should I make any further effort?
Snerk
Smeghead
No no, I essentially agree. Always be polite and friendly about the stuff, definitely. I just like to sum up things with a snazzy rhyme
Traitorfish
The Tighnahulish Kid
Supplementary, then. For once, I'm not stressing about word-choice, don't ruin it for everyone.
In this scenario, what is currently called the pansexual flag would be the bi- and/or pansexual flag. Hence, "share". As I said, it's not as the nuances of the bi/pan distinction is effectively communicated through the medium of colourful stripes.
it suggests the Republic of China to me
Synobun
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It's not meant to. You're not the target audience of the flag. It's not meant to educate you. It's not meant for you to use.
Lexicus
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Traitorfish
The Tighnahulish Kid
Who says we want to use it, if it's not applicable? We'd just prefer not to get snarled at or yelled at if we're expected to know what it's for and don't, because nobody explained it.
And don't say it's not for outsiders to know. I got snarked at in a different thread in OT because I didn't know something that "everybody knows" and the poster seemed to think it was beneath their dignity to explain it.
So I decided not to bother even trying to understand anymore. Nobody seemed to appreciate it, so whatever.
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