LGBT flags and the Political Left (split from Random Rants LXXIII)

[Synobun]

They probably snarl at others because when they explain it the person just flat-out rejects it.

 

[Traitorfish]

You say that like it means something. Just a flag, my dude.

Flags are pretty much by definition public statements of affiliation or solidarity, be that communal, national or institutional. They aren't a private code. Else, instead of printing them on five-foot wide squares of colourful textile, they'd be set into signet rings and only visible under ultraviolet light. Which would be pretty cool and all, but for whatever reason doesn't seem to be the direction that the broader LGBTQ+ movement has taken.

 

[Synobun]

Sounds like they meet that standard.

 

[yung.carl.jung]

A little. Bisexuality is sexual attraction to men and women. Pansexuality is sexual attraction to anyone (intersex, non-gender conforming, transgender, etc). Bisexuals suffer from the same bias as straights do re: transgender folk. Even if you recognize and acknowledge that a transwoman is a woman, for example, many/most people would still be unwilling to date them if they were into women. The transition part/"what they used to be" often ends up a problem. Pansexuality is explicitly okay with any sort of configuration in the trans debate because pansexuality is attraction to anyone regardless of what's between their legs, what gender they are, what their past history is, and so on.

I always thought pansexuality was the idea that one can be sexually attracted to literally anything, so not just a body, not just a human being, but an idea, something incorporeal, an ideal, any lifeform, a tree, whatever. Gotta admit I am wildly disappointed right now. I need a new phrase.

 

[Snerk]

Not trying to be a jerk but debates like these is why the left seem incapable of winning elections anymore.

 

[Synobun]

Not trying to be a jerk but debates like these is why the left seem incapable of winning elections anymore.

Life was easier when you could just kill people who weren't the norm.

 

[yung.carl.jung]

Not trying to be a jerk but debates like these is why the left seem incapable of winning elections anymore.

This works as a snarky joke and all, but is actually very far removed from reality. "The left" is still winning elections. Just because the fattest kid in the playground is wearing an Elephant Shirt now does not mean that "the right" is now closing in on world domination.

Besides, what does that really even mean? Is "communist" China leftist, is it centrist, or is it rightist (because of its authoritarian tendencies)? If you ask me, leftists haven't won an American election in over a century, because there literally is no leftist party, just a centrist and a rightist one

 

[Snerk]

This works as a snarky joke and all, but is actually very far removed from reality. "The left" is still winning elections. Just because the fattest kid in the playground is wearing an Elephant Shirt now does not mean that "the right" is now closing in on world domination.

Besides, what does that really even mean? Is "communist" China leftist, is it centrist, or is it rightist (because of its authoritarian tendencies)? If you ask me, leftists haven't won an American election in over a century, because there literally is no leftist party, just a centrist and a rightist one

The left as in social democratic parties. And they are very much not winning elections, in Europe at least. Across the board they are losing the working class to the populist right. With the UK as the closest thing to an exception as Corbyn is coming in with some momentum.
I read a phrase I liked in an article the other day that went something like if we stop to argue lgbt semantics on our march to the Bastille, we might as well call off the revolution.

Or to paraphrase Bernie Sanders, America is sick and tired of hearing about liberals’ damn bathrooms.

 

[Traitorfish]

I'll be honest, if I'd know that I was going to provoke such strong feelings, I'd have stuck to something less controversial, like what flag to fly over Belfast City Hall.

 

[Synobun]

You're attempting to dictate over and judge two subsets of the LGBT+ umbrella because you don't like how they choose to identify like-minded people. Obviously that will receive a less-than-positive response.

 

[Takhisis]

It might just be me, but I think you're overreacting.

After I got snarled at awhile back for daring to suggest that people actually explain what the various flags mean, rather than ranting because people (ie. general public people) don't automatically know what they mean, I've decided I can't be bothered. I give courtesy where it's offered, and what I got was a virtual slap in the face.

Rainbow flag? Sure, that's been around for decades, so most people should have some awareness of what it stands for. Canadian flag? Of course. But don't talk to me about any others. At least not without some manners.

Did you try the ‘hey I live in a very conservative place where I cannot ask these questions of my neighbours so I have to ask online’ approach?

 

[yung.carl.jung]

The left as in social democratic parties. And they are very much not winning elections, in Europe at least. Across the board they are losing the working class to the populist right. With the UK as the closest thing to an exception as Corbyn is coming in with some momentum.
I read a phrase I liked in an article the other day that went something like if we stop to argue lgbt semantics on our march to the Bastille, we might as well call off the revolution.

Or to paraphrase Bernie Sanders, America is sick and tired of hearing about liberals’ damn bathrooms.

Yes, I get your general feeling, but all you are really doing is marginalizing the struggles of the people that are already suffering the most. Also, I think you are generalizing a bit too harshly. The socialists and the "new left" kinda won out in Spain, didn't they? I agree though that "social democrat" parties are failing. But those are hardly leftist anymore. The social democrats have become "progress" loving, globalization supporting, wishy washy centrists who abandoned all they used to stand for and have now entered a popularity contest with those "conservative" parties on the center right.

Pic related, the Spanish Prime Minister:

 

[Synobun]

It might just be me, but I think you're overreacting.

I don't think I am.

When someone asks "What is the distinction between x and y?" and someone answers, the correct follow-up is "Okay", not "No, I don't like that. They should share the same identifier."

 

[Arakhor]

I don't think it's too controversial to say that some of the LGBT colour combinations are frightful

 

[Synobun]

I don't think it's too controversial to say that some of the LGBT colour combinations are frightful

Oh, totally. Most are design nightmares.

 

[Takhisis]

I don't think I am.

When someone asks "What is the distinction between x and y?" and someone answers, the correct follow-up is "Okay", not "No, I don't like that. They should share the same identifier."

So you don't agree with people disagreeing with you? because 8at least to me) TF's posts read to me as ‘OK, I understand what you're saying, but I still disagree with it.’. I think.

I don't think it's too controversial to say that some of the LGBT colour combinations are frightful

Oh, totally. Most are design nightmares.

At least we all agree on that, then.

 

[Synobun]

You can't disagree with it if you understand what I'm saying, though.

 

[Takhisis]

Maybe I just need to chill out after reading an allcaps wall'o'text from luiz.

 

[Synobun]

Maybe I just need to chill out after reading an allcaps wall'o'text from luiz.

It's cruise control for cool!

 

[Snerk]

Yes, I get your general feeling, but all you are really doing is marginalizing the struggles of the people that are already suffering the most. Also, I think you are generalizing a bit too harshly. The socialists and the "new left" kinda won out in Spain, didn't they? I agree though that "social democrat" parties are failing. But those are hardly leftist anymore. The social democrats have become "progress" loving, globalization supporting, wishy washy centrists who abandoned all they used to stand for and have now entered a popularity contest with those "conservative" parties on the center right.

Pic related, the Spanish Prime Minister:

Oh their struggle is real, I'm not marginalising it. But I am saying that like it or not the left need to allow different takes on these issues if they want to make an impact. If it's my way or the highway on cultural sosial issues, and they are in the center of attention, they'll continue to lose elections and we're left with Trumps.

I forgot about Spain. Sorry Spain. That was good news but they didn't win an election per se and don't have enough seats to create a stable platform. Here's hoping it'll work out though.