Kaiser_Berger
Terran Emporer
I'll get to this tomorrow evening.
LK80 - Science Experiment, Carthage, Deity
- Thread starter LKendter
- Start date
Kaiser_Berger
Terran Emporer
Preturn- We're fine.
T1 730
Rusicade founded.
T2 710
Oea founded.
T3 690
Nothing much
T4 670
Nothing
T5 650
Nothing.
T6 630
Nothing
T7 610
Nothing new
T8 590
Turn down research to get max cash before lit is learned.
T9 570
Lit comes in and we have a monopoly. I go through all the calculations, and the research cost is about 900 beakers for Republic. Brokering Lit can't get us a deal that fits the variant rules, so I seel it for all its worth because it appears Babylon almost has it done. We get a couple hundred gold and 5gpt for it.
Republic is due in 24 turns at 80%.
T10 550
Not much
Summary
As our libraries come online, things should speed up a bit. The Iroquois are huge. Best keep an eye on them.
T1 730
Rusicade founded.
T2 710
Oea founded.
T3 690
Nothing much
T4 670
Nothing
T5 650
Nothing.
T6 630
Nothing
T7 610
Nothing new
T8 590
Turn down research to get max cash before lit is learned.
T9 570
Lit comes in and we have a monopoly. I go through all the calculations, and the research cost is about 900 beakers for Republic. Brokering Lit can't get us a deal that fits the variant rules, so I seel it for all its worth because it appears Babylon almost has it done. We get a couple hundred gold and 5gpt for it.
Republic is due in 24 turns at 80%.
T10 550
Not much
Summary
As our libraries come online, things should speed up a bit. The Iroquois are huge. Best keep an eye on them.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,064
Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing) Suffering from a feast. Holiday skips and vacation bring this back to quickly.
Microbe (on deck)
hotrod0823
Kaiser_Berger
Greebley (vacation Nov 20 to Nov 30)
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
LKendter (currently playing) Suffering from a feast. Holiday skips and vacation bring this back to quickly.
Microbe (on deck)
hotrod0823
Kaiser_Berger
Greebley (vacation Nov 20 to Nov 30)
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,064
550 BC
The odds of losing $550 to demands is almost zero, so I up science to get Republic sooner. It is so strange to be ahead of 3 AI civs at the start of the Middle Ages.
I really don't like the way our cities are placed, but the ugly cities already have completed buildings.
530 BC
(IT) The Iroquois complete the Mausoleum.
510 BC
We haven't built a single embassy.
I build one with the Ottomans and they are suffering from no luxuries. It is size 4, not growing, no buildings, and working on the Hanging Gardens. The defense is 3 lousy spears.
I build one with the Iroquois and they have 4 luxuries. It is size 11, 29 shields during their GA (3 shield forest); most buildings are complete along with the Pyramids and Temple of Artemis. The defense is 7 pikemen.
The last one is with nearby Babylon. It is size 7, no buildings, working on Sun Tzu. The defense is 5 spears and 1 swordsman. They only have 3 luxuries.
430 BC
I check and we still need ~413 beakers to complete Republic. I ship Currency and $118 to Persia and get Republic saving 7 turns. I curse the RnG as we get the maximum 8 turns.
390 BC
It never hurts to have Monarchy as a standby tech. I ships Republic to the Celts for Monarchy, $3/turn and $26.
The anarchy is a pain as I have to switch every citizen to scientist to determine the cost of Monotheism being over 1100 beakers (33 scientists need 12 turns). That confirms that I can ship Persia Monarch, $4/turn and $312 and get Monotheism.
370 BC
(IT) The monster Iroquois civ completes Sun Tzu. I don't like #1 in land having all vet troops.
350 BC
(IT) Babylon completes Zeus. I am actually to see them get it as the Iroquois have ivory.
330 BC
(IT) Babylon also completes the Great Library.
290 BC
(IT) The Ottomans rip of $20.
Babylon is buildings Leo's. We are starting to fall behind for tech.
The Celtic Republic is formed.
270 BC
Utica gets a scientist, and we can run at 10% luxuries. I can't justify 20% for just one city.
==========================
Summary:
I played 15 turns to get us past the anarchy.
We aren't in to bad of shape with the tech race. We are ahead of 3 civs, and even with Persia. Buildings are good as several more complete the next round.
Our main weakness is a pathetic military. We should build a few more mercs, and one the iron is connected some swords wouldn't hurt. If the Iroquois sneezed our way we would be destroyed at the moment.
We need irrigation at several cities. Sabratha can use the iron hills and Tundra forest with irrigation. Leptis Magna has hills to use, and I would like Hippo to work the gem mountains and that requires irrigation.
Signed up:
LKendter
Microbe (currently playing)
hotrod0823 (on deck)
Kaiser_Berger
Greebley (vacation Nov 20 to Nov 30)
Variant rules:
1) We must self-research at maximum positive cash flow. We are still allowed to turn down research the last turn.
2) We may not build the GL, and raze the city with the GL. This rule expires when we own education.
3) We may shut of research temporarily with the ToE if NO mandatory techs can be completed before the ToE is done.
4) Minimum research is not allowed.
5) We may only buy techs from the AI if the cash we pay is 50% or less of the self-research cost. The remaining 50% can be from techs we own, luxuries, resources or peace treaty. This amount is the raw dollar amount. If research is a total of $80, then buying is a total of $40 max. To check the value of a tech is easy. If 12 beakers give writing in 23 turns, then the estimated cost is $276.
6) We can't trade away our only resource / luxury to get techs.
7) When in doubt remember the goal - to test if self-research is really that bad at deity.
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/LK80-250BC.zip
The odds of losing $550 to demands is almost zero, so I up science to get Republic sooner. It is so strange to be ahead of 3 AI civs at the start of the Middle Ages.
I really don't like the way our cities are placed, but the ugly cities already have completed buildings.
530 BC
(IT) The Iroquois complete the Mausoleum.
510 BC
We haven't built a single embassy.
I build one with the Ottomans and they are suffering from no luxuries. It is size 4, not growing, no buildings, and working on the Hanging Gardens. The defense is 3 lousy spears.
I build one with the Iroquois and they have 4 luxuries. It is size 11, 29 shields during their GA (3 shield forest); most buildings are complete along with the Pyramids and Temple of Artemis. The defense is 7 pikemen.
The last one is with nearby Babylon. It is size 7, no buildings, working on Sun Tzu. The defense is 5 spears and 1 swordsman. They only have 3 luxuries.
430 BC
I check and we still need ~413 beakers to complete Republic. I ship Currency and $118 to Persia and get Republic saving 7 turns. I curse the RnG as we get the maximum 8 turns.
390 BC
It never hurts to have Monarchy as a standby tech. I ships Republic to the Celts for Monarchy, $3/turn and $26.
The anarchy is a pain as I have to switch every citizen to scientist to determine the cost of Monotheism being over 1100 beakers (33 scientists need 12 turns). That confirms that I can ship Persia Monarch, $4/turn and $312 and get Monotheism.
370 BC
(IT) The monster Iroquois civ completes Sun Tzu. I don't like #1 in land having all vet troops.
350 BC
(IT) Babylon completes Zeus. I am actually to see them get it as the Iroquois have ivory.
330 BC
(IT) Babylon also completes the Great Library.
290 BC
(IT) The Ottomans rip of $20.
Babylon is buildings Leo's. We are starting to fall behind for tech.
The Celtic Republic is formed.
270 BC
Utica gets a scientist, and we can run at 10% luxuries. I can't justify 20% for just one city.
==========================
Summary:
I played 15 turns to get us past the anarchy.
We aren't in to bad of shape with the tech race. We are ahead of 3 civs, and even with Persia. Buildings are good as several more complete the next round.
Our main weakness is a pathetic military. We should build a few more mercs, and one the iron is connected some swords wouldn't hurt. If the Iroquois sneezed our way we would be destroyed at the moment.
We need irrigation at several cities. Sabratha can use the iron hills and Tundra forest with irrigation. Leptis Magna has hills to use, and I would like Hippo to work the gem mountains and that requires irrigation.
Signed up:
LKendter
Microbe (currently playing)
hotrod0823 (on deck)
Kaiser_Berger
Greebley (vacation Nov 20 to Nov 30)
Variant rules:
1) We must self-research at maximum positive cash flow. We are still allowed to turn down research the last turn.
2) We may not build the GL, and raze the city with the GL. This rule expires when we own education.
3) We may shut of research temporarily with the ToE if NO mandatory techs can be completed before the ToE is done.
4) Minimum research is not allowed.
5) We may only buy techs from the AI if the cash we pay is 50% or less of the self-research cost. The remaining 50% can be from techs we own, luxuries, resources or peace treaty. This amount is the raw dollar amount. If research is a total of $80, then buying is a total of $40 max. To check the value of a tech is easy. If 12 beakers give writing in 23 turns, then the estimated cost is $276.
6) We can't trade away our only resource / luxury to get techs.
7) When in doubt remember the goal - to test if self-research is really that bad at deity.
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/LK80-250BC.zip
microbe
Cascaded Mansion
- Joined
- Nov 16, 2003
- Messages
- 4,596
preturn: tech wise we are doing OK. Russia seems to be very behind, so we could use its free tech after Theology is done.
We are short of workers - Utica has two BGs unimproved. Same for Theveste.
IBT we connect iron. Ottoman completes Hanging Gardens.
170BC: I disband a warrior trapped among AI borders.
IBT Iro and Persia MA against Celts.
150BC: Celts gets Feudalism but lacks Monotheism. It asks for Mono plus ~56gpt, so no trade. Hopefully after we get Theology..
I have to hire scientist in Carthage. I start cathedral.
IBT Russia demands Polytheism, and I give to her. It needs Currency to enter Middle Ages.
130BC: Persia has Feudalism. I think it's time so I gift Russia to Middle Ages. She gets Feudalism as well.
So I just get it by Mono+Republic+Monarchy.
110BC: Babylon jumps on the dogpile on Celts too. Iro starts Knights Templar.
90BC: Ottomans joins the camp too. We may just prepare to take on Ottomans?
70BC: with more growth I have to raise lux to 20.
IBT Iro demands 22g and we pay. Babylon demands 21g and we pay.
50BC: Theology in 4 turns. Iro/Otto/Bab all have it, and other AIs are even with us except China.
I think I missed a trading oppertunity with Celts. I could have sold Monotheism to it for about 13gpt+wines/horses and I waited to see which tech it might come up with.
I didn't build any military, as we constantly need more infra, and AI are busy fighting anyway. But Carthage will complete cathedral in 4 turns and then can start fully on military. I think we need to take Ottomans.
We are short of workers - Utica has two BGs unimproved. Same for Theveste.
IBT we connect iron. Ottoman completes Hanging Gardens.
170BC: I disband a warrior trapped among AI borders.
IBT Iro and Persia MA against Celts.
150BC: Celts gets Feudalism but lacks Monotheism. It asks for Mono plus ~56gpt, so no trade. Hopefully after we get Theology..
I have to hire scientist in Carthage. I start cathedral.
IBT Russia demands Polytheism, and I give to her. It needs Currency to enter Middle Ages.
130BC: Persia has Feudalism. I think it's time so I gift Russia to Middle Ages. She gets Feudalism as well.
So I just get it by Mono+Republic+Monarchy.110BC: Babylon jumps on the dogpile on Celts too. Iro starts Knights Templar.
90BC: Ottomans joins the camp too. We may just prepare to take on Ottomans?
70BC: with more growth I have to raise lux to 20.
IBT Iro demands 22g and we pay. Babylon demands 21g and we pay.
50BC: Theology in 4 turns. Iro/Otto/Bab all have it, and other AIs are even with us except China.
I think I missed a trading oppertunity with Celts. I could have sold Monotheism to it for about 13gpt+wines/horses and I waited to see which tech it might come up with.
I didn't build any military, as we constantly need more infra, and AI are busy fighting anyway. But Carthage will complete cathedral in 4 turns and then can start fully on military. I think we need to take Ottomans.
hotrod0823
Deity
Got it and will play tomorrow night
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,064
Signed up:
LKendter
Microbe
hotrod0823 (currently playing)
Kaiser_Berger (on deck)
Greebley
Variant rules:
1) We must self-research at maximum positive cash flow. We are still allowed to turn down research the last turn.
2) We may not build the GL, and raze the city with the GL. This rule expires when we own education.
3) We may shut of research temporarily with the ToE if NO mandatory techs can be completed before the ToE is done.
4) Minimum research is not allowed.
5) We may only buy techs from the AI if the cash we pay is 50% or less of the self-research cost. The remaining 50% can be from techs we own, luxuries, resources or peace treaty. This amount is the raw dollar amount. If research is a total of $80, then buying is a total of $40 max. To check the value of a tech is easy. If 12 beakers give writing in 23 turns, then the estimated cost is $276.
6) We can't trade away our only resource / luxury to get techs.
7) When in doubt remember the goal - to test if self-research is really that bad at deity.
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
LKendter
Microbe
hotrod0823 (currently playing)
Kaiser_Berger (on deck)
Greebley
Variant rules:
1) We must self-research at maximum positive cash flow. We are still allowed to turn down research the last turn.
2) We may not build the GL, and raze the city with the GL. This rule expires when we own education.
3) We may shut of research temporarily with the ToE if NO mandatory techs can be completed before the ToE is done.
4) Minimum research is not allowed.
5) We may only buy techs from the AI if the cash we pay is 50% or less of the self-research cost. The remaining 50% can be from techs we own, luxuries, resources or peace treaty. This amount is the raw dollar amount. If research is a total of $80, then buying is a total of $40 max. To check the value of a tech is easy. If 12 beakers give writing in 23 turns, then the estimated cost is $276.
6) We can't trade away our only resource / luxury to get techs.
7) When in doubt remember the goal - to test if self-research is really that bad at deity.
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
I am back.
hotrod0823
Deity
LK80
50BC(0): We are making exclusively infrastructure but need military will try to get some buildings done but get some units out too. The Iroquois are a monster and hope they will just leave us alone. Change Utica to a MDI from a Cath. Sell backwards Moa Polytheism for horses and 40 gold. Send Persia silks and 40 gold for furs. Drop lux to 10% and up research to 60% shaving 1 turn off of Theology.
30BC (1): Utica completes the MDI. Starts a Merc. Not much else, theo in 2 turns.
10 BC (2): Leptis Minor builds a temple starts baracks. Iroquios build Sistenes. Theo next turn with +10gpt.
10 AD (3): Theology comes in and start on Printing Press, due in 11 turns cost ~1200. Theveste builds a Barracks starts on a Merc. Babylon starts on Leos.
30 AD (4): Carthage builds a cathedral and starts a Merc. Utica builds a Merc starts another. Not much, no tech deals. The leaders keep leading and the laggers haven't gotten anything worth trading.
50 AD (5): Hippo builds a library starts on a cat. Little else. PP due in 9 turns.
70 AD (6): Carthage builds a merc starts another. Babylon builds knights Templar. Iroquios are pulling away and start on Cops. Celts have Chivalry now. Persia just got Engineering and Chivalry and has Theology. Trade Theology to the Celts with 25 gold for Chivalry. Change Utica to a knight.
90 AD (7): Leptis builds a market starts on Granary. No more.
110 AD (8): Carthage builds a merc starts on a Knight. Theveste builds a Merc starts a courthouse. Hippo builds a cat starts a Market. Rusicade builds a library starts a worker. PP is due in 5. Spend 57 gold and get a Persian Embassy. 3 spears in the Capital.
130 AD (9): Leptis builds a barracks starts a Merc. Russia now has Engineering but not Theology so send Theo, 4gpt and 18 gold to her for Engineering.
150 AD (10): Ottomans and Celts make peace. Russia just got Printing Press, now due in 2 turns. Our first knight will come off next turn. Will have to raise lux for Utica.
50BC(0): We are making exclusively infrastructure but need military will try to get some buildings done but get some units out too. The Iroquois are a monster and hope they will just leave us alone. Change Utica to a MDI from a Cath. Sell backwards Moa Polytheism for horses and 40 gold. Send Persia silks and 40 gold for furs. Drop lux to 10% and up research to 60% shaving 1 turn off of Theology.
30BC (1): Utica completes the MDI. Starts a Merc. Not much else, theo in 2 turns.
10 BC (2): Leptis Minor builds a temple starts baracks. Iroquios build Sistenes. Theo next turn with +10gpt.
10 AD (3): Theology comes in and start on Printing Press, due in 11 turns cost ~1200. Theveste builds a Barracks starts on a Merc. Babylon starts on Leos.
30 AD (4): Carthage builds a cathedral and starts a Merc. Utica builds a Merc starts another. Not much, no tech deals. The leaders keep leading and the laggers haven't gotten anything worth trading.
50 AD (5): Hippo builds a library starts on a cat. Little else. PP due in 9 turns.
70 AD (6): Carthage builds a merc starts another. Babylon builds knights Templar. Iroquios are pulling away and start on Cops. Celts have Chivalry now. Persia just got Engineering and Chivalry and has Theology. Trade Theology to the Celts with 25 gold for Chivalry. Change Utica to a knight.
90 AD (7): Leptis builds a market starts on Granary. No more.
110 AD (8): Carthage builds a merc starts on a Knight. Theveste builds a Merc starts a courthouse. Hippo builds a cat starts a Market. Rusicade builds a library starts a worker. PP is due in 5. Spend 57 gold and get a Persian Embassy. 3 spears in the Capital.
130 AD (9): Leptis builds a barracks starts a Merc. Russia now has Engineering but not Theology so send Theo, 4gpt and 18 gold to her for Engineering.
150 AD (10): Ottomans and Celts make peace. Russia just got Printing Press, now due in 2 turns. Our first knight will come off next turn. Will have to raise lux for Utica.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,064
I am glad Hotrod made this trade, as I didn't even get a chance to post my comments from 50BC to do something with the silks to not suffer from a demand. Please keep these trades to just getting luxuries from distant civ until navigation is around. Don't risk a credit deal when getting anything from the AI.
Why printing press? The trade value is so low, and it is an optional tech. With Russia getting this first it was a wasted effort. Education and universities to help our research would have helped more. We might have been first to banking after that.
At least we are moving forward. I notice we got theology, chivalry, and engineering in 10 turns.
hotrod0823
Deity
I didn't expect Russia to get it first. In other games PP has been useful in trade but Education would've been a been a better choice.
Kaiser_Berger
Terran Emporer
I've got it.
Kaiser_Berger
Terran Emporer
Preturn- We look alright
IT- zzz
T1 170
Nothing much to do.
IT- Persia declares on the Iroquois. We discover PP. We start on Education which is only known by Babylon and the Iroquois. Due in 15 turns.
T2 190
We can't trade PP for anything right now.
IT- China and Iroquois ally against the Celts.
T3 210
The Iroquois are swallowing the Celts whole. Looks like we might end up with another runaway civ problem.
IT- The Iroquois and Celts thankfully sign peace.
T4 230
Nothing new.
IT- Our curragh ended in a sea tile last turn, and it hit the bottom. Oh well, more room for other units on our budget.
T5 250
Nothing new.
IT- The Iroquois complete Leo's.
T6 260
Utica is unhappy, but raising lux for one city doesn't seem wise, so it gets a scientist.
IT- Russia and Iroquois allign against Persia. Babylon starts Copernicus, and then finishes it immediately. SGL perhaps?
T7 270
Not much.
IT- Now Iroquois get Ottomans in against Persia.
T8 280
Nothing New.
IT- zzz
T9 290
Not much.
IT- Iroquois complete Magellans.
T10 300
Our horses deal just expired with China. We can get them back with either Monotheism or Feudalism. I raise lux to 20% as more and more cities are requiring scientists.
Summary
We're 6 turns from Education. Persia and Russia still lack it, so we can likely pull a deal for Invention when it comes in. We're up to 4 knights now, with more rolling off the line.
IT- zzz
T1 170
Nothing much to do.
IT- Persia declares on the Iroquois. We discover PP. We start on Education which is only known by Babylon and the Iroquois. Due in 15 turns.
T2 190
We can't trade PP for anything right now.
IT- China and Iroquois ally against the Celts.
T3 210
The Iroquois are swallowing the Celts whole. Looks like we might end up with another runaway civ problem.
IT- The Iroquois and Celts thankfully sign peace.
T4 230
Nothing new.
IT- Our curragh ended in a sea tile last turn, and it hit the bottom. Oh well, more room for other units on our budget.
T5 250
Nothing new.
IT- The Iroquois complete Leo's.
T6 260
Utica is unhappy, but raising lux for one city doesn't seem wise, so it gets a scientist.
IT- Russia and Iroquois allign against Persia. Babylon starts Copernicus, and then finishes it immediately. SGL perhaps?
T7 270
Not much.
IT- Now Iroquois get Ottomans in against Persia.
T8 280
Nothing New.
IT- zzz
T9 290
Not much.
IT- Iroquois complete Magellans.
T10 300
Our horses deal just expired with China. We can get them back with either Monotheism or Feudalism. I raise lux to 20% as more and more cities are requiring scientists.
Summary
We're 6 turns from Education. Persia and Russia still lack it, so we can likely pull a deal for Invention when it comes in. We're up to 4 knights now, with more rolling off the line.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,064
Signed up:
LKendter (on deck)
Microbe
hotrod0823
Kaiser_Berger
Greebley (currently playing)
Variant rules:
1) We must self-research at maximum positive cash flow. We are still allowed to turn down research the last turn.
2) We may not build the GL, and raze the city with the GL. This rule expires when we own education.
3) We may shut of research temporarily with the ToE if NO mandatory techs can be completed before the ToE is done.
4) Minimum research is not allowed.
5) We may only buy techs from the AI if the cash we pay is 50% or less of the self-research cost. The remaining 50% can be from techs we own, luxuries, resources or peace treaty. This amount is the raw dollar amount. If research is a total of $80, then buying is a total of $40 max. To check the value of a tech is easy. If 12 beakers give writing in 23 turns, then the estimated cost is $276.
6) We can't trade away our only resource / luxury to get techs.
7) When in doubt remember the goal - to test if self-research is really that bad at deity.
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
LKendter (on deck)
Microbe
hotrod0823
Kaiser_Berger
Greebley (currently playing)
Variant rules:
1) We must self-research at maximum positive cash flow. We are still allowed to turn down research the last turn.
2) We may not build the GL, and raze the city with the GL. This rule expires when we own education.
3) We may shut of research temporarily with the ToE if NO mandatory techs can be completed before the ToE is done.
4) Minimum research is not allowed.
5) We may only buy techs from the AI if the cash we pay is 50% or less of the self-research cost. The remaining 50% can be from techs we own, luxuries, resources or peace treaty. This amount is the raw dollar amount. If research is a total of $80, then buying is a total of $40 max. To check the value of a tech is easy. If 12 beakers give writing in 23 turns, then the estimated cost is $276.
6) We can't trade away our only resource / luxury to get techs.
7) When in doubt remember the goal - to test if self-research is really that bad at deity.
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Ok, I got it.
I need to quit for the night and had two issues I was not fully sure what I thought was best (especially since I was away and may have missed some discussion). So here is a partial report and two questions. I will play tomorrow taking into account any posts since then.
-----------
Preturn:
Raise Science to 60% to get education in 4. That will increase our chance of being able to trade with Russia and I see no reason not to spend our current money on science.
Trade Monotheism to China for Horses and chump change.
Sell our world map to Iroquois for 10 gold. Iroquois have Navigation.
We will want to keep an eye on Iroquois culture. They have very high culture for this early in the game. I check and they are gaining 350 culture a turn. Unmolested, they should be able to get a culture win by 1750 (counting increase for doubling and more buildings) - earlier if they continue to grow.
Switch Theveste to a knight and Ruscade to a barracks. Oea really needs an aquaduct.
Rather than lose our gems to a demand, I trade them to the Ottomans for 5 gpt. This is under their value and we should renegotiate in 20 turns. Otherwise a far away civ will demand them from us. Note that I did a pure gpt deal which may keep our rep intact if the Ottomans are destroyed in the next 20 turns.
IBT: Have to kick in 63 gold to keep the silks for furs deal.
Early: Iroquois start Shakespeares. We can lower science so we still get Education in 4 even though we spent the gold above. We are now low enough gold that we need to run a non-negative gold amount so demands don't bankrupt us (we are now +2 gold).
Grr! Russia gets Education the exact same turn we do so no trade for invention
Phew! Fortunately, Persia has invention too but still lacks Education so I can make the trade (need to throw in 12 gpt and 23 gold).
Iroqouis are at war with the Celts (MA with Babylon).
-------------------
Since I need to go to bed I will stop here(340 AD). I am unsure on what to research:
We can research:
Music Theory in 18 turns - noone has it.
Astronomy in 21 turns - Babylon and Iroquois have it.
Banking in 20 turns - Babylon and Iroqois have it.
Gunpowder in 15 turns - Babylon, Iroqouis, Ottomans, and Persia have it.
Russia is tied in tech with us.
Celts lack Education.
Backward China lacks Feudalism and Theology.
-----------------------------
Also, I am building Knights rather than Markets. I would like to grab some Ottoman lands in 16 turns (when deals end) so we have the strength to take on the Iroquois. We currently have 7 knights (I would have 11 or 12 by the end of my turn) Do people think we should be building Markets first instead?
-----------
Preturn:
Raise Science to 60% to get education in 4. That will increase our chance of being able to trade with Russia and I see no reason not to spend our current money on science.
Trade Monotheism to China for Horses and chump change.
Sell our world map to Iroquois for 10 gold. Iroquois have Navigation.
We will want to keep an eye on Iroquois culture. They have very high culture for this early in the game. I check and they are gaining 350 culture a turn. Unmolested, they should be able to get a culture win by 1750 (counting increase for doubling and more buildings) - earlier if they continue to grow.
Switch Theveste to a knight and Ruscade to a barracks. Oea really needs an aquaduct.
Rather than lose our gems to a demand, I trade them to the Ottomans for 5 gpt. This is under their value and we should renegotiate in 20 turns. Otherwise a far away civ will demand them from us. Note that I did a pure gpt deal which may keep our rep intact if the Ottomans are destroyed in the next 20 turns.
IBT: Have to kick in 63 gold to keep the silks for furs deal.
Early: Iroquois start Shakespeares. We can lower science so we still get Education in 4 even though we spent the gold above. We are now low enough gold that we need to run a non-negative gold amount so demands don't bankrupt us (we are now +2 gold).
Grr! Russia gets Education the exact same turn we do so no trade for invention
Phew! Fortunately, Persia has invention too but still lacks Education so I can make the trade (need to throw in 12 gpt and 23 gold).
Iroqouis are at war with the Celts (MA with Babylon).
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Since I need to go to bed I will stop here(340 AD). I am unsure on what to research:
We can research:
Music Theory in 18 turns - noone has it.
Astronomy in 21 turns - Babylon and Iroquois have it.
Banking in 20 turns - Babylon and Iroqois have it.
Gunpowder in 15 turns - Babylon, Iroqouis, Ottomans, and Persia have it.
Russia is tied in tech with us.
Celts lack Education.
Backward China lacks Feudalism and Theology.
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Also, I am building Knights rather than Markets. I would like to grab some Ottoman lands in 16 turns (when deals end) so we have the strength to take on the Iroquois. We currently have 7 knights (I would have 11 or 12 by the end of my turn) Do people think we should be building Markets first instead?
hotrod0823
Deity
Personally I think the knights are more valuable right now but I think we should be building markets/universities even in our non-barracks cities. Not sure how non-vet knights will fair against muskets.
If possible maybe we can strike a balance and bring some markets on board and continue amassing knights.
As far as research - I have already guess wrong and it cost us 2 times so I am hesistant to say but I think MT has its avantages. It has a wonder associated with it so may fetch some trade value but maybe a better move is going fior what we can use immediately like guns or banking.
Hotrod
If possible maybe we can strike a balance and bring some markets on board and continue amassing knights.
As far as research - I have already guess wrong and it cost us 2 times so I am hesistant to say but I think MT has its avantages. It has a wonder associated with it so may fetch some trade value but maybe a better move is going fior what we can use immediately like guns or banking.
Hotrod
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,064
We don't need to take much from the Ottomans to help. I would be happy razing the culture overlap city and getting one more city site. I really would like to be able to build the FP. The only reason I would go heavy is if the Ottomans are getting dog piled.
If we hit the Ottomans I want that BEFORE Sipahi, as they eat Muskets for lunch. I don't want to hurt the Ottomans much, as I would like to introduce the Iroquois to Sipahi.
This is a rough call. Since we don't want to build Bach's, I would NOT waste our time on Music Theory. If another AI gets it we have another worthless tech for no gain.
To many civs have gunpowder, so I doubt we will get any trade value.
I think the AI prefers Astronomy over Banking, so I would go with Banking.
I agree with Lee's reasoning and will go for banking.
Decide to have 1 market building (so we will eventually get them all). We are having troubles keeping research at 50%.
Late:
Iroquois and Russia MA vs the Celts.
Iroquois start Smith's. Babylons start Smith's the next turn.
Pretty quiet for the most part.
Notes:
9 turns to banking. I have Taxmen in Oea to get to 0 gpt. If we can put those to work, we can can get Oea's aqauduct a turn earlier. I just didn't want to run negative.
There were no demands my whole turn.
Set some slower producing towns to Trebuchets. My hope was to lessen losses in the eventual war.
We have 10 knights, 2 Trebuchets, and one MDI. Theveste is building its Market.
Decide to have 1 market building (so we will eventually get them all). We are having troubles keeping research at 50%.
Late:
Iroquois and Russia MA vs the Celts.
Iroquois start Smith's. Babylons start Smith's the next turn.
Pretty quiet for the most part.
Notes:
9 turns to banking. I have Taxmen in Oea to get to 0 gpt. If we can put those to work, we can can get Oea's aqauduct a turn earlier. I just didn't want to run negative.
There were no demands my whole turn.
Set some slower producing towns to Trebuchets. My hope was to lessen losses in the eventual war.
We have 10 knights, 2 Trebuchets, and one MDI. Theveste is building its Market.
