Lo5 01 - The Puppetmaster

pneuma said:
Got the save, will play tonight.

Thanks for giving me and TimBentley three hours to get the save before you skipped us. And without telling us.

Next time, please don't consider me absent because I haven't been posting much. I know I've been quiet recently but I have been here, just haven't had much to say. I just realized the order seemed a bit out of whack (Lo5 -> Frrosch -> Pneuma -> Anar -> Lo5?), and I double-checked the roster and realized you skipped me and Tim.

Next time, please don't skip me without waiting the full 24 hours.

Thanks.
 
Good, let's see how we do:

Preturn 330 AD:
Lux- and Science slider is ok, I do some micro-management to avoid wasting shields in Izmit.
Switch Jim Hensen from library to courthouse as it isn't producing any beakers atm.

Ok, let's go now:

IBT:
Carthage asks me out of their territory.
Edrine finishes market, starts barracks.
Izmit finishes Aqueduct, starts library.

Turn 1 340 AD:
MM back to Izmit doing 10spt.
Worker spots a greek hoplite/settler pair in spanish territory.

IBT:
Antalyas borders expand.
Mugla finishes Courthouse, starts barracks.
Our people improve our palace.
America starts building Sun Tzus

Turn 2 350 AD:
Science down to 30%, Engineering is finished next turn.

IBT:
Engineering finishes, start Invention
Selfishville finishes market, starts knight.
Aydyn's borders expand.
Konya finishes market, starts knight.
Carthage starts building Sun Tzus.

Turn 3 360 AD:
Science back to 40%, Invention is done in 14 turns at +10gpt.
Buy theology and 13 gold for Engineering from our puppet.
Greece and Spain already got Education, but I can't buy it. That means, anyway, that the GL is worthless.

Turn 4 370 AD:
Nothing important.

IBT:
Izmit finishes library, starts Trebuchet.
Aydin finishes market, starts Trebuchet.

Turn 5 380 AD:
I buy Education from the Greek for Engineering, 102 gold and 11 gpt. We're still doing +1 gpt.
Now we're the most advanced civ together with greece and spain, all others are in the beginning of the Middle Ages, except Germany, they are still in the AA.

IBT:
Edrine finishes barracks, starts Trebuchet.

Turn 6 390 AD:
only MMing and moving workers.

IBT:
Bursa finishes market, starts barracks and expands.
Germany enters MA.

Turn 7 400 AD:
Still nothing to do.

IBT:
Spanish worker enters our territory, probably to move towards the spanish cities north of us.
Guiseppe finishes knight, starts another one.
Izmit finishes Treb, starts knight, expands.
Seville finishes... oh, damn, don't know the english name. Knights of the Temple? Templar Knights? Dunno, hope you know what I mean. Now they are "only" building 2 wonders, Sun Tzus and Michelangelos.
Greece starts building Michelangelos.

Turn 8 410 AD:
guess what? Nothing to do again.

IBT:
Edrine finishes Trebuchet, starts another one.

Turn 9 420 AD:
Worker moving, MMing, that's it.

IBT:
Aydin finishes Treb, starts harbour.
Toledo finishes Sun Tzus.
Greek starts Michelangelos.

Turn 10 430 AD:
zzz



The greek settler pairs have dissapeared for the moment but you should still take care of blocking them if they come back.
The only thing to do atm is choosing buildings, MMing and wating for Sipahis.
You could import luxuries from Arabia, dunno how much it would cost, you can check this out.
 

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More likely pneuma just was mistaken regarding the order, so I'll post it as a reminder:

TheLoneMan - up
TimBentley - on deck
Pneuma
Anar
Lo5
Frrosch - just played

Knights Templar bodes well for Spain militarily. The fog-busters up north don't need to bust fog anymore.
 
OK I am HERE, am not going to say "got it" because I haven't dl'd the save yet, but I'll be playing within 48 hours.
 
Wow, guys, I'm so sorry.

I'm going to have to be skipped. My mom's liver cancer just intensified and I've been in the hospital for the past two days.

Really sorry this happened, right after I made such a big deal about getting skipped.

Hopefully her health will improve soon and I can be back in it.
 
430(0): Interesting: Spanish workers in Ottoman land and Ottoman workers in Spain
move the former fog-busters to more useful places
Switch Edrine from treb to knight: do we want our sipahi to wait on trebs/cannons?
switch Selfishville to aqueduct
extra shield in Kafa
switch taxman to scientist
sell monotheism to Arabia for ivory, furs, 6g, allowing 10% lux

IBT: Selfishville loves me
Kafa aqueduct->market

440(1): Spain knows astronomy

IBT: America demands chivalry, some WH can't hurt, and they can't reach us, so refuse, they declare
Bursa rax->worker (it has more food than it needs)
Aydin loves me
Mugla rax->knight

450(2): switch Izmit to market

IBT: Jiri Trnka aqueduct->market
Konya knight->knight
Spain starts Copernicus

460(3): Greece knows astronomy

IBT: learn invention, start on gunpowder
sell invention to Spain for astronomy, 1g
Bursa worker->university

470(4): switch 3 cities to universities
Interesting: German archers fortified in American land because they're trapped due to New Orleans

IBT: Selfishville aqueduct->university
Spain starts Leo's
Greece starts Copernicus

480(5): zzz

IBT: Skoupa aqueduct->market

490(6): zzz

IBT: Edrine university->knight

500(7): zzz

IBT: Giuseppe university->knight
Antalya aqueduct->market

510(8): zzz

IBT: Greece starts Leo's
America starts Sistine

520(9): Spain knows gunpowder, they want a lot for it

IBT: Izmit market->university
Aydin harbor->university

530(10): sell engineering to Celts for 2 workers, 39g

Notes: could buy gunpowder from Spain for 30gpt, 289g, or after one more turn of research buy it for all gold and a couple gpt (the former would be better for Spain, the latter better for us)
America would buy invention or education (I'd suggest invention, since they're probably researching it) for peace, 96g, 27gpt, but that would cause 10% lux to be required (20gpt)
 
Okay, I'm back in town after a small delay. Sorry about skipping a few people a while back. I guess I've demonstrated that I'm more than a little forgetfull. It won't happen again.

Playing now (no, really)




edit: Open up itunes, wait for it to load, choose some good civ 3 music, open up civ 3, wait for that to load, "okay nooma*, focus this time," skip the intro, start a new game, realise that is not what I was about to do, close new game screen, open save folder, open SG folder, open Lo5 1 folder, aaannnd... I forgot to get the save, which doesn't exist. Will check this again some point later today.







*not my real name
 
T0 530 AD
Turn science down to 3.7.0 (still getting gunpowder in 2 turns)
Decide not to make peace with america since they won't cross the channel until astronomy, and we've made contact with everyone so losing the Cheeseburgerbeast won't be a major loss.

IBT
The cheeseburgerbeast beats an vet american galley but is redlined, and there is another one turn away.
Isabella asks for 33 gold and doesn't get it (no war, still polite)

T1 540
With our victory during the IBT, America will make peace for 40g. Since next turn the price will be higher, I agree.

IBT
Gunpowder in, start chemistry (8 turns losing 42gpt)
Edrine knight>knight

T2 550
There is saltpeter on a mountain outside Konya, and in the desert outside Salonika (not in our borders yet)

T3 560
Nothing

IBT
Bursa university>knight

T4 570
Nothing

IBT Giuseppe knight->knight

T5 580
Send 3 knights to Jiri Trnka so they can chase after boats

IBT
Konya university>granary

T6 590
Our economy is successfully destroyed. Science down to 4.5.1 so we don't go bankrupt (1 more turn for chem, we need to save up for upgrades from now on)

IBT
Alex "asks" for 20g and declares when I say no. 2 swords move towards Kafa, an archer goes after our spanish workers.
Edrine knight>knight

T7 600
Kill 2 greek swords with horses (2-0)
Bring Mugla's e-spear towards Rhodes (the colony)
3 trebs, 1 cat, 1 horse, 2 knights, 2 spears, and 1 sword moves into the forest next to Pharsalos, Greece's only known source of horses
Spain declares on Alex for 48g and 17gpt (they also have navigation) and become gracious

IBT
Spanish crusader defeats unknown greek soldier, becomes elite
Selfishville university->knight

T8 610
Bombardment reveals 3 regular hoplites in Pharsalos.
1 knight 1 archer 1 sword and 1 spear march on Rhodes
Kill all 3 hoplites in Pharsalos with no loss (5-0), keep it and immediately regret it as all 11 citizens are resisters.
Kill 1 sword and 1 hoplite outside Kafa (7-0), no one dies and a minfantry gets promoted to elite

T9 620
Turn all 4 newly-content citizens in Pharsalos into entertainers to start starving the city
The army rests

IBT
Bursa knight>knight
Lose ivory, furs

T10 630
Horses+7gpt for furs, ivory (arabia)
Knight retreats from Rhodes, the rest of the expedition moves to protect it
The eastern army marches on Greece


I know that we were planning to wait for Sipahi before declaring war, but if we have a good army and an ally with a good army, I'm not pushing an upstart a tiny bit further on the path to becoming a runaway AI.

Greece's only known sources of saltpeter (unconnected AFAIK, I sent a horse to make sure) and iron are close to the front. We'll probably have to send in a settler for the saltpeter unless we want to take athens too, which I don't think we can manage.

5 horses on our island are known, so I doubt there is another in Greece (2 in our homeland, 2 in spain, 1 in our new aquisition). Same deal with the iron ( 3 in our homeland, 1 in greece, 1 in arabia). Unfortunately, we only know where 3 piles of saltpeter are on our island, so the greeks may have another.



http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/84841/Lo5_1_630_AD.SAV
 
0 turn - 630 AD:
Managing workers in Spanish territory.

1 turn - 640 AD:
Rhodes captured. Our troops closing to Knossos. I gave Spain wines for WM and 50gp.

IBT: greek longbow loses to our knight; hoplite and archer killed by crusaders;

2 turn - 650 AD:
Izmit university->knight; Kafa marketplace->courthouse; Mugla knight->knight; 3 swords killed by our SoD.

IBT: elite swords loses to our knight

3 turn - 660 AD:
Jiri marketplace->library; Spain is building Bach's cathedral; Generally we have to cut off any reinforcement coming from Greek core and Spain should be fine.

IBT: Spain captures Argos;

4 turn - 670 AD:
Pharsalos worker->worker; Knossos captured;

5 turn - 680 AD:
I want to position troops near Sparta to weaken the defense and kill any marauders. Now Greece consist of two parts, northern with their capital and southern comprising 4 cities. Spain should be able to capture southern part with ease and with northern part we will give them a hand.

IBT: Our worker was captured thanks to my carelessness, but I think eventually it went into Spanish hands. Knight loses to our knight.

6 turn - 690 AD:
Giuseppe knight->knight; Bursa knight->knight; Hoplite is killed in out territory;

IBT: Minor skirmishes;

7 turn - 700 AD:
Edrine knight->knight; Aydin university->knight; Jim Henson courthous->aqueduct; Skoupa marketplace->harbor; I spot connected saltpeter in Greece. It should be pillaged in next turn.

8 turn - 710 AD:
Selfishville knight->knight. Spain completes Leo's.

9 turn - 720 AD:
Pharsalos worker->courthouse;

10 turn - 730 AD;
moving workers



http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/95852/Lo5_1_730_AD.SAV
 
Got it.

I'm mildly considering exiting the game over time, because I took on an exciting, fun, difficult, long-term project last week and I'm not sure if I can serve two masters. However, I promise that

1) I won't just disappear without a trace
2) I won't leave at all if the consensus is "man, that would just suck."
3) I'll find a replacement for myself first if I do leave.

Anyway: got it.

Lo5
 
Keeee-rap.

Frrsosch, skip me. :blush:

Lo5
 
sorry, is was in Ukraine for something like 10 days now, I thought I posted here before. Anyways, I won't find the time to play 'till Wednesday so please skip me.
 
Since the roster is fairly empty

(Lo5 - Skipped
Frrosch - Last online 10/6
TheLoneMan - Last online 9/24
TimBentley - Skipped
Pneuma
Anar - Just played)

I'm going to play the game now, since I won't have time to check on this thread until (maybe) tomorrow. I'm sorry to hear about your mother, TLM. Waiting in the hospital for days, thinking that someone close to you might not leave is pretty ****ing terrible.
 
T0 730 AD
The diplo window shows that Greece has no saltpeter or horses
Artillery shows Sparta has two hoplites
Take Sparta at the cost of 1 knight (2-1)
Since I have no idea whether or not culture flipping is on, I change all four Greek cities to workers and start to starve them
Hoping Spain has Arabia’s territory map, I trade chem for their WM+banking+80g+1gpt, and end up getting information on some coasts.
Sci up to 4.6.0 (+14gpt)

IBT
Giuseppe knight>knight
Jiri Trnka library>wealth (it gets 5spt at most, so I’d rather use it as a commerce farm and leave its hills to Izmit and Antalya)
Knossos worker (greek)>worker
Knoya knight>knight, readjust its pop to focus on food
Rhodes worker (greek)>library (down to size 1)

T1 740
Army marches on Athens

IBT
Armies move
Edrine knight>knight
Bursa knight>knight

T2 750
Kill a LB, knight, and minfantry, killing one of ours and injuring three knights and a horse (5-2)
Athens has at least one vet musket

IBT
Pharsalos worker (greek)>library
Antalya library>courthouse
Athens completes Copernicus’ Observatory. Exquisite.

T3 760
Bombardment of Athens reveals 1 vet musket, 2 reg muskets
Lose 5 knights and 1 horse, but take the city (and with it, the obsolete Great Library and Temple of Artemis, and the brand new Copernicus’ Observatory) (8-8)
Upgrade 2 horses in Athens (to heal them)
Will have to wait in Athens for reinforcements/sipahi before continuing

IBT
Kafa courthouse>harbor

T4 770
Kill a greek LB near Athens (9-8)


IBT
Salonika aqueduct>library

T5 780
WH from Greece is gone, lux up to 4.5.1 (25gpt tech in 3)

IBT
Celts come to us, offering peace? I didn’t even know they were at war with us, so I take it and 40 of their gold
Knossos worker (greek)>library
Mugla knight>library
WTLK day in many cities, and I get to expand our palace. Apparently nobody liked that war.

T6 790
Henson aqueduct>library
Army marches on Thermopylae

T7 800
Mil trad comes in next turn, and our alliance with Spain has expired, so to save time I send the knights in against Thermopylae’s regular hoplites without artillery support. One knight is redlined and we kill 2 hoplites and 1 LB with no deaths on our side, taking a catapult and promoting a knight in the process (12-8)
The unused artillery and knights march on Mycenae because I forgot that which I previously stated: Sipahi next turn

IBT
Hells yeah. Military tradition comes in, and I set research on physics
Henson library>aqueduct
Greek musket leaves Mycenae and enters our territory. Durrrr me Awexander me wike candy.

T8 810
Research kept low at 6.3.1 so we can upgrade 1 knight per turn (7 veterans and an elite left)
Athens will flip soon if we don’t do something about it. So I move the whole army there to end the resistance and forgo artillery support, attacking Mycenae. Luckily, both hoplites there die, only retreating one knight (14-8)

IBT
America demands banking, I tell him where to stick his hat. He meekly complies with my command and doesn’t declare war.
Arabian SoD emerges from the jungles of northern Greece, the only things south of them now are us and Spain.
Skoupa harbor>library

T9 820
Make an alliance with Arabia against Greece for 21gpt. If they do indeed reroute the SoD approaching Mycenae, then Greece is boned. If they don’t then we only have to deal with the one wave and at worst lose Mycenae. If they were headed for Spain, then I wasted 420 gold.
Kill a redlined Greek musket with a fresh sipahi and the golden years begin.
3 sipahi move into position to attack Delphi next turn
Our work fixing spain’s worker troubles is done, so workers head to improve Ottoman Greece.

IBT
Crap, Arabia’s stacks move into Mycenae.

T10 830
Tell them to move, and they declare. Stop here to discuss what to do now.

We are badly outnumbered and the Arabs have the terrain advantage, but we are fighting ancient age units with the finest attacker of the middle game and the remains of Greece should soak up later waves.

My personal plan of attack would be to raze Delphi (so Athens has less chance of flip), move everything we have to Athens with a small garrison in Thermopylae (upgrade the artillery) and abandon Mycenae, so we can be fighting them on grasslands instead of jungles, and interrupting one of two roads from Arabia to Ottoman Greece, and rush a couple muskets in Athens. Maybe make peace with Greece after burning Delphi.

In other news, Spain has made no apparent progress in southern Greece and we will have to help them. Greece has been effectively castrated and now owns mostly marsh, jungle and coast. Delphi is their last decent city.

Spoiler picture :

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/3898/picture1ob2.jpg
Arabian Stack 1: 2 4/4 ancient cavalry, 2 5/5 ancient cavalry, 4 3/3 archers
Arabian Stack 2: 6 4/4 ancient cavalry, 1 5/5 ancient cavalry, 1 4/4 archer, 2 5/5 archers, 1 3/3 archer, 1 3/3 spearman
Ottoman Stack 1: 1 1/4 knight, 1 3/4 siphahi, Mycenae (resistors, no barracks)
Ottoman Stack 2: 3 catapult, 1 trebuchet
Ottoman Stack 3: 1 2/4 sipahi, 1 4/4 sipahi
Ottoman Stack 4: 2 4/4 sipahi
Ottoman Stack 5: 1 5/5 knight, Thermopylae (resistors, no barracks)
Ottoman Stack 6: 4 catapults, 2 4/4 sipahi, 1 3/3 spearman, 2 trebuchets, Athens (no resistors, barracks)
Ottoman Stack 7: 2 4/4 Sipahi
Ottoman Stack 8: 1 4/4 Spearman, 1 4/4 Swordsman, Sparta (no resistors, no barracks)

Totals:
Arabia: 8 regular ancient cavalry, 3 veteran ancient cavalry, 5 regular archers, 1 veteran archer, 2 elite archers, 1 regular spearman
Ottomans: 1 veteran knight, 1 elite knight, 9 veteran sipahi, 7 catapults, 3 trebuchets, 1 regular spearman, 1 veteran spearman, 1 veteran swordsman


http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/84841/Lo5_1_830_AD.SAV
 
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