Making of "Brave New World" - article from Polygon

[stealth_nsk]

Also this:

This was already known in general. But confirmation in details is good.

 

[SnowKomodo]

Why is it so important to fill in geographic holes when almost everyone plays on non-earth maps?

It's not, but they mention "geographic diversity" in the article so it's clearly a point of consideration for them, however minor

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

It's not, but they mention "geographic diversity" in the article so it's clearly a point of consideration for them, however minor

It's certainly not necessary, but it is nice to have a diversity of art flavors. Disparage the role players of the community if you wish, but they buy the game too.

 

[Merciorum]

Pity, seems that there'll be no more work on Civ 5. I would've liked to see Oman, the Cherokee, and maybe a couple of new features.

But, it seems as though this is a pretty good way to end development, so I'll take it .

 

[stealth_nsk]

Also, please note that it is heavily implied that Venice can purchase units in its puppets, and units only.

Well, it's not that heavy in my opinion. Probably units are mentioned so hardly because normally puppets don't build units at all.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

A little more detail on the Pueblo:

It seems that it wasn't about Popey as much as the representation of the Puebloan language(s) in the game that offended them.

 

[Loaf Warden]

The Pueblo stuff in the article contradicts what was said at PAX and makes little sense on its own as well. At PAX they explicitly said the Pueblo Council's objection was that Popé was a sacred figure, and they didn't want him as a video game character where he could be the bad guy or get defeated. Now the article says their objection was that they consider their language too sacred to put into a game--despite the same article pointing out that the Pueblo peoples have a variety of different languages, implying there were lots to choose from aside from the sacred one. Whodawhatnow?

 

[Al-Iskander]

Brilliant article! After months of our collective angsty speculation, this felt like a marvelous "season finale." All that's left now is to play the game!

 

[Ulthwithian]

stealth: They mention that they 'build as normal, but you can buy an army'. If you could buy anything, why not say that? 'They build as normal, but you can buy an army or crucial buildings for your strategy.'

 

[Kruppe]

This was already known in general. But confirmation in details is good.

Really? I must have missed it

 

[Ulthwithian]

Loaf: Maybe different tribes in the Council had differing objections?

 

[SnowKomodo]

The Pueblo stuff in the article contradicts what was said at PAX and makes little sense on its own as well. At PAX they explicitly said the Pueblo Council's objection was that Popé was a sacred figure, and they didn't want him as a video game character where he could be the bad guy or get defeated. Now the article says their objection was that they consider their language too sacred to put into a game--despite the same article pointing out that the Pueblo peoples have a variety of different languages, implying there were lots to choose from aside from the sacred one. Whodawhatnow?

They mentioned both languages and artistic depictions in the article. Not entirely a contradiction, just an additional reason why they couldn't include them

 

[The QC]

stealth: They mention that they 'build as normal, but you can buy an army'. If you could buy anything, why not say that? 'They build as normal, but you can buy an army or crucial buildings for your strategy.'

"Build as normal" for a puppet means that they build what they want. It doesn't mean you chose what they build, if that's what you understood.

 

[Cyanfunk]

Lewis urged artist Mike Bates to make Dandolo look "more evil"

This is the best thing

 

[stealth_nsk]

stealth: They mention that they 'build as normal, but you can buy an army'. If you could buy anything, why not say that? 'They build as normal, but you can buy an army or crucial buildings for your strategy.'

Because the whole statement was about how Venetian it's to buy an army instead of building it. If Ed would try to describe the actual feature, he would use term "units" instead of "army".

I'm not saying it's necessary this, but the words actually leave some room for interpretation.

 

[Ulthwithian]

Stealth: Very true, and I'm not saying that it's only units. But it's certainly a very defensible read of the situation, particularly when buying buildings with Venetian gold seems one step removed from 'having your cake and eating it too' when it comes to Domination and Venice. (IOW, they may have removed buying buildings for balance reasons.)

QC: You and I have the same interpretation.

 

[blackcatatonic]

This is easily the most interesting article I've read in 3 months of pre-BNW build-up. Thanks for sharing

I love that Shaka was apparently modelled on football players - I guess as this is an American article they mean American football rather than soccer, but still, he does have something of the Balotelli about him!

 

[Gucumatz]

"Firaxis was willing to consult with the Pueblo Council to determine the most realistic way of portraying the Pueblo civ, but the Pueblos drew a hard line at the language. To the Pueblo people, their language is sacred. They viewed inclusion of the language in a video game as a form of desecration, similar to how many native people do not wish to be photographed"

Language??? We were told Pope was the issue at first. We reported most other Caciques would be fine. So was language really the problem? I know there have been Zuni voice actors in movies and such without issue... There are so many Pueblo languages, many with significant speakers in the US compared to other native languages. I just don't buy this...

This clears up pretty much nothing sadly on the Pueblo front

 

[SamBC]

Also, please note that it is heavily implied that Venice can purchase units in its puppets, and units only.

Really? How's that implied?

Edit: gah, teach me to have tabs open too long before replying. I see the answer.

 

[Gucumatz]

So the Shoshone AI sounds fairly weak then in the intro? Or were attempted to be weak? If they are expansionistic and relatively peaceful with current programming I could see them being the opposite of weak.

I wish we had clearer details on the Pueblo situation. I still am leaning to Firaxis were too lazy to find acceptable substitutes (as said, they may have only focused on one Pueblo language or focused too much only on Popey when in reality there are many other languages and potential leaders - there are a significant amount of Pueblos with only limited attachment to the Council too)