Mass Regicide for Four

[DogBoy]

Oh man, and die like men you shall. I say that, and you say that, but you really don't think you will die. It's funny how you were nice to me and agreed to extend the peace treaty until you got your horses hooked up. Now you intend to unleash the mighty Iroquois mounted warriors upon my warriors and kings. How do you expect me to defend that? You don't, and you knew that when you attacked. What makes it worse is you attacked an undefended city in my back lines via sneak attack. I know you will come up with excuses but I have a copy of the messages between us. And for all the world to see, here they are.

This one is from me.

Greetings o' wise ruler of the Iroquois,
My scribes have told me that the peace treaty between us has run out. I wish to extend that peace treaty. I offer you my hand for a period of no less than 50 turns so that we may co-exist in this world together. If not, it appears as if our two nations will plunge into war which will benefit neither of us. It will only allow the others of this world to grow much stronger and bigger, and will ultimately be the death of us. Please reply soon so I know what your intentions are.

DogBoy of the Romans

And this was your response.

I agree to extend the peace treaty.

And now for my response.

My scribes have annotated that our peace will last until turn 96.

And here for all the world to see is your response.

The weak and stupid Iroquois were dumfounded to learn that the might Romans had horseback riding with no visible horses and decided that the source of that tech was probably from abroad. If so, our doom is written and we might as well go like men.

Anyway our tribal council felt we were bullied by your demands for a 50-turn peace while having units in our hamlet. So, to conclude that negotiation, we are at war. It's about honor and all that. I hate attacking without warning, but what can you do? The most I could get the council to agree to do was to give you a free shot at taking one of our cities on the same terms. Good luck. Russ

Now I'm curious as to how this is honorable. I'm also curious as to how you are letting me have a free shot at taking one of your cities, seeing as I don't have any units in your land and I haven't had any units in your lands for probably 30 turns or so. You even say you violated our 50 turns of peace, and you admit to attacking without warning. The logic simply doesn't flow from your civilization. You may wipe me off this land mass, and you may wipe me off this world, but now that the rest of the world knows you can't be trusted, I doubt you will ultimately build a civilization to stand the test of time. Good luck to you too.

 

[jshelr]

Of course, you know that the Iroquois did not agree to 50 turns and, so, we never had a peace contract. If you want, I'll try to find a screen shot where your vet king unit was moved into our North West city's space and you tried to bully us into cravenly allowing you time to build up your lands, which represent about 3/4 of our continent since you popped a settler on our front doorstep and built all your cities in our direction from your mid continent start. We recommend hooking up your ivory and completing Statue of Zeus. (The save for the turn you bullied us is probably at work.)

Your free shot can be had by moving the vet king unit nearest our lands and attacking.

 

[Myzenium]

If it makes you feel better, jshelr, my starting location was also on a peninsula next to Killer A's. And DogBoy, don't feel too bad about starting a war so early. Wars happen unexpectedly. I don't think that either of you are not real men because this war started.

Happy 50th turn! (1750 BC)

It's your move, jshelr.

 

[jshelr]

You guys will likely enjoy some blow by blow description

Here is our position at the beginnng of the war near the horse resource of the Iroquois. Note the absence of roads.

 

[jshelr]

Here is the turn as I got it back. Note the change in color guarding the horse resource! That was sure a fast move by the spear, don't you think

 

[jshelr]

Should I wait for someone to offer an explanation or am I just missing something obvious?? By the way, the mounted warrior turn reduction was a forest chop.

the city had 14 shields, adding 3 on that turn for 17. It got 10 from the chop leaving 3 to do in one turn.

Now that i look at the picture, it appears the spear even fortified itself. speed kills.

 

[Killer A's]

The food production changed to 2 also. That is unusual. Are you sure the screen shots are correct?

 

[DogBoy]

Since you got the turn, I'm assuming you will pass it along to me soon, eh?

As for "giving me a free shot", hardly I might say. I couldn't see that your city was undefended, even if it was undefended. And when you posted it here it was after I had played my turn and sent the game along. And I doubt your city was undefended. Why would anyone start a war, destroy a city, and say "I'm sorry I razed your city, here is one of mine for you to raze."

As for an early war, I have no problem with that. But we had just extended our peace and i wasn't expecting a back-stabbing. The AI does that, I just assumed most PBEMers wouldn't.

BTW, all my attacks are made in game. Just want to make sure nobody here thinks I'm attacking JShelR personally, just the Iroquois

 

[jshelr]

No, I think that's a 3 not a 2 on the turns to grow. I'm going to try to make larger screenshots that cover the dates.

 

[jshelr]

i believe this would be turn 49

 

[jshelr]

turn 50

 

[jshelr]

Both those shots are "beginning of turn" shots. I actually covered the horses with a king unit too if i recall correctly.

So, the speedy Romans have a spear that can travel 2 tiles and fortify in one turn

 

[DogBoy]

Are you gonna send the turn or what?

BTW, this is a multiplayer game. Have you never seen how the units move in a multiplayer game?

 

[Killer A's]

I doubt there was any tapering. Play the turn and l live with the game quirk.

 

[jshelr]

Ok, I can accept that verdict. Thanks for considering the issue. You have to choose whether DogBoy is tampering or I’ve doctored the pictures somehow, and it could be either from your point of view. You know him and you don’t know me.

Problem is, from my point of view I know the answer. From my perspective, it is likely that DogBoy feels he was cheated. So, anything goes as far as he is concerned. I’m sorry he feels that way and would be willing to discuss with him, offline, possibilities for repairing confidence.

Actually, despite my whining, the Iroquois have a winning position here, IMO. The Romans chose to build cities very far from their capital, influenced by the location of an early settler pop. They will have trouble linking them up to iron, as well as problems with corruption.

The Iroquois built a nice, compact civ with a good settler/worker pump at the core and agricultural cities on rivers with barracks in most and that are growing like weeds. So, while Rome looks bigger, the Iroquois have more citizens on the ground, working improved tiles. The Iroquois two-move UU will be able to run rings around the Romans in open ground and pillage roads, helped by these otherwise-useless king units. The Romans have been slow to build needed roads. The Romans are too spread out while the Iroquois civ is more like a fort with units quickly able to get to the site of the conflict. A replacement should be easy to attract for this position. (The replacement will be able to take back the horse resource on his or her first turn.)

I will continue if someone offers a logical explanation about how the position shown on the pictures was achieved honestly in one turn. I’m not interested in competing with spears that are materialized at will and fortified immediately. (Maybe Roman spears move as fast as Modern Armor?) That sort of game is a waste of time.

If you wish, I will also play, shall we say, four more turns to give you time to find a substitute. The game was going well and people were paying close attention to fulfilling their responsibilities before this unfortunate episode ruined things.

 

[Killer A's]

O.K. I will be contacting jshelr and DogBoy about this and hopefully have it resolved before the end of the weekend.

 

[DogBoy]

Ok, you caught me. The jig is up. I have a cheat program that instantly transports units anywhere I want them to go. I can't believe I finally got caught doing this. Actually, I can't believe it took me this long to get caught seeing how I do it all the time. I thought everybody used the cheat and it was common knowledge by now.

And the reason for putting my cities so far apart? There was no danger of them being attacked, seeing how I was at peace with everybody I knew. And that peace was agreed upon to last for a long time, 50 turns to be precise. If we are talking about shady playing, let's talk about breaking peace deals. I know it's obviously allowed as there isn't any way to stop it, but I would be willing to say anyone who does it is probably marked for all other PBEMS. Just my $.02.

 

[Myzenium]

corrupted post... Trying again.

 

[Myzenium]

Gee, if we had wanted cheat programs used in this PBEM, Killer A's would have posted a link to the cheat website, to let every player download the cheat program. Then the PBEM would have been perfectly fair for all.

I say we scrap this MRf4 and start another PBEM, and find someone to take DogBoy's place. Sorry, DogBoy, you violated our trust.

 

[DogBoy]

Ya, whatever.

I see another person hasn't played a multiplayer or PBEM before. And as for violating your trust, that doesn't bother me as you never even tried to figure out what happened. You are just like everybody else on these message boards that can't figure something out in the game and immediately cries "I found a bug, it's a cheat!" Only to have someone post that it's not a bug and here is how they did it. And then you post another message in a few days because you don't understand something about the game claiming you found another bug, or another cheat. You never really understand how things are possible, and you never try to figure them out. You use the cop out of crying bugs and cheats.

Go ahead and start another game, and hope you have less whiny b!tches in that game then you apparently do in this game. Make sure you don't invite me because I know how to play the game, don't invite JShelR because he wants to cry cheat if he can't figure out the game. Oh, and by the way, don't invite yourself because you also can't figure out how the game works and you want to start over and piss everybody off who has been playing the game. JShelr gave us two options, either accept the fact I cheated or he doctored the pics. And you took that at face value. You never even considered other options. And that's your problem. Even Killer A acknowledged the game had a quirk and told JShelR to live with it. If you wanna get mad at someone, get mad at Firaxis who designed this game. But since I obviously listen and you know Firaxis won't and you want to direct your comments at me, feel free. Flame away.

I guess this is how we are going to celebrate our 50th turn? Happy 50th turn! May we have many more just like it.