Math04: Another 100K
- Thread starter Mathias
- Start date
We got attacked by the persians (the fools). Now I wanted to sign an allianc with america because they are next to them. But we have no embasies. Why? Can a get an embasy or is it against the customised rules? Will wait for answer before continuing.
Nothing against embassies, we just haven't bothered to establish any. Going along with my previous comment, I wouldn't mind allying China against Persia as well. Once our deal is up with Inca, and we declare war on them, we can ally with Byzantines as well.
pre-trun
upgrade some vet horses
move some elephants to bya=zantines, to get the incense. Can't attack inca's for 8 more turns.
660AD
Lahore magalan->court
Bangalore bank->leo
ask perian ancient cavalry to leave they promise
moving around
670AD
Byzantines demand, we declare
Calcutta bank->palace
ask persians to leave again
start attacking byanztines
down science
680AD
Persians declared and took Indus across the river.
Set science to chemistry 80%
take Indus back
take Varna from Byzantines
690AD
persians are moving in more forces no losses yet. Want an aliance with america or so to stop the flow. But we have no embasies.
take Nicaea from byzatines, that's enough for now, will make peace when they'll talk to me probably next turn.
Get embasy with america, get MA vs Persia for 220 gold
700AD
Delhi smiths->bank
Lahore court->war elephant
710AD
Byzantines will talk are almost ready to give city so decide to take one more
moving
720AD
chemistry->phisics
Take adrianolope,
still won't give a city but make peace can almost attack inca. peace for WM 6 gold 2 gpt
found New Delhi
sell feudalism to aztecs for WM 3gpt 29 gold
730AD
renecotiate peace with inca, can't get anything usefull so declare on them (otherwise would have chosen china).
get embasies with china and byzantines
get MA with china for WM and 140 gold
get MA with byzantines for WM and 10 gold
get america in for WM and 90 gold
Could get MA with china against but to expensive they appear to have a RoP with persia.
Take juli
740AD
attack once on vilcas but see there are several musket men so wait for reinforcements.
750AD
Take Vilcas, move units towards corihuarachina to claim dyes.
Physics due next turn (adjust slider).
took only incan horse, they have a single iron which is nearby, salpeter is way down so will be difficult to pillige fast.
There's a settler SE of dessert town, settle on spot it, won't claim the dyes but also won't annoy tha aztecs
win date down to 2131AD.
upgrade some vet horses
move some elephants to bya=zantines, to get the incense. Can't attack inca's for 8 more turns.
660AD
Lahore magalan->court
Bangalore bank->leo
ask perian ancient cavalry to leave they promise
moving around
670AD
Byzantines demand, we declare
Calcutta bank->palace
ask persians to leave again
start attacking byanztines
down science
680AD
Persians declared and took Indus across the river.
Set science to chemistry 80%
take Indus back
take Varna from Byzantines
690AD
persians are moving in more forces no losses yet. Want an aliance with america or so to stop the flow. But we have no embasies.
take Nicaea from byzatines, that's enough for now, will make peace when they'll talk to me probably next turn.
Get embasy with america, get MA vs Persia for 220 gold
700AD
Delhi smiths->bank
Lahore court->war elephant
710AD
Byzantines will talk are almost ready to give city so decide to take one more
moving
720AD
chemistry->phisics
Take adrianolope,
still won't give a city but make peace can almost attack inca. peace for WM 6 gold 2 gpt
found New Delhi
sell feudalism to aztecs for WM 3gpt 29 gold
730AD
renecotiate peace with inca, can't get anything usefull so declare on them (otherwise would have chosen china).
get embasies with china and byzantines
get MA with china for WM and 140 gold
get MA with byzantines for WM and 10 gold
get america in for WM and 90 gold
Could get MA with china against but to expensive they appear to have a RoP with persia.
Take juli
740AD
attack once on vilcas but see there are several musket men so wait for reinforcements.
750AD
Take Vilcas, move units towards corihuarachina to claim dyes.
Physics due next turn (adjust slider).
took only incan horse, they have a single iron which is nearby, salpeter is way down so will be difficult to pillige fast.
There's a settler SE of dessert town, settle on spot it, won't claim the dyes but also won't annoy tha aztecs
win date down to 2131AD.
In order to calculate a more accurate estimate, I put our culture into a spreadsheet. I took into account all new culture due to doubling (known dates) as well as future builds (estimated dates).
These calculations assume the following:
1. We don't build Leo's
2. Bangalore builds Newton's
3. We research directly to Indust. and Calcutta builds U.S. (already under construction)
4. ToE is built (with prebuild) circa 1170 AD, based on 42 turns research through SM including Sanitation before Electricity
5. Hoover Dam is build (without prebuild) circa 1250 AD, most likely in Bangalore
6. We enter the Modern Times by 1400 AD
We'll actually be fine entering the Modern Times as late as 1500 AD. At first, I forgot not to include The Internet, but realized the mistake and removed it. I also estimated individual cities. Bangalore will have the most culture, with just under 25K.
One thing to note in Bangalore. We need 211 more shields for Newton's, and Bangalore is producing 21 per turn. This would obviously leave us 1 shield short after 10 turns, so for 1 turn we need to move a citizen from an irrigated grass to a mined grass for that extra shield at a loss of 1 food.
These calculations assume the following:
1. We don't build Leo's
2. Bangalore builds Newton's
3. We research directly to Indust. and Calcutta builds U.S. (already under construction)
4. ToE is built (with prebuild) circa 1170 AD, based on 42 turns research through SM including Sanitation before Electricity
5. Hoover Dam is build (without prebuild) circa 1250 AD, most likely in Bangalore
6. We enter the Modern Times by 1400 AD
We'll actually be fine entering the Modern Times as late as 1500 AD. At first, I forgot not to include The Internet, but realized the mistake and removed it. I also estimated individual cities. Bangalore will have the most culture, with just under 25K.
One thing to note in Bangalore. We need 211 more shields for Newton's, and Bangalore is producing 21 per turn. This would obviously leave us 1 shield short after 10 turns, so for 1 turn we need to move a citizen from an irrigated grass to a mined grass for that extra shield at a loss of 1 food.
namliaM
Deity
Wow good work... and a lot of work... Geez...Mathias said:
Did you also figure in small wonders? Like HE, Wall S, MA, Appolo.
Will shoot for getting my turns tonight. No optionals, but for sanitation... => culture, Culture, CULTURE.
Also is Leo's a prebuild for newt? Or will we shoot for both Leo's and Newt?
Leo's prebuild for Newton's. Bangalore is best site for Newton's, and can complete it in 10 turns (need to go negative fpt for a turn to get that extra shield). If we can finish Leo's in Calcutta (26 turns) then we certainly should. If we get an SGL, rush Leo's somewhere else and let Calcutta go on to Universal Suffrage.
If Leo's goes before we get ToG, drop the shields in Calcutta so we can still get Newton's in Bangalore.
If Leo's goes before we get ToG, drop the shields in Calcutta so we can still get Newton's in Bangalore.
There no change of a cascade yet, since others civs are not advanced enough. But they are getting close. Hope the war will slow them down. When establishing the embasies no one was building a wonder, but they could be building it somewhere else ofcourse. We can't afford to loose newton though as it's 6 culture, leo is only 2.
namliaM
Deity
Pre-turn
Double check Cascade possibilities
Leos is beeing build by :
Babylonians in Uruk => Babylon Capitol, Isolated... 1 hill (Low shield potential)
Inca in Huamanga => Size 12, with hills!, High shield potential
Chinese in Chengdu => Size 12, Lots of FPs, 2 mountains (Low shield town!)
If we get close to finish it, maybe investigate them towns? But that wont happen in my turns.
No need to adjust the slider... Adjust bangalore for that extra shield ... Now
NOTE: Persian galley! North of delhi... Good thing to know!
<Enter>
IT Lose elephant to knight
Elite horse kills a Knight
Pers Galley Drops off a spear Ooooh I am scared
Phisycs in Magnetism @80% in 4
Juli riots ?! Create Scientist > Change build to slave
Huamanga gets Leos.... Could have saved me some work...
1@760 Kill Spear 1-0 vs Persia
Convert Calcutta to an Elephant, losing 92 shields
Change Bangalore to Palace
Change Vilcas to slave
Elephant dies vs Musket
Elephant Kills Musket 1-1 Inca
Elephant Runs from Musket
Elephant Kills Musket 2-1 Inca
Elephant Kills Musket 3-1 Inca
Elite Phant Kills Knight 4-1
Elite Phant Kills Archer 5-1 (#2 Elite) Take Corihuay ==> Slave
IT Babylon and China => Peace
Calcutta Phant> Granary
2@770 zzzz
IT Delhi Bank> Harbor
Madras Shakes> W.E.
Lahore WE> WE
3@780 Elite Phant Kill MI (#3) 6-1
Elite Phant Kill MI (#4) 7-1
Move 2 phants + Phant Army to cover the wonded Elite
IT Phant flees from MI (attacking over a river)
MI Takes TzintZuntzen
Bombay Settler> settler
Hyder Phant> Court
4@790 Elite Crusader Kill Vet Archer (#5) 8-1
Phant Kills Musket 9-1
Phant Kills Musket 10-1 (Promote!)
WHY are elite Phants standing in Defense?!?!?!?!
Disband the 2 'stray' units on the island
Phant Kill MI 11-1
Phant Kill Musket 12-1
Phant Kill Musket 13-1
Sci to 70
Create taxman In Cori and Juli
IT
Phant kills MI 14-1
Phant* flees MI
Phant* Killed by Longbow 14-2
Magnetism In> ToG
Tlax Phant> Court
Juli Slave> Slave
5@800 Elite phant kill Longbow 15-2 (#6)
Phant dies on Musket 15-3
Elite Crus Kill Archer 16-3 (#7)
Sci 80, ToG in 4
Change Taxman to Scientist
IT MI Kills Elite Phant 16-4
Delhi Harbor> Treb(s) MM to give NET 15spt
Calcutta Granary> Phant
Vilcas Slave> Slave
Dacca Market> Courthouse
Jaipur Duct> Court
Bengal Duct> Bank
6@810 Elite Horse Kill Archer (#8) 17-4
Elite Phant Kill Archer (#9) 18-4
IT Phant Gets killed by MI 18-5
Phant Kills MI (Promote!) 19-5
Madras Phant> Market
Lahore Phant> Granary
Karachi Phant> Phant
Chitta Bank> Treb
7@820 Elite phant Flees Musket
Cori Change Sci to Clown
IT Phant Kills MI 20-5
Delhi Treb> Treb
kolhapur Phant> Duct
Punjab Phant> Duct
8@830 Sci 60 with Juli on all scientists....
Persia has revolted...
IT Phant kills mi 21-5
Elite phant Kills Longbow 22-5 (#9.5)
Phant killed by MI 22-6
Phant Killed by MI 22-7
ToG> Metallurgy
Lake West Phant> Market
9@840 Trade PP + Insence + 146 for Metal to China
Research?!?!?! Uhm Steam and Nationalism are often picked up as freebees...
But Steam... I think can can use the workers to actually do something again for our 5CC...
Steam it is....90% in 6 @-22gpt
OR Military tradition??? Uhm!!! 70% in 4 @+105gpt
Sell PP around, aint much... but something.... China is the only "money power" around...
Newt times perfect, Change Bangalore to Newt in 1!!!!! To the shield perfect!
Phant Kill MI 23-8
Phant kill MI 24-8
Phant Dies on Persian AC near Indus 1-1
Phant Kills Persian AC 2-1
MM Delhi to 20spt for Cannons in 2turns
I am a little unsure what to do here... Go for MT for a 1cpt small wonder + Cavs?! We have some 2200+ cash for some (vet) upgrades....
Or go for Steam and rails ... For More shields? (Leading to Industrialism => Factories => Even more shields)
Or go for Midicine, Hospitals> More People> More everything....
The nearest AI are at Physics (Inca and China) all the others are at Chemistry/Banking at best
Neither China OR Inca are scientific...
Do we want to gift up Babylon?
Persia (currently at war and 5 turns left in the America MA deal)
Both need Banking, Chemistry, and further 4 manditory techs
But we could probably trade some optionals for their Freebee....
Madras is set to build a Market in 3. The turn after 4 Chops finish, build a bank!
Then build a granary
Newts is due when you hit enter
Summary:
As you can see I didnt do to much to kill of some Inca.... Did try to get a leader to rush the Military Acadamy... But no luck... 0 for 10. But got some more Elites... Lost some too unfortunatly....
There will be some Phants left on "goto" the front lines with Inca.
Also some workers on a goto to the Core. As I first was confinced to go for Steam. BUT.... well... I dont know... Steam and Nationalism seem to be often freebees....
So I was thinking Medicine=> Sanitation => MT => Gift => Trade?!
Ze Zave
Double check Cascade possibilities
Leos is beeing build by :
Babylonians in Uruk => Babylon Capitol, Isolated... 1 hill (Low shield potential)
Inca in Huamanga => Size 12, with hills!, High shield potential
Chinese in Chengdu => Size 12, Lots of FPs, 2 mountains (Low shield town!)
If we get close to finish it, maybe investigate them towns? But that wont happen in my turns.
No need to adjust the slider... Adjust bangalore for that extra shield ... Now
NOTE: Persian galley! North of delhi... Good thing to know!
<Enter>
IT Lose elephant to knight
Elite horse kills a Knight
Pers Galley Drops off a spear Ooooh I am scared
Phisycs in Magnetism @80% in 4
Juli riots ?! Create Scientist > Change build to slave
Huamanga gets Leos.... Could have saved me some work...
1@760 Kill Spear 1-0 vs Persia
Convert Calcutta to an Elephant, losing 92 shields
Change Bangalore to Palace
Change Vilcas to slave
Elephant dies vs Musket
Elephant Kills Musket 1-1 Inca
Elephant Runs from Musket
Elephant Kills Musket 2-1 Inca
Elephant Kills Musket 3-1 Inca
Elite Phant Kills Knight 4-1
Elite Phant Kills Archer 5-1 (#2 Elite) Take Corihuay ==> Slave
IT Babylon and China => Peace
Calcutta Phant> Granary
2@770 zzzz
IT Delhi Bank> Harbor
Madras Shakes> W.E.
Lahore WE> WE
3@780 Elite Phant Kill MI (#3) 6-1
Elite Phant Kill MI (#4) 7-1
Move 2 phants + Phant Army to cover the wonded Elite
IT Phant flees from MI (attacking over a river)
MI Takes TzintZuntzen
Bombay Settler> settler
Hyder Phant> Court
4@790 Elite Crusader Kill Vet Archer (#5) 8-1
Phant Kills Musket 9-1
Phant Kills Musket 10-1 (Promote!)
WHY are elite Phants standing in Defense?!?!?!?!
Disband the 2 'stray' units on the island
Phant Kill MI 11-1
Phant Kill Musket 12-1
Phant Kill Musket 13-1
Sci to 70
Create taxman In Cori and Juli
IT
Phant kills MI 14-1
Phant* flees MI
Phant* Killed by Longbow 14-2
Magnetism In> ToG
Tlax Phant> Court
Juli Slave> Slave
5@800 Elite phant kill Longbow 15-2 (#6)
Phant dies on Musket 15-3
Elite Crus Kill Archer 16-3 (#7)
Sci 80, ToG in 4
Change Taxman to Scientist
IT MI Kills Elite Phant 16-4
Delhi Harbor> Treb(s) MM to give NET 15spt
Calcutta Granary> Phant
Vilcas Slave> Slave
Dacca Market> Courthouse
Jaipur Duct> Court
Bengal Duct> Bank
6@810 Elite Horse Kill Archer (#8) 17-4
Elite Phant Kill Archer (#9) 18-4
IT Phant Gets killed by MI 18-5
Phant Kills MI (Promote!) 19-5
Madras Phant> Market
Lahore Phant> Granary
Karachi Phant> Phant
Chitta Bank> Treb
7@820 Elite phant Flees Musket
Cori Change Sci to Clown
IT Phant Kills MI 20-5
Delhi Treb> Treb
kolhapur Phant> Duct
Punjab Phant> Duct
8@830 Sci 60 with Juli on all scientists....
Persia has revolted...
IT Phant kills mi 21-5
Elite phant Kills Longbow 22-5 (#9.5)
Phant killed by MI 22-6
Phant Killed by MI 22-7
ToG> Metallurgy
Lake West Phant> Market
9@840 Trade PP + Insence + 146 for Metal to China
Research?!?!?! Uhm Steam and Nationalism are often picked up as freebees...
But Steam... I think can can use the workers to actually do something again for our 5CC...
Steam it is....90% in 6 @-22gpt
OR Military tradition??? Uhm!!! 70% in 4 @+105gpt
Sell PP around, aint much... but something.... China is the only "money power" around...
Newt times perfect, Change Bangalore to Newt in 1!!!!! To the shield perfect!
Phant Kill MI 23-8
Phant kill MI 24-8
Phant Dies on Persian AC near Indus 1-1
Phant Kills Persian AC 2-1
MM Delhi to 20spt for Cannons in 2turns
I am a little unsure what to do here... Go for MT for a 1cpt small wonder + Cavs?! We have some 2200+ cash for some (vet) upgrades....
Or go for Steam and rails ... For More shields? (Leading to Industrialism => Factories => Even more shields)
Or go for Midicine, Hospitals> More People> More everything....
The nearest AI are at Physics (Inca and China) all the others are at Chemistry/Banking at best
Neither China OR Inca are scientific...
Do we want to gift up Babylon?
Persia (currently at war and 5 turns left in the America MA deal)
Both need Banking, Chemistry, and further 4 manditory techs
But we could probably trade some optionals for their Freebee....
Madras is set to build a Market in 3. The turn after 4 Chops finish, build a bank!
Then build a granary
Newts is due when you hit enter
Summary:
As you can see I didnt do to much to kill of some Inca.... Did try to get a leader to rush the Military Acadamy... But no luck... 0 for 10. But got some more Elites... Lost some too unfortunatly....
There will be some Phants left on "goto" the front lines with Inca.
Also some workers on a goto to the Core. As I first was confinced to go for Steam. BUT.... well... I dont know... Steam and Nationalism seem to be often freebees....
So I was thinking Medicine=> Sanitation => MT => Gift => Trade?!
Ze Zave
Nvm previous statement.It doesn't matter much, but should have taken ToG before Magnetism. Bangalore gets off of Palace 4 turns earlier and Calcutta restarts US prebuild that much sooner. Also, there should have been no question on research. It was sublte, but I indicated researching directly to Industrialization. After that, we will go for Sanitation, then Scientific Method. We'll get Atomic Theory and Electronics via ToE, then study Replaceable Parts. The Inca alread have Military Tradition. We will get that in 9 turns with a peace treaty.
What did we get from China for our Incense? Please do not trade on the same turn that you hand off.
Why do we have workers outside of our territory? Our borders will not expand!
GOT IT. I'll play tomorrow.
What did we get from China for our Incense? Please do not trade on the same turn that you hand off.
Why do we have workers outside of our territory? Our borders will not expand!
GOT IT. I'll play tomorrow.
namliaM
Deity
I wasnt sure and because you are allways critiqing.... I thought I would stave off....Mathias said:
I realized the ToG Error 2 turns into that research... Tho maybe we want to build a Factory before US?
Dont know how Atomic Theory and Electronics figure into ToE... If we keep research up high... Not sure where we would end up on researching the other tree. I would simply pick the most expensive techs...
Only turn 9... was at that time not planning on handing over... Anyway... We got Mettal in return for our insence....Mathias said:
Is it a bad deal??!?!?!?!
I would reverse that question... Why is there:Mathias said:
1) Land outside our teritory?
2) Why do we have unimproved lands?
Good luckMathias said:
I gree not to research MT . Goal is culture, it will be close as it is, get RR and factories then hospitals. Was Madras MM to grow (shakes acts as hospital)?
@namliaM: how were you able to tell which cities were building leo´s?
@namliaM: how were you able to tell which cities were building leo´s?
namliaM
Deity
Madras is growing offcourse... Tho IIRC only at 3fpt. Tho RR will help with that situation. Also I started chopping the forrests left around there to help with the next build in line (As I said I would build a bank next, or use that bank as a prebuild for a factory)
Also I build Granaries about everywhere to help the growing.
There is a F. Key that shows a screen where all wonders have been and are beeing build. I think F7 is the one.
My point on MT was it has a Small wonder => Culture. True only 1cpt....
And if we can get MT for free from Inca, all the better. I didnt check on that.
Beeing on the goal of culture... How about this?
Go for Industrialisation => Corporation => Sanitation ====> etc
Corporation gives Stock exchange (not so important) but also the Wall Street small wonder. 2cpt IIRC
Also wall street is only 300 shields vs the 600 of ToE (3cpt) and vs the 800 of US (but 4cpt) and Hoovers 800 shields and 2 cpt.
Wall Street is 100 shields for 1cpt, where ToE and US are 200 shields for 1cpt and Hoovers is 400 shields (but with added bonus of hydro plants, which will only be effective with factories).
We are due for a leader... With HE, 10 elite wins in my turnset alone -on average- there should be a leader within the next 4 or 5 wins (1 in 12 actually).
What do we want to use that leader for?
1) Rush a small wonder (Wall street or MT?)
2) Rush a factory for the US build
We dont really need an army at this time.... I think
IMHO city placement for some cities SUCKS
Ex 1. If we move "Lake West" 1 NE it will pull in the "open" land between Lake West, Punjab, Desert town and Pune
Ex 2. Juli (I know we captured this) should go 1 West. Closing the gap between Desert town and Horsey town.
Also I build Granaries about everywhere to help the growing.
There is a F. Key that shows a screen where all wonders have been and are beeing build. I think F7 is the one.
My point on MT was it has a Small wonder => Culture. True only 1cpt....
And if we can get MT for free from Inca, all the better. I didnt check on that.
Beeing on the goal of culture... How about this?
Go for Industrialisation => Corporation => Sanitation ====> etc
Corporation gives Stock exchange (not so important) but also the Wall Street small wonder. 2cpt IIRC
Also wall street is only 300 shields vs the 600 of ToE (3cpt) and vs the 800 of US (but 4cpt) and Hoovers 800 shields and 2 cpt.
Wall Street is 100 shields for 1cpt, where ToE and US are 200 shields for 1cpt and Hoovers is 400 shields (but with added bonus of hydro plants, which will only be effective with factories).
We are due for a leader... With HE, 10 elite wins in my turnset alone -on average- there should be a leader within the next 4 or 5 wins (1 in 12 actually).
What do we want to use that leader for?
1) Rush a small wonder (Wall street or MT?)
2) Rush a factory for the US build
We dont really need an army at this time.... I think
IMHO city placement for some cities SUCKS
Ex 1. If we move "Lake West" 1 NE it will pull in the "open" land between Lake West, Punjab, Desert town and Pune
Ex 2. Juli (I know we captured this) should go 1 West. Closing the gap between Desert town and Horsey town.
namliaM said:
Sometimes I wish it worked that way. Het last game I finished (also india) I must have gotten at least 100 elite wins, but never got a single leader.
For the use of a leader, if there is a small wonder to rush, then rush it, otherwise use it for an army. I sugest to finish this war after the ma´s run out, then push back china a bit. We´ll then be the only superpower left, and be able to control the world, give techs away to increase science speed when needed, or keep them to ourselves if we need to finish some wonders first. About the gaps, there are some locations where we can just settle in between existing cities, will be a bit cramped but these cities won´t be very productive anyway.
