Merry Christmas and happy new year with RFC v165 and RFCW v115

[werttrew]

Two observations and two suggestions:

*Final requirement for American Historical Victory. I'm playing the U.S. now and there are only three other civilizations as of 1958. By 2000 I need four vassals, which would be impossible by game terms to accomplish. Now, I may get lucky and have a few new civs pop up, but in the last 50 turns or so, there have been no more than five other civs at any one time, and then only for a handful of turns.

Suggestion: Perhaps the American Historical Victory could be amended to 2/3 of all civs as vassals (rounding up), or four, whichever is lower? That would at least make it possible.

*The crippling effects of a Great Depression in a Free Market is very realistic, but so dehabilitating that it makes Free Market, for me, a non-choice anymore. Mercantilism is so much more stable that switching to FE seems to me to almost always be a terrible option.

Suggestion: Perhaps the numbers of banks/market/grocers per city will assuage the downsides of a depression? The more currency institutions, the better the civ is able to withstand a depression? Or a Wall Street could somehow mitigate a depression? Or perhaps more trade routes with foreign countries could ease depressions?

 

[Sovietof17]

Got a UHV with China! Look at how much of the Western world collapsed btw in my save game. Talk about crazy! Attached it a few turns early so you could poke around with it

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/64593/Qin_Shi_Huang_AD-1570_Turn_265.CivWarlordsSave

 

[Head Serf]

Has any civilization actually collapsed from switching to a free market economic system? America had been a free market economy for 150 years when it underwent the famous "Great Depression".

 

[Enkidu Warrior]

Has any civilization actually collapsed from switching to a free market economic system? America had been a free market economy for 150 years when it underwent the famous "Great Depression".

Depends what you mean by collapse, but it seems that most countries in recent history who have rapidly switched to a free market economy have had more than a few difficulties.

 

[Drogear]

Greece, Emperor diff.

I was somewhat dissapointed when I launced a assult on Rome.

No cities taken yet by me and I got my stack marching at the city rome and 2 tiltes away they simply collaps. Rome goes to a independent state but I somehow recive one of their cities neir sicily with around 25 units in it! 3 galleys, 4 tiremes, 5-6 Legionars, 4 archers and some spearmen, settler and other.

This feels rather "cheap", now Im the superpower of the med. without even had to really fight for it.

 

[Elhoim]

Has any civilization actually collapsed from switching to a free market economic system? America had been a free market economy for 150 years when it underwent the famous "Great Depression".

Well, here in Argentina we have great crisis every ten years.

 

[Rhye]

Great Depression doesn't mean automatic collapse. It's just a big stability hit

 

[Phallus]

Can depressions coincide with a golden age?

 

[Rhye]

yes, but this is a good remark. I'll make this no longer possible

 

[werttrew]

Some more bugs, suggestions, and ideas:

*Would it be possible to have the Independent-Nations-Automatically-Vassals-of-Reborn-Civs turned off when the “No Vassals” option is checked off when customizing a scenario?
*Would it be possible to have the Unique American Power of immigrants check to see if a city has ‘avoid growth" on? I have had a surge of unhappiness in some cities when a carefully balanced city is suddenly pushed over the edge of happiness by immigration. Perhaps the immigrant bonus could go to another city instead?
*The city north of the Florida jungle, if settled by Americans/English, is called Jacksonville. One grid north of that the city is called St. Augustine. Hm? St. Augustine was founded by the Spanish, and it is south of Jacksonville. I’d suggest calling the city founded there either Savannah or Charleston for an English/American civ.
*Malicious gifting. I discovered I could send a civ teetering on collapse over the edge by giving them certain techs. This could be a useful tactic, but it may also be bug abuse. Just fyi.
*Idea: Refugees. When bordering a civ that is collapsing, there is a small chance each turn of “refugees” streaming across the border. Much like the immigrant unique power that America has, except there would be an unhappiness penalty in the cities (-2 “The influx of refugees is making us unhappy!”). They would be registered in your borders as culturally from the other civ, as well. Within 10 turns or so, the unhappiness modifier would disappear and they’d become naturalized. Perhaps Open Borders agreement with the collapsing civ would increase the refugee crisis...and perhaps if a civ finally collapses, the surge of refugees is guaranteed rather than a random chance, except they'd be "independents."

Why? Besides being realistic, it would be another factor in the stability process and motivation to ensure that neighboring civs DON’T collapse. As it is, it is currently in your best interest in most cases to do whatever you can to make sure they do collapse.

 

[Lord Apolon]

-Rhye said the vassal bug is fixed in the imminent next version.

-I think this would make sense. America has gone through periods of being immigrant-unfriendly, so I don't see why individual cities couldn't. Not sure if it's possible in-game, though.

-What techs? Nationalism? I've avoided that for a long time.. I'm Germany/all of Europe. And want to keep the 'all of Europe' part.

-I like the refugees idea. It could perhaps replace the generic modifier for a neighbor teetering, since the unhappiness would have the same effect and is somewhat preventable.


Two ideas of my own, related:

The independents tend to disband most of the units in their newly acquired cities. It might make conquest a bit more.. challenging if they kept the fierce grenadier stacks instead of killing everything except the one longbowman.
Also, since the independents are supposed to be, in large parts, remnants of states which have devolved into civil war: Why not set the two independent states to war with each other? I feel like that would make for some good fun watchin'. Maybe if an independent bloc managed to reassemble most of a nation (i.e. the independent cities of Babylon and Shush conquer Ninawa and Ur), the nation could come back, even if pre-nationalism.

 

[Elhoim]

It would be nice to see some comebacks before nationalism. I think that unifications from barbarians and civil wars ocurred way before the advent of nationalism.

 

[SadoMacho]

and also long gone civs becoming independent from the independents

 

[MrThing]

It would be nice to see some comebacks before nationalism. I think that unifications from barbarians and civil wars ocurred way before the advent of nationalism.

Perhaps it is possible to have it infrequently occur prior to nationalism?

 

[Rhye]

Two observations and two suggestions:

*Final requirement for American Historical Victory. I'm playing the U.S. now and there are only three other civilizations as of 1958. By 2000 I need four vassals, which would be impossible by game terms to accomplish. Now, I may get lucky and have a few new civs pop up, but in the last 50 turns or so, there have been no more than five other civs at any one time, and then only for a handful of turns.

this goal was changed a few builds ago

 

[hamtastic]

Say I was just looking at this, and noticed:

++ on palace built

Isn't that sort of... subject to abuse? I mean it might be a pain to actually go around rebuilding your palace all the time. Still, do you really want to increase stability upon a change in the location of the center of goverment? Seems slightly backward. Maybe a palace getting built should be a -- instead?

 

[Rhye]

i meant the summer and forbidden palaces

 

[werttrew]

this goal was changed a few builds ago

D'oh! You're right, of course. I just double-checked it. I had written it down from an old version and didn't bother to see if it had been updated.

You're really good, Rhye: you fix complaints before they're even asked!

 

[SilverKnight]

Two ideas of my own, related:

The independents tend to disband most of the units in their newly acquired cities. It might make conquest a bit more.. challenging if they kept the fierce grenadier stacks instead of killing everything except the one longbowman.
Also, since the independents are supposed to be, in large parts, remnants of states which have devolved into civil war: Why not set the two independent states to war with each other? I feel like that would make for some good fun watchin'. Maybe if an independent bloc managed to reassemble most of a nation (i.e. the independent cities of Babylon and Shush conquer Ninawa and Ur), the nation could come back, even if pre-nationalism.

This stuck out to me. That'd be AMAZING! Furthermore, it's a bit annoying to not know which bloc of Independents I'm at war with. If Germany collapses to my east, and I see an opportunity for my French armies to expand, which group of formerly Spanish cities need I worry about? Could they at least have different names/colors, like "Independents" and "Free States" or something?

SilverKnight

 

[fearuin]

Hey, do you remember my proposal of some help about stability factors when changing civics? I've just got an idea! Don't know if it would be complex, but I suppose it won't, and it will really help!: how about adding some messages about stability increases/reductions, when any change on civics happened? (Only about YOUR civ, don't want either a lot of spam about what others civs do with their life) You'll get some info like "Sire, adopting X civic caused us to (greatly) increase/decrease our stability". Simply by doing this, you can feedback easily what has happened.

Another suggestion: how about a stability advisor? A button to enter in its screen would be next to the one of mercenaries, and it will show a table indicating "Factors of unstability" and "Factors of stability", and how much influences each factor. If you don't like to give numbers (what could be definitevely really helpful), use simple description as "Heavy/Strong/Weak" influence. This one will be more complex to code, I guess.