Missouri Panel: Illegal Immigration, Legal Abortion Linked

[Turner]

This is rich!

Mo. Panel: Immigration, Abortion Linked

By DAVID A. LIEB
The Associated Press
Monday, November 13, 2006; 6:25 PM

JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. -- A Republican-led legislative panel claims in a new report on illegal immigration that abortion is partly to blame because it is causing a shortage of American workers.

The report from the state House Special Committee on Immigration Reform also claims "liberal social welfare policies" have discouraged Americans from working and encouraged immigrants to cross the border illegally.

The statements about abortion, welfare policies and a recommendation to abolish income taxes in favor of sales taxes were inserted into the immigration report by the committee chairman, Rep. Ed Emery.

All six Democrats on the panel refused to sign the report. Some of them called the abortion assertion ridiculous and embarrassing.

"There's a lot of editorial comment there that I couldn't really stomach," Rep. Trent Skaggs said Monday. "To be honest, I think it's a little delusional."

All 10 Republican committee members signed the report, though one of them, Rep. Billy Pat Wright, said Monday he didn't recall it connecting abortion and illegal immigration.

Emery, who equates abortion to murder, defended the assertions.

"We hear a lot of arguments today that the reason that we can't get serious about our borders is that we are desperate for all these workers," Emery said. "You don't have to think too long. If you kill 44 million of your potential workers, it's not too surprising we would be desperate for workers."

National Right to Life estimates there have been more than 47 million abortions since the Supreme Court established a woman's right to abortion in its 1973 Roe v. Wade ruling. The immigration report estimates there are 80,000 fewer Missourians because of abortion, many of whom now would have been in a "highly productive age group for workers."

The abortion connection to illegal immigration was listed under the report's recommendations on federal social policies and potential state legislative actions on illegal hiring.

"Suggestions for how to stop illegal hiring varied without any simple solution," the report states. "The lack of traditional work ethic, combined with the effects of 30 years of abortion and expanding liberal social welfare policies have produced a shortage of workers and a lack of incentive for those who can work."

Democrats contend the abortion statement wasn't discussed, much less agreed to, by the committee. Emery said there was some testimony about abortion during a question-and-answer session at one of the hearings, although he couldn't recall by whom.

"I felt like that was significant enough and fundamental enough that it warranted addressing it in the report," he said.

Missouri does not keep records of oral testimony during legislative committee hearings.

Skaggs said the abortion statement undermines the credibility of the entire report, which was submitted to the House speaker's office late last week.

"That's ridiculous to draw that conclusion. I don't think that has anything to do with immigration," said committee member Rep. Ed Wildberger, the chairman of the House Democratic caucus.

The report also includes short essays by Emery about the history of immigration, the purpose of immigration laws and the importance of a common language. In those, he notes "the issue of illegal immigration does not lend itself to compromise."

 

[garric]

Think about the amount of people lost to abortion. I know you will argue abortion isn't murder, but if there was no abortion these "fetuses" would turn in to people and grow up as workers. This makes perfect sense.

 

[Turner]

What makes you think I don't think abortion is murder?

 

[amadeus]

Seeing as there have been about 1.5 million abortions performed every year since 1980, I can see how that would have shrunken the labor supply by a pretty significant amount.

 

[Turner]

I'm still not hearing as to why that contributes to Illegal Immigration.

 

[QuoVadisNation]

First, what makes us assume those American citizens will flock to low-paying jobs?

Second, what part of that panel's brain thinks that illegal immigration occurs simply because of too few laborers? Companies want below minimum wage employees, and illegal immigrants are providing.

 

[De Lorimier]

A Republican-led legislative panel claims in a new report on illegal immigration that abortion is partly to blame because it is causing a shortage of American workers.

The report from the state House Special Committee on Immigration Reform also claims "liberal social welfare policies" have discouraged Americans from working and encouraged immigrants to cross the border illegally.

The statements about abortion, welfare policies and a recommendation to abolish income taxes in favor of sales taxes were inserted into the immigration report by the committee chairman, Rep. Ed Emery.

People don't come to the United States because there's a low birthrate in Nebraska! They come for a better life for themselves. Illegal immigration has no link to abortion.

And the rest is typical Republicans at work. Attach bogus claims about welfare, taxes and minimum wage, because abortion is murder, but taking care of the living is even worst!

 

[JohnRM]

Seeing as there have been about 1.5 million abortions performed every year since 1980, I can see how that would have shrunken the labor supply by a pretty significant amount.

The total number of abortions, annually, peaked in 1990 at 1,608,600. Since then, there has been a steady decline with an estimated 1,293,000 being performed, annually. It is, however, harder to calculate the number of abortions per year, because of new laws protecting patient information and the refusal of many providers to provide statistical information. The number could be much higher or lower.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

The assumption here is that those millions of aborted babies would have grown up to be our servants. All of those Americans who never lived would have been just as averse to grape picking, dishwashing and babysitting as all the rest of us are. The answer to illegal immigration isnt to end abortion, its to pay a decent wage for all of those tasks, and therefore make them more attractive to Americans.

 

[HannibalBarka]

Well I am not amrican, but I'd rather live in a country where abortion is legal and immigrant aren't than the opposite.
Other wise, I almost agree with what Bozo said.I however add improving condition in Latin America to his list, as people will still migrate to the US as long as Mexico and other LA countries remain pooor.

 

[blackheart]

Think about the amount of people lost to abortion. I know you will argue abortion isn't murder, but if there was no abortion these "fetuses" would turn in to people and grow up as workers. This makes perfect sense.

No it isn't, considering most of those aborted would have been born into a lower-class poor family. And it is fact that people from the poor are statistically more likely to commit crimes. So it can be said (however cynically) that we have gotten less criminals from abortions.

 

[puglover]

Think about the amount of people lost to abortion. I know you will argue abortion isn't murder, but if there was no abortion these "fetuses" would turn in to people and grow up as workers. This makes perfect sense.

You're right. But children should not be viewed as "future workers." They should be viewed as young life.

No it isn't, considering most of those aborted would have been born into a lower-class poor family. And it is fact that people from the poor are statistically more likely to commit crimes. So it can be said (however cynically) that we have gotten less criminals from abortions.

Your argument is faulty.

"Many dead fetuses would have been lower class if they had lived. Many lower class members steal. Therefore, the dead fetuses would have stolen."

 

[.Shane.]

Wow. That is one of the most embarrassing things I've ever read. The only thing that surprises me is that he failed to find a way to link it all to the teaching of evolution.

 

[Uiler]

No it isn't, considering most of those aborted would have been born into a lower-class poor family. And it is fact that people from the poor are statistically more likely to commit crimes. So it can be said (however cynically) that we have gotten less criminals from abortions.

Actually I suspect that abortions are higher amongst the better educated and the rich. The other thing is lower class Americans aren't exactly flocking to the jobs that illegal immigrants are doing now anyway. At least not at that pay level.

Face it everyone. There are two very simple reasons why illegal immigration is so rampant in America and they have nothing to do with abortion. These are:

1) America, the richest planet on earth, shares large land borders with some very poor countries with corrupt governments.

2) Americans complain a lot about illegal immigration but let's fact facts. A lot of Americans, probably the majority, don't care about quality or work conditions and only want cheap, cheap, cheap. This can be seen in other things like the rise of Walmart. They whinge about illegal immigration and then go cruising down to pick up a day worker (probably illegal) to fix their garden up because it's so much cheaper. Nor are they willing to pay more money for food (in order to increase wages). A large part of the cause of illegal immigration are your relatives, your friends, the guy next door, the companies you work for and maybe even you. This is probably the harder of the two because it requires people to (a) face the fact that they are part of the problem instead of blaming everything on remote external factors and (b) change their lifestyles.

I'm not sure that this is even possible to change. Illegal immigrants are an integral part of the American economy now. Like the low low prices of Chinese imports allow even welfare families to afford electronics, the low low wages and crap crap working conditions of illegal immigrants provide the cleaners, gardeners, child-core workers, farm workers that keep prices for goods and services low. Of course it probably also increases unemployment and drives down wages but that's just for the lower class. Are people really willing to suddenly pay substantially more for food and services? Hell, most people are unwilling to pay substantially more for some quality electronics than for something from China. So the answer is no. In fact, can most middle-class and working-class people, already burdened with debt *afford* to pay substantially more for food and services? Would you be willing to pay I don't know, an extra 30% more for your fruits and veggies so that American citizens can be hired instead of illegal immigrants?

Maybe the best way to combat illegal immigration is to start a campaign to have food producers, cleaning companies etc. "certified" as illegal-free. Their services and products would probably be more expensive as this will be the premium for having to pay more to American citizens to do the same jobs as illegals and for extra paperwork for checking the immigration status but if you really care about illegal immigration you would be willing to pay this cost. It'd be a bit like the organic label I guess which also carries a cost premium. Organic stuff is pretty popular so I guess this sort of certification will allow people to put their money where their mouths are. How much do you *really* care about illegal immigration?

 

[Lambert Simnel]

Wow. That is one of the most embarrassing things I've ever read. The only thing that surprises me is that he failed to find a way to link it all to the teaching of evolution.

Truly a missed opportunity, eh ?

 

[bhsup]

Jingoist statement: My State goverment said it, so it must be true.

More realistic statement: It's plausible, but there could be a lot of reasons why they shouldn't be linked. Let MU study it for awhile and see if there is any validity to the claim.

 

[.Shane.]

I do find it hilarious that some of the right-wingers will defend this. I doubt they'd so eagerly come to the ramparts to defend the economic study that argued that abortion was the reason for the decline in crime in the early-mid 90's.

Oh, and unlike the nutjob in MO, I'm actually providing a link to a useful read, not making this up in my head.

source...

 

[ShannonCT]

No it isn't, considering most of those aborted would have been born into a lower-class poor family. And it is fact that people from the poor are statistically more likely to commit crimes. So it can be said (however cynically) that we have gotten less criminals from abortions.

You must be referring to the study by Steven Levitt and Stephen Dubner, a summary of which is found in their book Freakonomics.

I think our illegal immigration policy and enforcement is so lax because we know that we need the cheap labor to make our domestic industries competitive. I'm not sure that having all those aborted children in the labor pool would provide the cheap labor that illegal immigrants now provide. The demographics that have the most abortions are also the ones that have the highest unemployment rates and public assistance rates. People in poverty often believe that they are better off accepting public assistance and not working, and maybe trying to supplement their income through other activities.

 

[ShannonCT]

Actually I suspect that abortions are higher amongst the better educated and the rich. The other thing is lower class Americans aren't exactly flocking to the jobs that illegal immigrants are doing now anyway. At least not at that pay level.

That suspicion is wrong according to Levitt and Dubner (Freakonomics, p.138, citing a study in the Quartely Journal of Economics (1999), "Abortion Legalized and Child Living Circumstances: Who Is the Marginal Child"). The data showed that an aborted child would have been 50% more likely than the average child to grow up in poverty and 60% more likely to live with only one parent.

 

[Uiler]

That suspicion is wrong according to Levitt and Dubner (Freakonomics, p.138, citing a study in the Quartely Journal of Economics (1999), "Abortion Legalized and Child Living Circumstances: Who Is the Marginal Child"). The data showed that an aborted child would have been 50% more likely than the average child to grow up in poverty and 60% more likely to live with only one parent.

Well, OK, I stand corrected. But I think the point still stands. I doubt it's so much lack of workers that is causing illegal immigration. It is lack of workers who are willing to work on the wage level and crap conditions bereft of all legal protection as illegal workers and they are only able to do that because they are illegal. You have to ask yourself, is it fair to ask other Americans to do so just so you can have ultracheap cleaners and cheap lettuce? I mean the conditions and wages of illegal immigrants are really really bad. I'm sure if you up the wages of farm workers or cleaners up a bit quite a few more Americans will be willing to take those jobs but I've seen a lot of farmers complain that consumers are simply unwilling to pay the price that hiring legal workers demands.

If these abortions didn't happen, the end result would be just a whole lot more people on welfare than a whole lot of new workers.