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MLG7: Another Race to Space

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by pholkhero, Feb 5, 2008.

  1. glenmetz

    glenmetz Prince

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2006
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    464
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    How does one check the amount of turns in the game? Plan on playing quite a bit this weekend.
     
  2. Tatran

    Tatran Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2002
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    4,184
    Nothing...
     
  3. pholkhero

    pholkhero Deviant Mind

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    Philadelphia
    remember, though, only the first 50 turns should be reported on in Rd 1

    anybody else get that?? I'll take a look at the save that i have, too, of your game in a few hours.

    oh come on ~ did you already play 40 turns and then check :)
     
  4. Tatran

    Tatran Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2002
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    4,184
    Sorry for that comment (not enough :sleep:).
    Nothing wrong with the amount of turns. :blush:
    Yeah, you're right Pholkhero.
     
  5. blid

    blid Emperor

    Joined:
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    paris
    I was wondering about that. Where can I find the ground rules for reporting on those games ?
    [EDIT] :
    - Also, do we have to stop and compare games at each round before resuming playing ? I laready screwed that since I'm at turn 100
     
  6. pholkhero

    pholkhero Deviant Mind

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    sorry, i forgot that we've got some new players this game ~

    for the first few rounds, it's 50 turns a piece. You don't have to STOP playing at this point, but please only report those first 50. Also, when you post your report, please include a save so that I can try and get some figures for a chart.

    however, as the first round is mostly development, i WON'T be putting anything together as I don't think we'll see much differentiation at this point btwn games. also, of special interest will be the Liz and Wang comparisons, as we've got a SE and a CE of both leaders ~ should be fun.

    here's a blatant rip-off of RJ's rules:
     
  7. Meatbuster

    Meatbuster formerly Robo Kai

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2005
    Messages:
    2,302
    Location:
    Philippines
    Turn 1-50 GO GO GO!

    Spoiler De Gaulle's plans :
    The plans:

    1. Build Pyramids or Hanging Gardens, steal Wonders.
    Hopefully find stone.
    Wonder-based engineer-based CE.
    This is Monarch, but hey, we're not Industrious for nothing.

    2. Backup plan if lose Pyramids: No more wonders, just crush them. Industrious affords fast Forges, so that will help a lot.
    3. Get to Civil Service

    Planned wonders to take:
    Pyramids
    Hanging Gardens
    Oracle
    G.Lighthouse (coastal)
    Hagia Sophia
    Taj Mahal
    ...then we'll see...

    Caveat: I won't build Great Library due to... too much deviation from CE. As if the Salon wasn't enough.


    Spoiler De Gaulle's Tech and Story :
    Teching so far during 50 turns:
    Wheel (starting tech)
    Agriculture (starting tech)
    Mining
    Bronze
    Fishing
    Animal Husbandry
    Hunting
    Masonry in 7 turns

    First 50 turns:
    I found the coast via the warrior, so I decided to go for a coastal capital. (EDIT,note: Not as "coastal" as the SE players though.)
    Even though planning to Rex, I went size 4 first before starting a Settler (due to abundant food).
    Started revolt to Slavery only after settler is build.
    Meet Montezuma (founder of Hindu), Isabella and Survayaman.

    Check out our glorious France at 2000BC:



    Spoiler Comparison (will be updated as more reports come in, note I already played up to turn 150, so...) :

    Shadzy: Just about to finish settler at the end of 50 turns. Got Stonehenge, I'm looking forward to your SE game with Great Prophet to start. Also, you probably didn't pick the coastal capital because of being an SE, that's fine, and I'd love to see different capital city locations of everyone.
    Kanga: Not bad! Not bad at all. Thank God, I though I was the only one REXing. Noble player, huh? Lies. At least you know what to do.
    Quotey: I know pholk didn't pick the lakes map, but he DID set No Barbarians. I knew from the time I saw no animals. :) As for the capital's location, I'm a CE, so I decided it wasn't great to have a capital with so little land (nearer to the fish). As for spoiler, I played quite far already so I guess it's OK to spoil myself.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. Kanga_DU

    Kanga_DU Warlord

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2006
    Messages:
    283
    Spoiler :

    Whoa! Monarch? Eek, gonna get pantsed… and whats this normal speed? God I need to look at the details sometimes. I’m noble/epic normally.

    Why Peter? Well the Philo trait helps the SE without a doubt. The late game UB for a space launch, doesn’t hurt. Expansive for the worker boost in the early game and the health bonus is useful. I’ll need some workers to get farms happening after all.

    Early plans depend on proximity of neighbors and the layout of key resources. If there is space it'll be more land grabbing.

    I'd like to nab Pyramids, Great Library. Maybe try a few others, but nothing definite yet.


    Spoiler :

    In the beginning the earth was without form … and void.

    Righto, moving the warrior to that hill to see what I can see. Fish! :clap: Thats an improvement.

    Now to contemplate a settler move. Lets go one SE and see if options open up? Start looks too food poor for my liking. Perhaps bronze or iron… that’d help with worker production, once I’ve got worker techs. :lol:



    Ok, disappointing. Well lets roll the dice once more and SE one more spot.



    Bingo! Looking a Moai statues site and maybe a later palace move? Fishing for first tech. Good gp farm at a first look though.

    But wait! The AI is suggesting one more move SW.



    :hammer2: Blast that blue circle. It made me move one more square. No benefit at all, just a wasted turn. Well I was never in the running for early religion so it probably dun matter much.

    Turn 8 – Fishing in, swap Moscow to a workboat. Start BW. I think I should be whipping hard in Moscow.



    Nice, a tech from a hut.

    9 – Buddha visits a distant land

    10- Hinduism FIDL. Wasting three turns moving meant I was never a chance for early religion, but looks like there’s at least two civs starting with Mysticism.

    16 – Gold from a hut.

    21 BW done. I’m revolting! However what’s next… yes petting zoos are a lovely idea.



    Bummer, no bronze in easy reach. Well I was looking at the jungle anyhow and wondering how long before I had to get Iron Working. Could be next I think. Hope for iron in the BFC. :yumyum:

    22 Whip the workboat and slot another in before the warrior.

    23 Next workboat in 4 and I’ll let warrior fish then.

    24 In the blue corner, the Khmer. It should have been rouge.



    27 Khmer revolts to slavery too. He’s got bronze and a lovely flood plains/bronze to expand too. Bastard.

    32 We can now pat animals. Khmer have metal and I don’t! Lets find some metal so we can make branding irons. Moscow starts another warrior, with a worker next.

    37 Great its TPBFH. Hello Bella.

    38 Swap a settler in to whip asap, which I whip out a few turns later.

    46 St Pete founded and starts a warrior. I’ll get anther settler out of Moscow pronto for iron if needs be.
    Wonderful it’s the other half of that whacky duo.



    48 Worker starts on pigs.

    51 Yes I went a turn to far, so bite me.



    It’s a classic. Iron in BFC. Wooty! Sailing starts.



    Well considering the intricate plans I laid down, I think I exceeded all expectations. :rolleyes: I’m still in the game.

    Next set: Get a third city out pronto – try for the best production I can get close by. Writing asap. Maybe have a shot at the oracle for gold or lucky tech. Hmmm Pyramids might be hard to get. Not a stone in sight. Not a lot of happies near either. Need to think further at this time. Maybe some dot mapping.









    http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/80073/MLG7_BC-1960_just_after_iron.CivBeyondSwordSave
     
  9. Quotey

    Quotey Emperor

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    Messages:
    1,459
    The Aim:

    Spoiler :

    -To find a better capital position
    -To maybe start a settler?
    -TO FIND STONE!

    fOR THE GAME:

    Win. Take a lot of time over the Monarch sets. Oy vey.


    The Report:

    Spoiler :

    Turn 1 (1)

    I'm unimpressed with the starting position.

    The warrior moves onto the hill.

    Yes! Fish.

    Settler 2 SE...



    CLAMS. CLAMS. Woo!

    Wait, what's that? PIGS? The second best food source in the game.... oh, pigs, wonderful pigs.....

    Turn 2 (2)

    SETTLE WASHINGTON! Start on a Workboat.

    The worst thing? The site has no hills. :(

    Research hunting.

    Turn 6 (6)

    Start Archery.

    Turn 21 (21)

    Complete Mining. The first turns are never interesting.

    Turn 34 (34)

    Complete BW.



    No copper, few resources.

    Turn 43 (43)

    AH completes. Research set on writing.

    Turn 44 (44)

    I whip the Settler

    Turn 47 (47)

    Meet Suryavarman of the Khmer. What a happy coincidence.

    Turn 48 (48)

    Found New York. I also switch my research to Mysticism.




    The After Play Report:

    Spoiler :

    Well well well. The aims?

    -To find a better capital position DONE
    -To maybe start a settler? New York founded, as a production city.
    -TO FIND STONE! No stone.

    Perhaps Archery first was dumb, but I needed Hunting and I am afraid of barbs.

    I expect the future tech path to be: Myst -> Writing -> Wheel -> Masonry

    New York will build the pyramids. I am working on a dotmap, and I'll post it later. But there isn't a

    ton of food.

    I really wish I had Stone :(

    Tech Path:

    Hunting, Archery, Mining, Bronze Working, Animal Husbandry, Writing (85 beakers 5 turns left), Mysticism (31 beakers 3 turns left)



    Can I read other reports now or do I wait until the next round?

    The save.
     
  10. Meatbuster

    Meatbuster formerly Robo Kai

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Philippines
    Hey Mr. Quotey! I read the other reports myself, but that's because I already played 100 turns further and I probably won't spoil anything. It's up to you if you want to be spoiled though.

    BTW No Barbarians.
     
  11. Quotey

    Quotey Emperor

    Joined:
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    TLO: Oops, just noticed the spoiler.

    Spoiler :
    No barbs? Yeeee gads, that sucks. Only six turns wasted though. Hopefully Sury or someone will declare war to justify my
    Archery decision :p
     
  12. TheLastOne36

    TheLastOne36 Deity

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    14,045
    maybe you don't know the rules, but discussion about the games before Mr. Pholk brings up the round report should be contained in spoilers because not everybody has played yet.
     
  13. Meatbuster

    Meatbuster formerly Robo Kai

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    Philippines
    But yeah, "No Barbs" is a game setting, not discussion.

    Now I can't wait to post my turn 51-100 report... and I'd love to read the other CE players' starts. Who else? :D
     
  14. Shadzy19

    Shadzy19 Warmonger

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Belgium
    I already played my first 100 aswell so took a look at the saves.
    Il edit this post when more saves come in aswell.

    Kanga_DU
    Spoiler :
    Pretty strong turnset , you made the right move moving your settler I think , despite the zero production in there you got a incredible food surplus and what more do you need anyway for the early game , you can whip settlers very fast and make some workers untill the whip anger goes away , will be very nice to rex with .

    Pretty bold move to go IW so fast , do you plan on rushing anyone or was it just to be one the safe side?

    I dont quite understand the use of your second city , it seems like a very bad place atm with no food resources . Sure you can chop away the jungle for the banana but that takes quite a while and only gives 3 food anyway.
    Wouldnt the FP+sheep+horse city the rice+hills city been better?(offcourse depending on how you settle)


    Quotey
    Spoiler :
    Nice work on the settler move , a capital with that much food surplus and 8 happy faces once you get the ivory and monument hooked up will give you a very strong opening position.
    Tough luck on archery although it will have its uses to keep your power rating up .
    I see you got quite a bit of gold from huts , that should help finance your early research a bit , something SE lacks off without a gems/gold nearby.
    GL with the pyramids , its quite a risk without industrious or stone.


    Robo Kai
    Spoiler :
    Did you see the fish when you settled your capital?
    It doesnt strike me as very good capitol city with no production , and nearly no forests to chop wonders in .
    It has very good food income so you can cottage up everything without worry's but the lack of production to help with the +50% hammer boost from bureaucracy will mostly be wasted unless you move it or settle some GP's .


    2 free techs!
    And I thought I got lucky with free masonry!

    Also a little math about worker first in your second city :
    At size 1 you build the worker in 15 turns
    If you just grow to size 2 (8turns) you will need 12 turns to complete the worker (1extra food surplus) , but after 6 turns you can whip the worker.
    Conclusion , growing to size 2 and whipping when able would have granted you the worker 1 turn earlier , gave you 8 extra hammers while growing to size 2 and would have granted 6 extra :commerce: from working the flood plain at size 2 , something to consider next time.


    Side note : every time I want to check the logs in other ppl's saves my game closes , anyone else has this problem?
     
  15. Ralph_Jackson

    Ralph_Jackson Emperor

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    Location:
    Edinburgh Scotland
    This is most probably beacuse people are using the BUG mod.

    Ralph
     
  16. Meatbuster

    Meatbuster formerly Robo Kai

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    Location:
    Philippines
    Spoiler re:shadzy :
    Sorry for the confusion, those techs weren't free from huts. French start with Agri and Wheel. *edits my old post*

    I prefer the extra land to put my extra cottages in the future, rather than be stuck with water tiles (De Gaulle = not Financial) with +1 production (if Moai'ed). Also it's a bad capital production wise, but that isn't too much felt as 2 extra food sources are already good (think Slavery). Plus hereditary rule rocks!
     
  17. Kanga_DU

    Kanga_DU Warlord

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    283
    Shadzy:
    Spoiler :

    Thanks, that was my thinking is whip compensated production and I will likely put Moai there. I expect I will move the capital at some point.

    Iron Working was as there was no copper to be had, and the Khmer had it. True they are a "safe" distance away, there was also the vast swathes of jungle I was seeing.

    I'm not seeing a rush as very viable yet, the distance is an issue. So it'd be only to raze not keep at this point. Fortunately the UU for Russia is mid game which looks the likely war for land time at this time. However its a get to space game not conquest/domination, so I'm not determined to war yet. So lets just it's say to be on the safe side and to nab the good jungle spots first.

    In retrospect, St Pete probably would of been better in the sheep/horse location, but I should have another settler out in about 5 turns for that spot and I'd be settling that spot anyhow with a city.

    I might not have much else to do with the worker other than chopping jungle whilst waiting for worker techs. :dunno:

    Oh and yes I use the bug mod.

     
  18. Ozbenno

    Ozbenno Fly Fly Away Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    Spoiler :
    Well some starting thoughts and reasoning.

    Why Elizabeth?

    Well I didn't pick Lizzie at all (would have chosen Darius actually) but when this game was first discussed, pholk said it would be interesting to have two Lizzies one playing CE and one playing SE to compare the two. We decided that it would be best to try and get two players evenly matched. As the combined finishing date between TriviAl and myself being 3 turns in the last 3 completed MLG games (2 in MLG3, 1 in MLG4 and same turn in MLG5) the challange was set and accepted by TriviAl.

    In fact both of us have a problematic leader, only one trait is that useful, for me that is financial. Basically that means cottage, cottage, cottage. Good for a CE heh!

    Enough jibber jabber, let's look at the save.

    Not that great really. No beautiful flood plains at all. But same for both sides, if there ain't enough food to cottage everything, there ain't enough food for specialists. I move the warrior 1SW. He shows nothing else but I pretty much always settle in place and do so.

    Start on a warrior but really unsure about starting tech. The only resourse is cows so Agriculture it is. Quick count shows -11 food. Yuk! That means I pretty much won't be able to cottage anything here.

    My goals are to explore, find the neighbours, identify some city sites and get cracking.

    Pop Hunting from a hut.



    I change research to Animal Husbandry.

    Oh joy, Monty.

    Next turn Mehmed.

    You know what they look like

    And Sury later on.

    York founded. maybe get some cottages going here.



    And just like that we're done.



    The land ain't the greatest. I think I'll settle north, maybe just a couple of cities west. I'm building another settler for the coast. After Iron Working and Calendar there is some decent land up in the jungle if the AI doesn't get there first.

    Might look at chopping something out of London next set as well (Pyramids would be the obvious but Representation is nerfed so maybe Oracle).

    I started a cottage in London just to be hornery but it might just be the only one.

    Research: Hunting (hut), Animal Husbandry, Bronze Working, The Wheel, Pottery, Mysticism, Writing (unfinished)
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Ozbenno

    Ozbenno Fly Fly Away Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    Query: Are us CEers allowed to build National Park?
     
  20. Quotey

    Quotey Emperor

    Joined:
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    1,459
    One would assume you can for health issues. Otherwise you can choose the specialists, so no. Citizens are probably okay, but a grey area.

    Shadyz:

    Spoiler :
    I think it's a risk getting the pyramids, but no worries. I expect a pre 500BC pyramids. So next set we'll see.

    Also, I can turn on the autologger if you want to see it, and obviously I can check the logs (also I played!) if you want any info now.


    Ozbenno: I don't think you are playing the right save:

    Spoiler :
    Noone has met Mehmed, and there is a Rice resource near the capital spot. And the nearest cows are plain ones.

    And there is certainly no desert copper.


    Robo_Kai:

    Spoiler :
    I don't agree with your capital location. You would have lost 0 good cottagable tiles and gained an awesome drafting city. Now lets see if you can get pyramids before me!


    Kanga:

    Spoiler :
    Noble/Epic buddies! Well, I sometimes play Prince. Also capital buddies? Don't understand the placement of St. Pete. Can you give some insight?
     

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