[MOD] Fall from Heaven

[Corlindale]

Just tried this mod yesterday, and I think it's really great.
Both techs, buildings and units seem to fit nicely into the mood of the game, and the various religions add a great element of roleplaying to the game. It's fun to be playing evil and ruthless necromancers, or nature-loving elves.

One thing I'd like to see developed is the whole "flavour" aspect of the mod. Flavour, in the sense of custom tech quotes, lore and background of the techs in the civilopedia and similar description of buildings, wonders and the like. This was part of what made Alpha Centauri such a great game, despite it's technologies and buildings being abstract and unfamiliar to most players. I know this is one of those things that do not have high priority, after all, I guess it's more important to work on the technical aspect of the game, and then flavour can always be added towards the end.
The religion sound effects are really well done, I truly feel evil every time I hear the sound of an Ashen Veil temple being constructed...

I'd like to see more custom units and abilities for each religion, and I also look forward to the spell system becoming more in-depth. Unique spells for each religion would be very nice.

 

[woodelf]

Kael - I absolutely love the skeleton skin job you did. Are they summoned anywhere in the game? It'd be a shame not to use them more. Also, any plans to skin more units into skeletons?

 

[Dragonlord]

First time I've made it back to the Forum since installing 0.60 - playing is so much fun, I don't have time to post!

Just a few quick notes for you Kael:

1. I also have the _TXT errors Woodelf mentioned. Specific instances I remember:
- in the City Screen the Defense % in the upper right corner
- in the Trade Advisor for Techs the AI won't trade

2. It's already been mentioned, but I'll repeat for anyone who hasn't installed yet: DELETE 0.50 FIRST!
I installed 0.60 over 0.50 and had a very hard crash from a 'siblings' error. I had to restart my PC several times before I could get ANY program to run again!!!!

3. Units XP points still reset after the patch, though at least only down to 10 XP now (as in Vanilla), no longer to 0
Thanks for the fix, but would it be possible to disable the reset totally?

Back to my game now...

 

[edu2003mdq]

I've been playing for hours now and it's a lot of fun. However, the _TXT msgs quoted by Woodelf appear. On the question of XP for the units, it won't reset in my game. It keeps accumulating.

Great mod!!!

 

[Black Whole]

Just a few quick notes for you Kael:

1. I also have the _TXT errors Woodelf mentioned. Specific instances I remember:
- in the City Screen the Defense % in the upper right corner
- in the Trade Advisor for Techs the AI won't trade

I've got them too. They also appear if you discover a new technology making possible a new civic and they ask you whether you want a revolution.

 

[Grimaldi]

After a few games, I never finished one, I finnally saw a high end unit build from the AI but otherwise there only lots of Axemen and Elvenranger.

1.) It is really easy to destroy a hole zivilisation after discovering the needs for the macemen. Because the nearly never has more than 4-5 defending units in the city. And even he has more then that most of them are Warriors.

2.) It would be nice to have a different skin for the Berserker or that he is bigger than the normal Axemen.

3.) It never happend that the AI declared war on me. Even I treated them really bad.

 

[Gladi]

Bright day
Great mod!

^ I got attacked by Aztecs in my last game, alas I always get attacked by Aztecs...

Bug:I have problem with irrigation text not appearing properly in tile info.

My Pet Peave: I am playing noble/prince epic games. My few lvl 12 warrior have NO oppostition in their rush across the whole continent...

 

[Kael]

Will it be possible to have magic resistence?
Lets say a dwarf has 10% to repell spells or elves has 5% & a city with mage inside has 10% to repell & 5%to reduce damage.

To me it seems pretty nasty to implement but I thought I might ask any way.

Yeap, its planned. It will be hard to implement but as I add mroe and more spells to the game it will be needed.

 

[Kael]

Just tried this mod yesterday, and I think it's really great.
Both techs, buildings and units seem to fit nicely into the mood of the game, and the various religions add a great element of roleplaying to the game. It's fun to be playing evil and ruthless necromancers, or nature-loving elves.

One thing I'd like to see developed is the whole "flavour" aspect of the mod. Flavour, in the sense of custom tech quotes, lore and background of the techs in the civilopedia and similar description of buildings, wonders and the like. This was part of what made Alpha Centauri such a great game, despite it's technologies and buildings being abstract and unfamiliar to most players. I know this is one of those things that do not have high priority, after all, I guess it's more important to work on the technical aspect of the game, and then flavour can always be added towards the end.
The religion sound effects are really well done, I truly feel evil every time I hear the sound of an Ashen Veil temple being constructed...

I'd like to see more custom units and abilities for each religion, and I also look forward to the spell system becoming more in-depth. Unique spells for each religion would be very nice.

I am in 100% agreement with you. The game is just a skeleton of what it should be right now. Just a proof of concept, it needs a lot of detail work.

 

[Kael]

Kael - I absolutely love the skeleton skin job you did. Are they summoned anywhere in the game? It'd be a shame not to use them more. Also, any plans to skin more units into skeletons?

Yeah, there is an armageddon spell planned (Knell of Darkness) that causes any living unit that dies indside your cultural borders to be raised as a skeleton. There is also a planned rank 1 necromancy spell that summons a skeleton.

 

[Kael]

3. Units XP points still reset after the patch, though at least only down to 10 XP now (as in Vanilla), no longer to 0
Thanks for the fix, but would it be possible to disable the reset totally?

Back to my game now...

The TXT errors have been fixed (Firaxis put a bunch of new txt defines in 1.52 and I didn't notice them before I released).

And you are right about the max xp after upgrade. I had allowed it to be unlimited but it got stepped on when I converted for the patch. Thanks for the heads up, I will make sure the next patch doesn't have any limit.

 

[Kael]

After a few games, I never finished one, I finnally saw a high end unit build from the AI but otherwise there only lots of Axemen and Elvenranger.

1.) It is really easy to destroy a hole zivilisation after discovering the needs for the macemen. Because the nearly never has more than 4-5 defending units in the city. And even he has more then that most of them are Warriors.

2.) It would be nice to have a different skin for the Berserker or that he is bigger than the normal Axemen.

3.) It never happend that the AI declared war on me. Even I treated them really bad.

AI is the #1 priority on my list right now. I have computer units casting spells now but Im still working on getting it to build and upgrade correctly.

 

[Sisonpyh]

Not sure if this has been mentioned. Built Typhoid Mary's Birthplace and Mary was never born.

 

[ichbinsehselber]

it is possible to produce unlimited amounts of hammers (production) by chopping and planting forests.
Would it be a good idea to restrict the number of elves a civ can have?

 

[Kael]

it is possible to produce unlimited amounts of hammers (production) by chopping and planting forests.
Would it be a good idea to restrict the number of elves a civ can have?

Yes, given infinite time. I don't mind using the the elves to produce hammers as long as it isn't to efficient. It was in 0.50 so the build time on the forests was increased for the elves. I think it works out to taking 7 turns to make the forest and 3 turns to chop it down. So you end up with a net effect of 30 hammers in 10 turns. I might reduce the hammer gain from chopping it down.

BTW, you can also boost production by sacrificing dwarves for production if you are following the Runes of Kilmorph.

 

[Levty]

The game seems more balanced now that patch came out, but still I have several issues:
1) Ranger isn't displayed correctly, I believe. Unless you wanted it to be a large red blob.
2) Mithril is far too scarce. On standard map there was only one and on small one none. It makes it very hard to produce knights.
3) I don't think that one is a mistake but it seems strange that units get 'mithril' promotions without having access to the ore.
4) It takes very long time for the AI to invent The Wheel. Hence it doesn't connect to the resources what generally slowes down it's advance.
5) Techs that do nothing (like Architecture) should be avoided. It would be fine to either add something to them or remove them. I would be for the first option
6) Leader traits are underbalanced - especially philosphical (which is terribly weakened) and spiritual (which seems overpowered)

More feedback in a couple of days

 

[Kael]

The game seems more balanced now that patch came out, but still I have several issues:
1) Ranger isn't displayed correctly, I believe. Unless you wanted it to be a large red blob.

Mine is showing up normally. Anyone else having this problem?

2) Mithril is far too scarce. On standard map there was only one and on small one none. It makes it very hard to produce knights.

You are right, I'm going to be adjusting resource rariety in the next version.

3) I don't think that one is a mistake but it seems strange that units get 'mithril' promotions without having access to the ore.

Yeah, I should probably rename those.

4) It takes very long time for the AI to invent The Wheel. Hence it doesn't connect to the resources what generally slowes down it's advance.

The AI is aware of the advantage of roads, it is up to it if it decides to go for it or not. I tend not to mess with the logic if I haven't changed it (I leave that to Firaxis).

5) Techs that do nothing (like Architecture) should be avoided. It would be fine to either add something to them or remove them. I would be for the first option

Yeah, I clipped Initative in this version for the same reason. I will be working through the tech tree to fix this stuff. Like you I would rather make it do something rather than remove it but it needs some work (and a lot of re-flavoring). Right now I am working on the AI, but I have this on my list.

6) Leader traits are underbalanced - especially philosphical (which is terribly weakened) and spiritual (which seems overpowered)

More feedback in a couple of days

Yeah, Im really enjoying my Egyptian Spiritual/Creative combo. Im sure your right, and they need balancing. I will add it to my list.

Let me know if you find anything else, this is great stuff.

 

[loki1232]

1.
I agree about the leader traits being unbalanced.
I would suggest strengthening all of the traits, not weakening.
I know you earlier wanted diff. buildings for units to cost more or less based on leader traits. I now like that idea.

In .5 I used Arabia, philosophical and spiritual.
Spiritual was great, it meant that as soon as i discovered a new civic i would switch, even if it wasn't much of an improvement. (agricultural is an example of a civic that is not very good, but was available early and i used because i could switch without losing any turns.
The philosophical became useful because i focused heavily on great persons. I added lots of specialists, and used the pacifist and humanitarian civics. However, now that pacifism was weakened the great people strategy probably won't work, so philosophical is just a small bonus, but not good enough to base your civ. on.

I think it would work better if spiritual was left as it is, and all the other traits, (especially philosophical) were improved.

2.
Someone suggested that spellcasters could gain some XP by staying in cities with towers and other magic buildings.
I really like this idea and think that even if we can manage the XP from succesful spells, this should be included as a way to gain some XP. It seems reasonable that in times of peace mages could be able to learn better spells by studying in universities.
Also, this would finally settle the debate of who wins: A mage that studies or a mage that goes and kills monsters.

 

[loki1232]

5) Techs that do nothing (like Architecture) should be avoided. It would be fine to either add something to them or remove them. I would be for the first option

I agree that adding more is always better than not adding more.
Luckily, we already have those incredible design docs to tell us what to add.

Speaking of which, if you have any more of them would you mind posting them?

 

[Kael]

2.
Someone suggested that spellcasters could gain some XP by staying in cities with towers and other magic buildings.
I really like this idea and think that even if we can manage the XP from succesful spells, this should be included as a way to gain some XP. It seems reasonable that in times of peace mages could be able to learn better spells by studying in universities.
Also, this would finally settle the debate of who wins: A mage that studies or a mage that goes and kills monsters.

That was Question Mark, and I agree it is a a really good idea.