Multipolarity IV Game Thread

[Jehoshua]

A state can have multiple benefactors. Iran with Russia/Britain, Germany with France, Britain, and the US, etc.

Minor nations should act in their rational interest... while a state could accept Horde protection there'd be nothing stopping it from accepting say, Arstotzka protection, barring some ideological barrier.

If anything being aligned to two nations is advantageous since it ensures a buffer is maintained.

That nations can have multiple affiliations is the reason why I requested Komi, Ryazan and Volgograd renounce the protection of Artzozka and Siberia publically, which of course they have done.

More specifically on this matter you have neglected to add that affiliating with multiple powers when both have potentially conflicting interests is a very risky game. If war breaks out who do you side with? In such a scenario you risk pissing off one, or both, of said powers and having that tenuous balance between the two shattered before your eyes along with your independence. This being because if a critical point is reached between the two "great and powerful friends", and it comes to war, the small state has to pick a side or risk the wrath of both. (Thus the debate within Australian foreign policy at the moment on what to do should our great economic friend China, find itself in a conflict with our current strategic great and powerful friend the United States)

-

@Ailedhoo

Still waiting to know how many slaves the Golden Horde is recieving from the cleaning out of Yunnans judicial system... commercial interchange is very difficult if one does not know how much stock one has...

-

IC

To Kirov
From The Golden Horde

The Golden Master, in his boundless compassion will grant your desired protection despite your unfortunate fascination with Artzotzka. Perhaps in time you will come to see things more in line with our point of view.

To: Volgograd
From: The Golden Horde

The Golden Master, as a sign of generosity and understanding the scientific needs of Volgograd is willing to sell criminals recently granted us from Yunnan to your research institutions for a reasonable price, in the interests of scientific progress and the benefit of humanity as a whole. We understand, as you do, that the individual is subordinate to the greater good, and we hope that this offer will foster even greater co-operation and understanding between our two nations than that which aleady exists. (ooc: so please Ailedhoo, I want to know how many slaves from Yunnan I posess)

To: Mongolia
From: The Golden Horde

As Brothers in the Margayana faith, we are concerned at the recent dirth of enlightened ones reaching their moment of the possible from your country. Indeed last year only 127 individuals raised the knife and became one with the eternal! However the Golden Master is willing to assist the Mongolian people in their spiritual journey. Send to our temples those who you deem enlightened, and they shalt find succour in their moment of the possible. Send us those criminals who are outside of the right path, and we shall commit them to serve a true master.

 

[Tani Coyote]

X = Power 1. Y = Power 2. Z = Minor Power.

If X=Y, then war will theoretically be averted since the major dare not take the chance of a treacherous ally turning the table. Influence would probably determine which way the pendulum swings here.

If X>Y and X>Y+Z, then Z will join X because there's no hope of gaining leverage.

If X>Y and X<Y+Z, then Z will side with Y for the simple fact that once X is defeated, their relative position would be improved.

This assumes cold, hard economics and not any more arbitrary interference such as ideology, of course. A weak power in a set of three will rationally ally nominally with the middle power, but will never let either power defeat the other because that would leave them at their mercy.

I suppose for the most part this model would be followed by Ailedhoo.

 

[Jehoshua]

The model is generally reasonable, although it is simplistic since as you implied it excludes the multiplicy of factors beyond mere hard power (or even with regards to hard powers application, would the middle power be in the crossfire for example...)

 

[KaiserElectric]

OOC: Kingdom of Cascadia? You mean the United States of Cascadia or the United Kingdom of America/Great Plains?

Cascadia, my bad.

 

[christos200]

From Mongolia
To Golden Horde:

We will send only criminals who are sentenced for life.

 

[Jehoshua]

From Mongolia
To Golden Horde:

We will send only criminals who are sentenced for life.

To: Mongolia
From: The Golden Horde

The Golden Horde naturally accepts any that Mongolia sends (and any enlightened pilgrims who come of their own free will!) for service or final vastening.

 

[Tani Coyote]

Orders PMs still needed from:

KaiserElectric
Tyo
Omega124
RedSpy
Robert Can't
Patriotic_Fool
Hoplitejoe
Dem Taqat
Double A
Ogane
Sonereal
NedimNapoleon

Lock in 48 hours.

Celticfury and Arrow Gamer won't be in the game until next turn, so they don't need to worry about spending orders.

 

[Kinich-Ahau]

The 501st Legion is hereby extending protection to the Heavenly Kingdom of Bengal, the Dominion of Burma, & the Kingdom of Yunnan.

The Grand Moff of the 501st, Dilag Nellaeop, cordially invites Ajoy II, Htay Win, & George to a diplomatic meeting in Hong Kong, where they may iron out a more close & permanent alliance with the 501st.

 

[christos200]

From Mongolia
To Golden Horde:

Since we are both Mongolians, shall we organize a joint three days festival about Mongolian culture?

 

[Ailedhoo]

@Jeho: forgive me but I have no idea how much of the population of Yunnan to mark as jailed criminals. Would 0.45-3.12% of the population be a reasonable amount of the populace being in jail? I have contacted Tani on the matter but it is still a consideration most... well I just do not want to underestimate or exaggerate Yunnan crime levels, especially as at turn 2 Yunnan is going to have to find a alterative source of slaves that does not involve enslaving their own citizens...

The 501st Legion is hereby extending protection to the Heavenly Kingdom of Bengal, the Dominion of Burma, & the Kingdom of Yunnan.

The Grand Moff of the 501st, Dilag Nellaeop, cordially invites Ajoy II, Htay Win, & George to a diplomatic meeting in Hong Kong, where they may iron out a more close & permanent alliance with the 501st.

Ajoy II accepts the invitation and the offer of friendship. We cannot be alone in face of demonic times and we hope for a greater consideration in aiding the development of our paths.

Htay Win will in return of the offer of a mutual defence agreement set on the way of ensuring a gentle consideration to a rough world. North and south, east and west, wet and dry, live and death... the consideration to balance and to the harmony in our way must be set out to true natural style. We will aid each other. Provide us defence and we can teach you the way.

King George would consider a protection deal but we have vowed to the protection of the Golden Horde. As such as protection from you will be... well... be of second. I will come to Hong Kong to talk of defence but this will a deal that is secondary to the protection deal set out between my kingdom and the Golden Horde. They are my primal ally and you will do well as a secondary ally. Know that any direction against my primal ally will ensure I will stand with my primal ally. Understood?

Cascadia, my bad.

The USC agrees that we are best together. We accept the defence offer.

 

[Kinich-Ahau]

Ajoy II accepts the invitation and the offer of friendship. We cannot be alone in face of demonic times and we hope for a greater consideration in aiding the development of our paths.

Excellent.

Htay Win will in return of the offer of a mutual defence agreement set on the way of ensuring a gentle consideration to a rough world. North and south, east and west, wet and dry, live and death... the consideration to balance and to the harmony in our way must be set out to true natural style. We will aid each other. Provide us defence and we can teach you the way.

We have no problems with you sending missionaries to the 501st, assuming that is what you're getting at.

King George would consider a protection deal but we have vowed to the protection of the Golden Horde. As such as protection from you will be... well... be of second. I will come to Hong Kong to talk of defence but this will a deal that is secondary to the protection deal set out between my kingdom and the Golden Horde. They are my primal ally and you will do well as a secondary ally. Know that any direction against my primal ally will ensure I will stand with my primal ally. Understood?

We find your offer extremely strange (OOC: I have 200 more influence with Yunnan than the Golden Horde does), but acceptable.

 

[Dem Taqat]

McIronfist stared out of the window of the vast Presidential Palace. It had been only a few months since the brutal power struggle of his acension, and still he was not totally certain of his own safety within the great building. McConquerer had been a shrewd man, and none doubted that his palace had contained a few hidden extras for his own personal conveinience. A handful of such hiding spots had been discovered in McIronfists sweep of the building, but he was under no illusions that all had been found.

Behind him, footsteps approached, then ceased. People knew better than to interupt McIronfist's contemplations. He waited a few moments, then turned to see his Minister of Domestic Affairs, Party McScapegoat, awaiting him with several documents. "Yes?"
"I've made the ammendments you suggested Ruthless, and the treasury was happy to hand over additional money for the education budget when they heard it was your idea." McIronfist smiled slightly. Of course they had agreed to his suggestions.
"Excellent work, and the other thing we discussed?"
"I sent the message as you requested."
"Good. Put those on my desk and I shall reveiw them later. Was there anything else?"
"Not unless you wished to discuss the distribution of bread this year." McScapegoat replied, sarcasm clearly evident in his voice.
"I can live without that." McIronfist turned back to the window, and listened as Party's footsteps marked out a passage to the desk, and then back out of the door.

It was a shame, he felt, that so many of the most competent of the men who had once walked the halls here did so no longer. However, certain steps had been neccesary to ensure his position, and the loss of effective help was not so crippling as would have been the failure to keep himself in power. Untrustworthy advisors would be a problem for every leader, but the worst of them no longer plauged the Palace. He could relax.

Most of the time.

DT

 

[Ailedhoo]

We find your offer extremely strange (OOC: I have 200 more influence with Yunnan than the Golden Horde does), but acceptable.

OOC: doh! I need to check the influence statistics more often...

IC: err... although I am open to the idea of Yunnan finding great glory with the 501st. We are being requested anyway to give slaves to the Golden Horde! Will you make such big demands on us? If not... we might reconsider who is the primal and who is the secondary ally.

 

[Dem Taqat]

Gordan McFreeman glared out over the crowd. The cheering masses were packed into the street as thousands of Argentinian soldiers marched down in one of the governments latest parades to celebrate the power of Argentina's military force. He had no dounts that, with the recent announcements of cheaper bread rations this year, somebody had decided to control the populace in one of the most ancient ways on the planet.

Gordan didn't like being controlled. Gordan was his own man, a free man. It said so in his name. So for all the indignities he suffered, all the pains he endured, all the whims of the state he bowed to, in his mind he dreamed of better. In the dark of the night he could lie awake, dreaming of the end of the sham that was the Republic of Argentina, whispering to himself that someday it would be torn down and replaced with a true democracy, where votes were counted by the Election Office instead of re-assigned.

But for now McFreeman could do nothing but glare. He had no plan, no weapons, and no allies. All Gordan could do was watch, watch and dream. He knew he was not the only one who dreamed the end of the President. Not the only one who wished for a taste of true freedom, more gloriously intoxicating than any parade the government could throw. But for now, the people cheered around him. They had eaten their bread, and now they swarmed enthusiasticly to enjoy their ciruses.

DT

 

[Kinich-Ahau]

OOC: doh! I need to check the influence statistics more often...

IC: err... although I am open to the idea of Yunnan finding great glory with the 501st. We are being requested anyway to give slaves to the Golden Horde! Will you make such big demands on us? If not... we might reconsider who is the primal and who is the secondary ally.

The 501st currently does not deal in slaves, so no, we would not make such demands of you.

 

[Dem Taqat]

Meaningless McPeasant was an enthusiastic worker. His life was filled with the eternal glory of his work for the incredible country in which he lived. His meals contained a bounty of nutritious bread, and all his weekends were dominated by fabulous circuses and awe-inspiring parades. He was amazed by how popular the leadership was, and never failed to vote for the marvelous President McIronfist.

That at least, was what people saw. In truth, Meaningless McPeasant was the eyes and ears of the government. Every night, he would report the daily workings of the locals, and every day he prowled the city seeking wrong-doers and dissidents. It was through men like Meaningless that the good people of Argentina were kept safe from the threat of rebellion that lurked beneath the fringes of society. Though they knew nothing of it, all the country was in the debt of such men, and their tireless vigilance.

Today was a normal day as far as McPeasant was concerned. The populace were happy, and the recent military displays had left their sense of patriotism running high. there was little cause for concern, and even those misguided fools who had doubted McConquerer still held out hope for change under McIronfist. Meaningless work was routine, and his next report was sure to please his superiors. Life was good.

DT

 

[hoplitejoe]

Both will like to ask: who do you wish to set in your kingdom for marriage? We both will consider this for relations construction between us both.

Both Panama and the UKA are eager to set a marriage with Zeta.

One of the kings many daughters would be eager to marry a prince from the respective nations.

 

[Jehoshua]

We find your offer extremely strange (OOC: I have 200 more influence with Yunnan than the Golden Horde does), but acceptable.

ooc: The benefits of the Golden Horde being first to the post and having a bigger army.

IC: To Yunnan

The Golden Horde reminds Yunnan that the Golden Horde requested men to serve the golden master this year only (I did not request slaves in perpetuity), and generously emptied your prisons that Yunnan may know greater peace! We would be offended if you were to consider our generosity as oppression, when it only benefits yourself. We would likewise be displeased if you woul betray our confidence as your favoured nation in favour of the 501st legion, who's armies are weak and quite inferior to our own, and who's policies have unfortunately been increasingly opposed to the Golden Hordes interests.

 

[Kinich-Ahau]

The 501st Legion would like to remind the Kingdom of Yunnan that the only difference between the armies of the Golden Horde & the Armies of the 501st Legion is that the Golden Horde has enlisted more men, due to their failure to acquire any oceanic ports eliminating the need for them to construct & man a Modern Navy; this difference in manpower could be quite trivially repaired.

We would also like to point out that the Golden Horde's statements concerning their displeasure are likely a veiled threat against King George; the 501st Legion would be more than willing to station troops in Yunnan to protect the state & the king from Horde aggression.

 

[Jehoshua]

To: 501st Legion and Yunnan
From: Golden Horde

and vice versa, the 501st legion has already shown its aggressive tendencies by offering its "protection" to the Noodle Republic when said republic was on the verge of declaring war on the Horde. The Horde is in no way threatening Yunnan, we are merely stating fact that aligning with the 501st legion which has made policy decisions unfriendly to the Horde displeases us. We assure the Yunnanese that we will protect Yunnan from the legions militarism.

Regardless, ultimately the decision is Yunnans, although as we mentioned its strategic interests would be better served aligning with us, considering our superior land strength and various allies would ensure Yunnans continued peace and stability.