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Negotiations with MIA

Discussion in 'Team Doughnut' started by killercane, Sep 9, 2005.

  1. zyxy

    zyxy Warmongering Fool

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    First of all, thanks Robi D and Vikingruler for reviving this. Let's hope it will bear fruit.

    It would be great if you could chat with them. The main purpose s far as I can see is to learn what they intend to give for Writing, and see if it gets close to what we want to have. Apparently they will only tell us in a chat.
    The minimum I would like to get for Writing is Warrior Code and Wheel, so that we can research HBR. We can do without Ceremonial Burial for a while, it is a cheap tech and not essential for our survival.
     
  2. vikingruler

    vikingruler King

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    Okay sure, how about I say we offer writing, we want Warrior code and the Wheel and if possible Cerominal Burial if they are willing. Would you mind if we put a little bit of our gold, I'm not sure how much we have, but 10-20 would probably be enough.

    I just need the MIA delegates AIM addresses and a time frame.
     
  3. zyxy

    zyxy Warmongering Fool

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    Sounds good. You can always hint at gold, see what they say. The new save just arrived, it would be good if you could chat with them before I have to play (some 22 hrs from now).
    AIM of EmpNapoleon, Kentharu and fe3333au are on the previous page: emperornapoloen (might be typo), Kentharu1 and fe3333au.
     
  4. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    Well, I had MSN and AIM going just in case someone was actively looking for us, and had the following chat with Kentharu. This is my first attempt at chat diplomacy so be gentle with your criticism. :)


    Kentharu says: hi there
    DaveShack says: hi
    Kentharu says: your from Doughnut right?
    DaveShack says: yes, has anyone contacted you yet? I've been setting up my system with more chat options in case nobody else has gotton around to it yet
    Kentharu says: nope no one
    Kentharu says: so can we talk now, before it is to late?
    Kentharu says: once it is fine with you of course
    DaveShack says: certainly
    DaveShack says: we are interested in a deal involving writing and have been hoping to hear what you're willing to offer
    Kentharu says: perhaps the wheel and cerimonial burial is a good trade?
    Kentharu says: seeing as the wheel is a valuable tech, leading to riding
    Kentharu says: what do you think?
    DaveShack says: that may be what we were thinking, just a sec while I check the forum
    Kentharu says: take your time sir
    DaveShack says: would warrior code and the wheel be acceptable?
    Kentharu says: warrior code would be valuable also to you, since i assume you are having trouble with another team
    Kentharu says: i hope i am not wrong to assume?
    DaveShack says: some folks with blue clothing are acting in a most unfriendly manner
    DaveShack says: a favorable trade now might give us confidence to return the favor in a future trade
    DaveShack says: I would certainly argue in that direction
    Kentharu says: as i would, and it would ensure our future trade perhaps, i do think warrior code and wheel is fair for writting, but my team may not be so inclined
    Kentharu says: they think the wheel would suffice
    DaveShack says: we could each ask our team to consider the options further. the first thought on our side was 3 techs for writing but the more level headed among us convinced the greedy ones that it would be quite insulting to suggest that note: a little poetic license on my part, please don't be offended... don't know if it showed up on the other end of the chat anyway
    Kentharu says: sorry bout that, happens sometimes (cruddy computer)
    DaveShack says: no problem, I gather that means your connection dropped
    Kentharu says: for a moment
    DaveShack says: so there are two main possibilities, either CB+wheel or WC+wheel. we would obviously prefer WC which gets to HBR first but I'll post a question to the team to see what they think
    Kentharu says: as will i
    DaveShack says: if we continue cooperating, then we'll both eventually have access to Republic way before the others, which is a big advantage to a potential long-term alliance
    Kentharu says: and in keep both of us alive
    DaveShack says: are you permitted to say if you've had any other contacts? I checked with the admins and they say that is OK, just not brokering deals...
    Kentharu says: no new contacts
    Kentharu says: and you?
    DaveShack says: just those blue-clad folks (Persia = TNT)
    Kentharu says: hopefully TNT isn't to aggressive
    DaveShack says: it will be interesting to see how they behave given the forum tone
    DaveShack says: given Rik's warning however I expect things to calm down a lot
    Kentharu says: so i would hope, but you never know
    Kentharu says: now, at the risk of sounding rude, is that all?
    DaveShack says: I was struggling with how to ask the same question
    DaveShack says: nothing more for now, looking forward to talking again
    Kentharu says: lol, cool, latter then good luck with TNT
     
  5. Robi D

    Robi D Minister of (Dis)Order

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    I've also had a chat with MIA's ambassador kentharu. Since it was pretty much along the same lines as daveshacks conversation, i wont post it here (unless you want me to, i saved it just in case), but there were two extra things i brought up. One was the possiblities of other tech trades. They said they have nothing at the moment. I brought up that we have philo, since they already knew we were researching it anyway for them to keep in mind. Secondly i discussed the possiblities of a non-agression pact, not because it really matters to much at the moment with them being on another continent, but more to assure them that we are not looking to attack them. So basically atm there discussing wheather to trade wheel and WC or wheel and CB. I know we are all happy with the first trade but are there any thoughts on the second possibility?
     
  6. zyxy

    zyxy Warmongering Fool

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    DS and Robi, :goodjob:

    I think WC + Wheel is acceptable. Wheel+CB is very meagre, I don't know about that. Only the Wheel is ridiculous. They obviously try to take advantage of the situation, maybe we should research some stuff ourselves.

    Btw, I really don't understand the purpose of these chats. Their ambassador told us what they might give for Writing, but half of the options he gave are apparently not backed by his people and the status of the other half is unclear.
    The only other thing that happened is that they were fishing about our relation with TNT, so is that what this chat was all about? :confused: :crazyeye:

    Maybe we should send them a letter to lower our offer to wheel+warrior code for writing, perhaps with a deadline in three days or so. See what they do.
     
  7. Robi D

    Robi D Minister of (Dis)Order

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    Well from what i can gather from the two talks they seem to be trying to get a little extra given our situation. It seems strange to me that they worry that giving us wheel and WC gives us a quick jump to HB riding, but at the same time don't feel the need to sign a non-agression pact because we are on different continents. If we were to except wheel and CB i would expect 30gold on top of that as a minimum, but even then i would only be half happy with the offer.
     
  8. vikingruler

    vikingruler King

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    Seeing as DS and Robi D have already had a chat, that no offense didn't insure the trade to go through. I'll be willing to chat around 3:00-4:30 my time, (22 hours like zyxy suggested) and propose writing plus 10 or 15 gold for WC+ Wheel. How about that?
     
  9. Robi D

    Robi D Minister of (Dis)Order

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    With the forum back on i expect to hear from MIA soon. There is 2 possible replys they can give us atm, so here are my suggestions of what we should do.

    1. They offer WC and wheel for writing.

    We say thank you very much and get on with the game.


    2. They offer CB and wheel for writing.

    War or not this in my opinion is not a good deal, but since we need a deal i propose that we send the back two options for them to choose from, them being

    A. CB + wheel + 60 gold for writing
    or
    B. WC + wheel for writing + 20 gold

    Even though i dont think the 20 gold is justified, we need WC and wheel so we can get on with researching other stuff. So tell me what you think of the suggested responses and whether they need to be ammended or not.
     
  10. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    I like it, but what if they don't have 60 gold? How low should we go? Should we trust them with something like 5gpt for 12 turns?
     
  11. Robi D

    Robi D Minister of (Dis)Order

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    I hope they dont have 60 gold, then they will have to opt for the WC and wheel, but they might offer 3gpt for 20 turns. All in all i think thats an even swap even without the 20g, so they should consider that as a bonus. I dont think we should just give away techs even in our current position, because we can outgrow everyone. Hopefully they go for wheel and WC straight away so we don't have to worry about it.
     
  12. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    This was received in the gmail inbox.

     
  13. Nobody

    Nobody Gangster

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    They have a point. immortals are nasty
     
  14. admiral-bell

    admiral-bell Chronic Lurker

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    we're doomed unfortuanately
     
  15. zyxy

    zyxy Warmongering Fool

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    Yeah, we're definitely members of the "less than 25% chance to win" club. If MIA is in trouble with KISS, then we may not be alone there :p.
     
  16. vikingruler

    vikingruler King

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    this really sucks. the way i see we have two options.
    1. We build tons of military units and kick the crap out of TNT, razing everything. :evil:
    2. We make a trade deal with MIA, get MW and kill TNT.

    Either way TNT must be killed, I suggest soon. I would be willing to chat and make a trade, I can do it tommorow afternoon.
     
  17. Robi D

    Robi D Minister of (Dis)Order

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    I have sent this response off to MIA


     
  18. Nobody

    Nobody Gangster

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    Dont be such a pessimist. I still say we need to send out peace fellers even if we have no intention of making peace. If we see how eger they are for peace, we can see how strong they are. Lets say we offer, A stright Peace, with them removing there warrior from near us. Its insulting to them but if we do it in a most kiss ass way, then they will reply forcefully with what they want for peace and we will see their true intentions. Remever they can see us we cant see them. Also so killing that warrior and then sending the message the same turn could work well. To intimdate them (even in a small way).

    Then again negoating and planing could all be useless because 10 Immortals could walk over that hill anytime and bury us.
     
  19. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    I propose a full-out tech sharing agreement with MIA. Each team to fully and fairly inform the other about all tech acquisitions, research settings, and slider settings. Mutually agreed order of research to avoid overlaps, and each team gives the other the newly researched or acquired tech at most n turns after it is researched. Add in a mechanism to ensure neither side gets an extremely good or bad deal, and voila we're in each others back pockets for a while. They seem to be inviting this, maybe the next gestures of good will should be to tell each other the current gross income rates.
     
  20. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    Received this offer via gmail

    My opinion is that they ask way too much for these two techs, and either are not sincere or think they have an awfully strong negotiating position.
     

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