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New Beta Patch - 1/15

Discussion in 'Community Patch Project' started by Recursive, Jan 15, 2021.

  1. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    I noticed it in the last hotfix, GPT seems just a little bit lower.
     
  2. LifeOfBrian

    LifeOfBrian King

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    Stalker, are you playing with ancient ruins on? T22 is really early for Stonehenge on Deity (when playing without ruins).

    Recursive, yes, I would prefer getting lump sum from my AI friend, but I think it's usually in their interest to give me GPT instead, just to avoid the danger of a war breaking out between us at some point in the near future, not to mention I've seen the AI gift more than 2/3 of their lump sum gold treasury.
     
  3. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    I was, and I figured Turn 22 was pretty early even for Deity. Perhaps Washington was in the game, he's the only civ that I think could bag it that early....maaaaaybe Egypt.
     
  4. beginner_

    beginner_ Chieftain

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    Maybe this isn't new and I have never realized but I just started a game with this patch and noticed that barbarians can cross coast tiles from the get-go (saw one do it). Also barb warriors can move twice in desert like scouting units.
     
  5. Solic

    Solic Chieftain

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    Barbs get specific promotions (I think based on their encampment location). These are examples.

    This gets so much more identifiable if you use the promotion flag mod, where you get little icons above your units that show a description on hover. It's listed as most recommended in one of the stickied mod lists and I think Asterix develops it. Can't link it, on mobile.
     
    Skidizzle and vyyt like this.
  6. LifeOfBrian

    LifeOfBrian King

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    Yeah, perhaps Washington or Ramesses, but I haven't ever seen either of them do it so early, not even remotely close. Perhaps you could try a game or two without ancient ruins and see how that Deity feels for you?
     
  7. 2506

    2506 Warlord

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    Connecting the resource would completely change war. You'd have forts everywhere, sooner or later, no matter how long it takes to build one.
     
  8. dailyminerals

    dailyminerals Chieftain

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    lol I swear I'm the only one that doesn't really care about war in these games.
     
    arievillo likes this.
  9. arievillo

    arievillo Chieftain

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    2
     
  10. youngsteve

    youngsteve Warlord

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  11. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    And this is with less abundant strategic resources on as a map setting.... you go Iroquois, but I'm wondering if there is a bug here, even with double resources from Autocracy.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2021-1-16_20-12-40.png
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2021
    DeAnno likes this.
  12. civvplayer

    civvplayer Chieftain

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    Corporation can make that possible. In my 43 civ game I easily get over 2k in oil and coal.
     
  13. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    Standard Deity Morocco on Communitas_79. SV on Turn 403.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2021-1-16_21-19-40.png


    MY FIRST DEITY VICTORY IN VP!!!!

    So I finally took the plunge and went deity. I played Morocco, and early on got sandwiched between Germany and Venice. I wasn't able to found, and Germany spread his religion across the continent. The early game was rough for me, not being as familiar with Deity timings and not have that precision of play, I missed some of the early wonders and things that I like to pick up, so I was last in score for a good long while.

    I was able to start turning it around in the Renaissance as my trade routes and spies gave me a major rubberband. Germany challenged me to my first war. Holding the east side defensively I was able to deal with him without too much issue. This would start a love/hate relationship for the rest of the game. Germany would DoF me, even DP me....then go to war with me. Then we would make up...then more war later on. The biggest one came when Germany, Sweden, and Venice all took a go at me. Fortunately I had the Berber cavalry online and was able to hold them all off.

    With no vassals this game, I didn't think I had much of a shot at DV, so I went for a SV strat. I had mostly caught up in tech through Industrial and was able to compete more on wonders. However, the game stayed tight, Iroquois, Germany, Mayan, and Venice all stayed around the same place in tech, and it wasn't until the very late game that the final players would emerge (Me, Germany, and the Mayan for SV).

    Funny enough, my bane was culture this game. I think because my timings were all a little off, I didn't have my GP base setup properly, and so even as Morocco my culture engine suffered in the late game. I went Order, both for its power in SV but also because Germany and Venice went Order and I hoped to form a friendly block....which mooooostly worked (Germany had to get uppity with me one more time, but then we made up permanently). The culture drain would ultimately cost me Hubble, but fortunately I had enough science to blitz to CERN on my own and baged it to get back in the game.

    The SS parts were nerve racking. I didn't have a lot of aluminum to begin with, and I only had minimal iron, so aluminum went into solar plants for some of my cities. And I had light tanks from my berber calv so I had almost no aluminum even with all recycling center built. The AI would utilize that weakness, first pillaging one of my CS ally, losing 2 aluminum. Then Venice absorbed my other CS ally, losing further aluminum still. At this point I dropped all light tanks to give me a buffer, and went for it. Mayans had 4 parts built when I secured the victory, WOOT!!!

    My notes:

    1) So what was it like going from Immortal to Deity? Honestly less different than I expected playing a peaceful SV. The early game was the biggest change. Wonder and Religion timings are much quicker (much!), so you have to beeline for anything you want. However, things felt more comfortable by the midgame. While the AI is stronger, the rubberbands are stronger as well (on Immortal ETRs are really good, on Deity they felt essential, you get so much bonus!). As I started to get parity, I had a little more flexibility on my wonders and some of the pressure was off.

    The other thing is, the army sizes were not as large as I had expected. I was expecting carpets of units, entire seas filled with naval units. Its more than Immortal but its not night and day more.

    I did notice a little more stamina from the AI. For example, Germany was top dog, then fell away, surged again, fell away, and did one final surge in the late game. I have never really seen an AI surge twice before, which was cool.

    I am pretty shocked I won, while I played a few quick games that I got slammed down and quit, this was my first "serious" game on Deity. I was sloppy, didn't get a religion, missed several wonders by a few turns, and didn't do any of those crazy nuanced things Deity players boost about. And though it was close, I still won by 2 parts. My guess is it was the civ composition, the real science players weren't in the game (except for Maya), so the science landscape was a little slower than normal, which I am guessing was a factor. That said, I noted that Immortal feels easier to me than it once did...and I would bet my win here is in part due to that as well.

    2) The AI still does not respect CSes until Industrial, I can effectively own pretty much every CS in the game for a while, which is a "free" bonus the AI doesn't get. That is something we may want to look at Strategic AI wise...its very consistent that the AI almost ignores CS entirely for the beginning of the game, and then "wakes up" to CS usage in Industrial, and I will go from 12 CS allies to like 4 in the blink of an eye, as an explosion of GDs, Diplo Units, and WC start carving them up. This seems independent on Civs and policies.

    3) So one thing I noticed on Deity since I was much lower in score than normal. The AI was downright generous with Tech selling. Venice sold me two techs for a very reasonable price, and I was actually gifted 2 techs in the game!

    4) I continue to applaud the AI's great citadel usage...and by applaud I swear revenge and vengeance on them every time :)

    5) It may be worth digging in to the score calculation (assuming the AI uses it to do threat assessments). I don't think score reflects tech enough, especially in the last part of the game.

    6) For the most part I was pretty happy with lux and strategic resource deals. Only on occasion did they get a little nuts (one time I was offered 20 GPT for a horse....but I only had 1 horse at the time so I actually debated it..which properly reflects the scarcer strategic settings I'm running).

    7) I am wondering if there is a slight bug in the DP deal code. This is speculation, but it appears that deals where I feel the stronger I am asked to pay money, and yet DP deals where I am the weaker player, I get paid.... so I am wondering if something is flipped there in the code. Just speculation, but its happened enough in the last 2 games that I mention it.
     
    tu_79, Kim Dong Un, vyyt and 8 others like this.
  14. Recursive

    Recursive Covets Lands That You Currently Own Moderator

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    Will check.

    Edit: Yep, it was inverted. These "both sides" items are confusing. :) Fixed!
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2021
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  15. Recursive

    Recursive Covets Lands That You Currently Own Moderator

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    Hotfix posted. Just bugfixes.

    Original post's files have been updated and include both the patch and the hotfix. If you've already downloaded the patch, just redownload and follow the instructions again to apply the hotfix.

    (Savegame compatible.)

    Code:
    Fixed air sweeps not awarding unit XP (ilteroi)
    Fixed inverted AI DP valuation in trade
    Fixed small bug inhibiting some AIs' aggression
    Fixed World Congress alignment modifier not displaying in opinion table
    Fixed players you resurrected hating you if you own their capital/Holy City, but aren't the original conqueror
    Fixed bugs preventing the AI from bullying City-States
    Improvements to AI strength assessments
    Improvements to AI war logic
    Minor performance optimizations
    Cleaned up some unused code (ilteroi)
    
     
    Kim Dong Un, vyyt, danymatrix and 3 others like this.
  16. John.B.C

    John.B.C Prince

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    Yeah, I've noticed this too that there doesn't seem to be much difference between Diety and Immortal. I don't know but has the game become easier? I don't feel that diety is as hard as it was. Perhaps we've gotten better at the game too?

    1. For instance, I liked it more when there was more of challange getting a religion. Before, if you hadn't gotten a religion before turn 92-95 you didn't get one (on both immortal and diety). Today you can play really sloppy and still get one.

    2. There was before a much greater contest when it comes to grabbing good land (which I liked) when the AI expanded like crazy and if you weren't on your toes it would just eat up all land (perhaps it was settling in bad spots too). I just feel that I can often keep up the pace during the expansion phase and if I'm really aggressive I can even out do it, then founding more cities than many AI's. Often really juicy land is ignored for a long time. I earlier posted one example of this, when Egypt had the opportunity to settle 2-3 cities on unchallanged land, but never did.

    3. I believe Wonders were harder to get, you really had to beeline to get one. This is true to some extent today as well, but some wonders, like the pyramid, stonhenge, Petra, Terracota army Statue of Zeus can go quite late.

    I wounder how the more experienced diety players feel about this. Maybe they aren't playing atm. since I don't see any of the posting?
     
  17. Milae

    Milae Warlord

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    It is much easier than it has been in the past yea.

    Religion and AI settles are slower, though I think religion is a bit faster again with recent betas.

    Wonders are a bit weird. Pyramids and Stonehenge are almost always getable but then after that in early game it's just whatever the AIs choose to build since they will be waay ahead on tech and policies. So you will never beat them if they want to build one but there are certain ones like you mention which they tend to ignore.
     
  18. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    The ones I notice the most:

    1) Hanging Gardens: Its so quick it must be the rushiest rush that ever rushed.
    2) Parthenon: I think getting the parthenon is probably doable but it requires a bit commitment to the top part of the tree that doesn't usually make it worth it.
    3) Great Library is normally super quick, except for once in a while when it goes very late.
     
  19. youngsteve

    youngsteve Warlord

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    The Great Lighthouse is always a must have, particulalry for Naval civs.
     
  20. Recursive

    Recursive Covets Lands That You Currently Own Moderator

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    So I hear DV is too easy...the easiest solution I see is to reduce vassal willingness to choose their master as host/world leader. Thoughts?
     

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