New Beta Version - April 9th (4/9)

[Adonis VII]

Some of my farms are providing 0 food, or even -1 food. If there was a particular event that did this I apologize but I missed it.

Top left side I have 3 farms together. The left farm provides 1 food, the right 2 are not providing any. They are also not contributing +1 food per 2 neighboring farms.

Even more odd is the rightmost grassland-farm provides only 1 food total.

Ignore the worker placement, I was moving things around to see if it would refresh the yields, but they stayed for multiple turns.

Previous to this I had a flood, and another event that destroyed 2 farms (no pop-up just white text)

Spoiler :

I had 2 other mods at the time, Quick Turns and Historic Religions.

 

[hokath]

another event that destroyed 2 farms (no pop-up just white text)

You're experiencing a Critical Drought. Farms producing -2 food. That pop-up should have said. Check the events overview and see if it says there.

 

[Rafs]

Had a great time with the new beta, but some events seemed to be bugged at the moment for me:
-Hurricane event: I had times where it said nothing happened but "lost" half my population (I say "lost" because the city goes from 12 to 6 population, but I can still work 12 tiles inside the city, so I had to reload as I felt I was cheating the game if I kept it that way)
-Volcano errupting:"losing" 3 pop, same as before, I only lose pop on the outside, inside I can still work as many tiles as before.

Also, regarding events, I wished there was a way to know why the some events are unselectable (I know I'm not meeting the requirements, but I think it would be nice to know what I'm missing to make it happen).
Other than that, I think the event that makes you choose either -2 production or -2 gold in all cities for 75 turns is really rough, at least for me, since in the early game I'm very cash starved unless I play a civ that has some way to connect cities without roads (Carthage, Iroquois, Songhai), and even then I'm almost bound to choose the -2 production event, as the negative gold seemed to have a big impact on my happiness.
As a side note, would it be possible to make events that destroy building in cities not target "free" buildings? It feels doubly hurtful as not only do I have to rebuild the building, but I also need to add its upkeep as a special parting gift, this is even more hurtful when you lose your free harbor in Carthage's capital, and you don't have the tech to make one yourself yet, as you will most likely lose all your city connections.

 

[tu_79]

What I read about farms doesn't make sense to me at all. Building a granary shoud prevent bad things happening to farms, not the opposite. With a granary in the city, maybe miners from nearby towns feel tempted to abandon mines and grow their own lands.
So, something like this:

Spoiler :

If Granary is recently built and there isn't a Forge in city, and there are mines and plowable empty tiles inside city terrain, then
1. Workers from your mines decide to try a new life as farmers. Lose 1 mine and gain 1 farm.
2. Pay the miners to stay were they are. Lose 10 gold.
3. Spread the news. Lose 2 mines and gain 2 farms.

And this

Spoiler :

If there are more than 3 farms and no granary in city, then
1. Floods! 1-3 farms are flooded (rolls dice). Citizens demand a granary to avoid further floods. (Farms actually get pillaged)
2. Rescue the crops! 1 farm is flooded. City cannot build anything in 1 turn.

 

[Adonis VII]

You're experiencing a Critical Drought. Farms producing -2 food. That pop-up should have said. Check the events overview and see if it says there.

Yep that seems to be the case. Thanks!

 

[Royco]

How do I change the city settle distance from 3 to 4 now?
Theres just too much spamming of baaad cty locations from AI.
Thought I found it but no luck.
Also mod that does this do not work either.

Ideas?
Thx

 

[Hyronymus]

How do I change the city settle distance from 3 to 4 now?
Theres just too much spamming of baaad cty locations from AI.
Thought I found it but no luck.
Also mod that does this do not work either.

Ideas?
Thx

Can you be more elaborate and tell us which mod you use to "fix" the city distance?

 

[kaspergm]

How do I change the city settle distance from 3 to 4 now?
Theres just too much spamming of baaad cty locations from AI.
Thought I found it but no luck.

Go to the Community Patch folder > Core Files > Core Changes > WorldChanges.XML and then update MinDistanceCities numbers for appropriate map sizes.

 

[junsumoney]

I have a question about how city strength works. I understand Walls and Castles and such provide an exact boost to the city strength. I don't understand how much a garrison increases it. For example, how much would a spearman with 10 combat strength increase a city strength?

 

[Psikus]

Keep in mind that the initial set of events includes a disproportionate amount of negative events compared to the end goal set I have in mind. Once we fill out the event pool a bit more with positive/neutral events, things will feel less punitive. On the other hand, bad stuff does happen, and having to recover from a bad event from time to time feels natural and - to me - fair.

G

Would it be possible to label each event as positive, negative, or neutral, and have the event logic generate a balanced mix of events from each pool? This way, on any given turn you would have, say, a 50% chance of triggering only neutral or positive events, and a 50% chance of triggering only neutral or negative events. I would like to have the net impact of events decoupled from the number of events of each type that actually gets implemented.

As we are on it, if such a system were to be implemented, it might be possible to use the event system as a catch-up mechanic, having the top civs get slightly worse events, and the bottom civs slightly better ones.

 

[Gazebo]

Had a great time with the new beta, but some events seemed to be bugged at the moment for me:
-Hurricane event: I had times where it said nothing happened but "lost" half my population (I say "lost" because the city goes from 12 to 6 population, but I can still work 12 tiles inside the city, so I had to reload as I felt I was cheating the game if I kept it that way)
-Volcano errupting:"losing" 3 pop, same as before, I only lose pop on the outside, inside I can still work as many tiles as before.

I can't replicate this issue, even though users report it. The DLL function uses the same line of code as starvation for a city.

I have a question about how city strength works. I understand Walls and Castles and such provide an exact boost to the city strength. I don't understand how much a garrison increases it. For example, how much would a spearman with 10 combat strength increase a city strength?

It is a factor of the unit's strength - the amount varies based on that point.

Would it be possible to label each event as positive, negative, or neutral, and have the event logic generate a balanced mix of events from each pool? This way, on any given turn you would have, say, a 50% chance of triggering only neutral or positive events, and a 50% chance of triggering only neutral or negative events. I would like to have the net impact of events decoupled from the number of events of each type that actually gets implemented.

As we are on it, if such a system were to be implemented, it might be possible to use the event system as a catch-up mechanic, having the top civs get slightly worse events, and the bottom civs slightly better ones.

Keeping track of that would be very intensive, so no, not going to try and 'pool' events (that'd require a complete restructure of the model). I keep saying this, but the current pool of events is not balanced – it is a test pool of events.

I don't want to use events as a rubber-band tool - that's not fun at all, as it is random.

G

 

[Wodhann]

Are you saying that the events have no sort of identifier to them in terms of good, bad or neutral? Are they all considered the same?

It would be useful if they were identified in some way, so that you could for example have interactions that lower chance of certain bad events or such.

 

[Royco]

Go to the Community Patch folder > Core Files > Core Changes > WorldChanges.XML and then update MinDistanceCities numbers for appropriate map sizes.

I tried that, this is correct right?
-- Large - 4 Minimum for Major, 3 for Minor

UPDATE Worlds
SET MinDistanceCities = '4'
WHERE Type = 'WORLDSIZE_LARGE';

UPDATE Worlds
SET MinDistanceCityStates = '3'
WHERE Type = 'WORLDSIZE_LARGE';

Do I need to change anything in these bottom lines:
-- Default value that the values above can never exceed (minimally)

-- Min City Range
UPDATE Defines
SET Value = '4'
WHERE Name = 'MIN_CITY_RANGE';

 

[Gazebo]

Are you saying that the events have no sort of identifier to them in terms of good, bad or neutral? Are they all considered the same?

It would be useful if they were identified in some way, so that you could for example have interactions that lower chance of certain bad events or such.

Events have tons of identifiers and filters. If you meet the qualifications for an event, the event can potentially fire. There is no 'good/bad/neutral' identifier, because there's no efficient way to decide 'yes, this is a good time for a neutral event' without tons if iteration through all active events. That's just not feasible.

Event conditions are easy to control, though, from a design perspective. The Heat Wave player event, for example, enables the potential for droughts to occur in cities.


G

 

[Wodhann]

Events have tons of identifiers and filters. If you meet the qualifications for an event, the event can potentially fire. There is no 'good/bad/neutral' identifier, because there's no efficient way to decide 'yes, this is a good time for a neutral event' without tons if iteration through all active events. That's just not feasible.

Good/bad/neutral in terms if the event itself, not how good it is for some event to fire.

If we had that kind of identifier, we could for example, have a belief/pantheon that reduces chance of bad natural events.

 

[Royco]

I tried that, this is correct right?
-- Large - 4 Minimum for Major, 3 for Minor

UPDATE Worlds
SET MinDistanceCities = '4'
WHERE Type = 'WORLDSIZE_LARGE';

UPDATE Worlds
SET MinDistanceCityStates = '3'
WHERE Type = 'WORLDSIZE_LARGE';

Do I need to change anything in these bottom lines:
-- Default value that the values above can never exceed (minimally)

-- Min City Range
UPDATE Defines
SET Value = '4'
WHERE Name = 'MIN_CITY_RANGE';

OK. Now Ive tried it all I think. changed all the values to 4 cleared cache moduserdata folder but still annoying mincitydistance of 3

 

[Gazebo]

Good/bad/neutral in terms if the event itself, not how good it is for some event to fire.

If we had that kind of identifier, we could for example, have a belief/pantheon that reduces chance of bad natural events.

There are no plans to incorporate the event system into the game beyond the event structures themselves. That becomes a 'balance' concern beyond the point of the system.

OK. Now Ive tried it all I think. changed all the values to 4 cleared cache moduserdata folder but still annoying mincitydistance of 3

You need to change it in the CBP if you are using the CBP.

G

 

[JimBobRedneck]

OK. Now Ive tried it all I think. changed all the values to 4 cleared cache moduserdata folder but still annoying mincitydistance of 3

Update the values in Community Balance Patch > Balance Changes > Worlds > WorldSizes.sql as well.

 

[Royco]

There are no plans to incorporate the event system into the game beyond the event structures themselves. That becomes a 'balance' concern beyond the point of the system.



You need to change it in the CBP if you are using the CBP.

G

THANK YOU
Ahhh in this folder:
C:\Users\Royco\Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 5\MODS\(2) Community Balance Patch\Balance Changes\Worlds

Got blinded by the one file in the CP folder

 

[ronsorrell]

I actually figured that out in the end - after playing with SQLIte
but I wasn't sure how to reload that without forcing a complete cache delete. Is there a quicker way to do it.

I just open the sql file in notepad++ and edit the file