New Xbox basically kills off used games

[Mise]

Getting away from disks has been a huge boon for PC developers. No more dealing with expensive logistics.

We were talking about the benefit to consumers. I'm sure DRM is plenty beneficial to developers.

 

[Arakhor]

More importantly, you can get a 3TB usb3 drive for $100 and install your games to that.

The thing is already 'worth' hundreds of dollars and your simple suggestion to spend even more money to cope with the enforced full installation?

 

[azzaman333]

The thing is already 'worth' hundreds of dollars and your simple suggestion to spend even more money to cope with the enforced full installation?

By the time you've used up the 500GB hard drive you'll already have spent $100s on games anyway.

 

[Mise]

Yeah, 500GB would take a looooong time to fill up...

 

[Arakhor]

Fair enuogh, I suppose, but hard drive space always fills up far faster than you expect!

 

[Mise]

I don't see it as a problem though. I mean, if the 500GB HD was removable, what help would that be? I'd still have to find some way of transferring the data from the old 500GB drive to the new 3TB drive. Which means I'd have to have an empty 500GB+ USB drive lying around anyway... Besides, XBox hard drives are always more expensive than normal hard drives (they're nonstandard so MS can charge whatever it wants for them), so what's the point in buying a specific Xbox hard drive when you can buy a USB drive for much cheaper? This is another non-issue...

 

[Mise]

PS4 will require a PlayStation Plus membership to play online games, which costs $50/year. http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/...ion-plus-subscription-for-online-multiplayer/

But if it's anything like the current offering you'll also get free games and stuff as well, so it's not all bad.

 

[Arakhor]

That doesn't seem too bad, especially as MS have been doing something similar for years.

 

[Mise]

Yeah, and MS's offering is substantially inferior. ~£30 a year just for online play is pretty steep, but £40 a year for PS+, which includes a good, free game every month is definitely worth it.

 

[Zelig]

Yeah, and MS's offering is substantially inferior. ~£30 a year just for online play is pretty steep, but £40 a year for PS+, which includes a good, free game every month is definitely worth it.

MS is throwing free games into the deal, Fable 3 this month, Halo 3 and Assassin's Creed 2 announced for next month.

 

[Arakhor]

Those are for the 360, so it's hardly an incentive to buy an Xbox One.

 

[Zelig]

Well yeah, they can't give away XB1 games until the system is actually available.

 

[Mise]

Yeah, I downloaded Fable 3 and I'm looking forward to Assassin's Creed 2. They also do occassional, relatively small and very much unadvertised discounts on games for Xbox Live Gold members. But the sales aren't nearly as good, comprehensive or deep as even Sony's PS+ discounts, much less Steam's. The last time they had something even vaguely resembling a "sale", they barely advertised it at all, and it was gone after barely a day. They don't have a good track record at this...

I read that Sony will be giving away free PS4 games at or soon after launch. I honestly can't see MS giving away free XB1 games at launch.

 

[Arakhor]

I've already fully completed AC2 twice, with all achievements, so unfortunately I won't be availing myself of that particular sale. If it had been AC:R, I'd have been more interested.

 

[warpus]

I like looking at my games collection, like I like looking at my CD collection. It's more satisfying than scrolling through a list on a screen. (Indeed, unboxing a physical product is WAY more satisfying than watching a progress bar tick from 50% to 51%.)

Maybe I'm just unlucky or badly organized, but all the PC games I've bought in the past on physical media are.. gone, except maybe 2 or 3. Discs go missing, scratched, etc. This was one of the huge draws to steam for me - this will never happen again.

 

[Zelig]

Yeah, I downloaded Fable 3 and I'm looking forward to Assassin's Creed 2. They also do occassional, relatively small and very much unadvertised discounts on games for Xbox Live Gold members. But the sales aren't nearly as good, comprehensive or deep as even Sony's PS+ discounts, much less Steam's. The last time they had something even vaguely resembling a "sale", they barely advertised it at all, and it was gone after barely a day. They don't have a good track record at this...

I read that Sony will be giving away free PS4 games at or soon after launch. I honestly can't see MS giving away free XB1 games at launch.

Yes, this is a new thing starting next month, they're doing two free games every month.

 

[NBAfan]

We were talking about the benefit to consumers. I'm sure DRM is plenty beneficial to developers.

DRM and digital are two separate things. I'm pretty sure the cheaper games due to digital distribution is very good for consumers...

 

[Zelig]

DRM is evil.

I want discs that I'm able to install on any number of systems for concurrent discless play, and that allow me to make any number of copies, for easier installation onto more systems.

 

[Mise]

Maybe I'm just unlucky or badly organized, but all the PC games I've bought in the past on physical media are.. gone, except maybe 2 or 3. Discs go missing, scratched, etc. This was one of the huge draws to steam for me - this will never happen again.

Yeah, I know a lot of people who say the same thing. It always baffles me because I've never had a problem with a scratched CD.

One thing I agree with Zelig on this point though is that having to take your CD, games etc collection with you when you move is kind of a pain. I often leave games at my parents' house after I move; then, when I want to play them, I have to fetch them from my folks and bring them back with me. Kind of a pain, that.

DRM and digital are two separate things. I'm pretty sure the cheaper games due to digital distribution is very good for consumers...

Yes, I've mentioned that several times now -- it's the main point I'm trying to make. DRM is a net benefit to consumers if it results in cheaper games; MS will have to offer games as cheaply as Steam does in order to prove to customers that their online only, digitally distributed, full install only, no used games, no lending games, DRM-encumbered product, is a good thing for them. I stated this in the post immediately prior to the one you originally quoted, and in like 50% of my posts in this thread. But thanks for repeating it.

Spoiler :

Yes it would have, because Steam had frequent, deep sales on their games. The average price of games on Steam would have been lower than on Mac, so people would use Steam. I think people are entirely happy with DRM as long as it provides a net benefit to customers. Lower prices is a net benefit for all but the most hardcore of FLOSS advocates and gnuts.

They prevent one or two minor inconveniences but they're not anywhere near the same league as 20% cheaper games or 75% off old games every now and then.

And games that are twice the price with no frequent, deep discounts a la Steam sales

Yeah, the DRM encumberment is similar, but it comes with huge benefits on the PC that don't exist on the XB1. I've said before, I don't mind DRM, as long as it provides some sort of benefit to me, the consumer.

 

[Zelig]

My parents are several thousand km away.