Rebel Fighter
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jul 17, 2012
- Messages
- 94
Not excited? Thats what my wife usually says.
When she heard about this game she started making plans as a single.
Yea.
She know whats coming.
haha this is great
Not excited? Thats what my wife usually says.
When she heard about this game she started making plans as a single.
Yea.
She know whats coming.
I wonder if a system could work where within the main large tiles grid there's another grid with smaller hexes for military units. That way there's much more space for military units to maneuver and military squadrons would be on a more realistic scale compared to cities that still take up 1 large tile.
Having more than one unit per tile was the thing I absolutely hated most about Civ4. I'd be minding my own business, building cities and getting culture, when the AI would roll in with a stack of 100 longbowmen, and even though I had mechanized infantry by that point, that stack of 100 longbowmen would chew up and spit out my tanks just through sheer numbers. Having only 1 unit per tile is the saving grace of Civ5.
stacks vs. 1UPT argument because it's pointless
Well, considering you seem to be a game developer yourself, couldn't you try making your own game?
I'm also not excited, not one bit. And you wanna know why?
Civs!
I go way further back with the franchise than most of you youngsters on this forum, back before it was even called Civilization! Back then, you could gobble up all of the resources on the map simply by moving your original settler in one of four directions with a joystick. Starting with "Civilization" (which, I will remind you, back in the day was just called "Civilization"; in other words, Civ-No-Number, in other words Civ Zero; I'll leave you to work out what ever happened to Civ I when Civ II followed Civ Zero)--anyway, as I was saying, starting with Civilization they added this crazy idea that seven or more other rivals would be competing with you for the resources. I mean come on, like Inky, Blinky, Pinky and Clyde ever consumed any of the pellets!
Ever since "Civilization," the game has been, compared to chess, a mediocre turn-based strategy game wedded to a mediocre resource gobbling game.
I'm waiting for a worthy successor to that old pre-Civ Civ.
[Emphasis mine]
Oh please, I've been playing Civ4 for six years and I've never seen a stack of 100 units made by the AI. If you want to make a point, make your point, but using exaggeration and disinformation makes nothing but a dishonest argument.
I'm not going to get into a debate over the stacks vs. 1UPT argument because it's pointless, but at least present your objection to the Civ4 combat system with a little more accuracy.
And I'm not surprised you would think that. It seems like whenever 1UPT or Stacking is brought up, purists (not saying you are or not, just saying in general) on both sides rush off to the trenches and any attempts at finding a middle ground are thwarted by the fact that the middle ground becomes a No Man's Land attacked by both sides.
Are there pros and cons to both Stacks and 1UPT? Yes. Are these pros and cons weighted differently by different people? Yes.
Does that mean there's no chance for a happy middle ground? Not at all. I think that in the most extreme situations, such as unlimited stacking with no real penalties and 1UPT, the player is ultimately hurt because they lose the ability to choose. With megastacking, you don't have much of a choice but to stack more and stack better. For 1UPT, you don't have any choice but to shuffle units across the map.
A better system would have a player say something like, "Well, I can throw ten units into this stack for now, or I can spread them out to try to flank the enemy army. Both ideas have pros and cons, and my decision will totally be dependent on the situation."
I wonder if a system could work where within the main large tiles grid there's another grid with smaller hexes for military units. That way there's much more space for military units to maneuver and military squadrons would be on a more realistic scale compared to cities that still take up 1 large tile.
This is certainly no solution to the problem. Firstly you can disregard all non-military units and satellites as they don't take part in battles. Secondly the stacking of air, land and naval units on one tile will probably still only work in cities so has little bearing on the richness of a battlefield experience. That leaves 2UPT, providing those military satellites really work like units.you will probably be able to have e.g. an air unit, an infantry, a battleship, a civilian, a military satellite, an economic satellite and a scientific satellite all on the same multi-layered tile.
Well, I have. Granted, it was while playing a modded game, but it was really fun.Oh please, I've been playing Civ4 for six years and I've never seen a stack of 100 units made by the AI.
Thats not analysis, thats acknowledging that Civ V designers had more inteligence than cockroaches.
This is certainly no solution to the problem. Firstly you can disregard all non-military units and satellites as they don't take part in battles. Secondly the stacking of air, land and naval units on one tile will probably still only work in cities so has little bearing on the richness of a battlefield experience. That leaves 2UPT, providing those military satellites really work like units.
One thing that does give me hope for a better battle experience is that info about supremacy units benefitting from entering into certain formations. If the AI can pull that off then it might be a cool feature.
snip
The need to limit the ability to blanket the entire map with land military units assumes that's something you'd want to do, and with the right balance between the 7 unit types, it isn't. Of course, if land military units are far more desirable to build than anything else, 1upt does become more of a limitation, but with correct balance, there isn't the same restraint on production costs. So if there are 10 tiles and a true 1upt system, costs need to be set such that those 10 tiles won't instantly be crowded out. But if it's desirable to create equal amounts of e.g. 4 classes of units, then halving costs will still leave half the space empty. You'll have 40 viable slots for units on those 10 tiles, and the capacity to build 20 instead of 10.