Orbis - the original thread

[Methuselah]

Actually alignment doesn't matter. I've received the second one then the first one and then the second one again in the same game within 50 turns.

Ah, I thought it was based on if you were good/evil.

Still does nothing.

 

[Seon]

Actually alignment doesn't matter. I've received the second one then the first one and then the second one again in the same game within 50 turns.

I think you need to hire Van Helsing

 

[Ahwaric]

I would rather invest in silver mining... Van Helsing is better suited against Calabim

Anyway, this is one of the events I want to review the most - cut one of them and make it do something. Moral dillemas are harder if you can gain something by being evil

 

[scutarii]

already familiar python ex. from previous game.
http://www.2shared.com/file/4930647/418d1c39/python.html

has happened several times. Maybe it has something to do with a fact that I'm playing mazatl?

 

[Seon]

I would rather invest in silver mining... Van Helsing is better suited against Calabim

Anyway, this is one of the events I want to review the most - cut one of them and make it do something. Moral dillemas are harder if you can gain something by being evil

wait, which choice will be evil? I think this is a moral dillema because you are not sure which choice is good or which choice is evil (depending on your alignment). P.S. Maybe you could also add a foxford event.

 

[Caradoc]

Can I get some information on Patrian Artifacts? In particular what they have to do with Quarries and something called the Gift. I didn't see this in the Scions docs, but might have missed it.

 

[arkham4269]

I would rather invest in silver mining... Van Helsing is better suited against Calabim

Anyway, this is one of the events I want to review the most - cut one of them and make it do something. Moral dillemas are harder if you can gain something by being evil

Well I don't know if you ever intend to use it, but these are the types of events that go well with the "broader alignment" option of FF. I mean it helps to be able to see if you are REALLY evil or maybe just neutral with good tendencies.

Question about Scions; you seem to have taken a lot of the Pelomoc (sp?) spells away from him. Any reason other than to tone him down a bit?

What exactly does Succor do and why can't I cast it most of the time? By trial and error (mostly error) it looks like I have to have 3 cities I've already cast Poisoned Words in.

Plus, I think this may have been discussed before in regard to the Mechanos, but might it be possible to have some sort of 'temple' open when one gets Humanism? I'm thinking something like "Philosopher's Hall" - however, since Humanism doesn't spread like a religion, perhaps if one switches to Humanism you could either build another "University" national wonder or have a Great Sage or Prophet build a "Great Academy" in any city that already has a library.

 

[Ahwaric]

Can I get some information on Patrian Artifacts? In particular what they have to do with Quarries and something called the Gift. I didn't see this in the Scions docs, but might have missed it.

Well, I am not the one that set this bonus in the first place, but I guess it is all kind of remains from the age of magic cities, ruined architecture, sculptures, mosaics, paintings... Well, after all this time and ice age, maybe no paintings.
Scions dig it up and use in their cities - not unlike it was done in medieval rome (I have seen one huge villa where marble floors were processed into burnt lime ).
Awakened prize signs of the past glory, so acces to this resource increases the rate they come out of the bottomless tomb.

Well I don't know if you ever intend to use it, but these are the types of events that go well with the "broader alignment" option of FF. I mean it helps to be able to see if you are REALLY evil or maybe just neutral with good tendencies.

Unfortunatelly, I think broader alignments do not work as intended. Also, as AI do not know what is moral and what is not, it keeps doing bad things and turns evil. I think Bannor and Mercurian are especially vulnerable to it - the mechanics does not understand that purpose sanctifies the means... So do not expect Broader Alignments anytime soo, or ever...

Question about Scions; you seem to have taken a lot of the Pelomoc (sp?) spells away from him. Any reason other than to tone him down a bit?
What exactly does Succor do and why can't I cast it most of the time? By trial and error (mostly error) it looks like I have to have 3 cities I've already cast Poisoned Words in.

I reduced Pelemoc spells number because it was micromanagement nightmare. I tried to merge them and make remaining ones better. I might have toned Pelemoc down a bit - but he is still really usefull.
Succor grants one reborn in your capitol. It requires money (listed in spell description) plus it can only be cast in foreign cities with 3 or more . It certainly works (and have nothing to do with poisoned words I think), but it might be hard to tell where to go. I will add investigate city ability to Pelemoc in patch d - hope that helps.

Plus, I think this may have been discussed before in regard to the Mechanos, but might it be possible to have some sort of 'temple' open when one gets Humanism?

Is it really needed? True, they do not get religions but most agnostic civs get stuff that more than compensate that. I can't really see a balance or flavour reason to add it ATM, can you?

By the way, I have added plenty of stuff I wanted to do for a long time. I plan to add a few more things while waiting for patch w, but a really big one is already in.
I have increased food per population to 3 . Farm base yeld is 2 instead of 1. Also, city starts with 3 (which makes settling at swamps a little less desirable I hope). Sacrifice the weak is 2 per population
My intention is to limit cities growth a bit (it is medieval world and populations far bigger, plus they grow too fast) and to make farms a bit more desirable. Also, it will tone Sacriface the Weak a bit.
It will probably need some tweaking and to properly judge if it was a right decision you will have to play, I know, but if you have any comments, please post them
Also, I think of changing financial trait from 1 extra if there are 2 to require 3 , plus give it some other bonuses.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

would it be a pain to add civ4lerts and/or the "avoid unhappy/unhealthy population" from FF? it really is the only thing that's keeping me from loving this mod

 

[arkham4269]

Unfortunately, I think broader alignments do not work as intended. Also, as AI do not know what is moral and what is not, it keeps doing bad things and turns evil. I think Bannor and Mercurian are especially vulnerable to it - the mechanics does not understand that purpose sanctifies the means... So do not expect Broader Alignments anytime soo, or ever...

Yes, well that makes sense. It's too bad since it would allow more events to be 'flavor' your alignment.

Also, city starts with 3 (which makes settling at swamps a little less desirable I hope). Sacrifice the weak is 2 per population. My intention is to limit cities growth a bit (it is medieval world and populations far bigger, plus they grow too fast) and to make farms a bit more desirable. Also, it will tone Sacrifice the Weak a bit.
It will probably need some tweaking and to properly judge if it was a right decision you will have to play, I know, but if you have any comments, please post them

I like this idea. In the game I'm playing now, even with little arable land, the Bannor have around 6+ cities of 15+ population. While I realize this is a fantasy game, most cities just didn't get that large back then, especially without some serious health issues. So your idea sounds good to me! Plus unless you were willing to fiddle around with the old plague mechanic (which needed work since every plague seemed to be The Black Death which wasn't historically accurate either) this seems the way to go. Plus, it'll help the Scions a bit since I keep trying to limit the number of cities I have, but often times I need to expand to control vital resources or at least deny them to my allies/enemies. So even with the Cathedral of the Reborn, my cities are about 8-10 population points below that of my potential enemies. In a battle of attrition, I'm going to lose.

BTW, shouldn't the Sidar have some sort of built in dislike of the Scions? If I remember right in the Civlopedia, the Sidar are listed as hating the undead. Well that seems to fit the bill for the Scions. I always wonder how the AI determines who ends up the "Worst enemy of" - I mean it would seem the Bannor and the Clan would hate each other. The elves would hate each other. The Luirchirp probably wouldn't be to how on the Clan either. The Amurites and Sheiam would seem to be natural enemies and I would think the Scions and the Illians wouldn't like each other simply due to the Emperor and Alric both vying for deityhood as it were.

 

[xienwolf]

Remember that a change to food requirement/supply also adjusts the balance of health/disease. Be interesting to see how it pans out

 

[Caradoc]

I just found an awesome upgrade path: Fawn > Priest of Leaves > (Dwarven) Druid. Take the Fawn to level 4 to get Mesmerize Animals, Woodsman 2/Mobility 2, and a Totem. Then PofL to add Medic 2, Nature, Cure Disease, Summon Tiger, and Bloom. And top it off with Druid for Entangle and Maelstrom or DD for Earth, Rust, and Crush.

 

[arkham4269]

I had a CtD in between turns. I'm not sure if it's just that my system is conking out due to graphics. I have everything set to low for the most part. I'm playing on a small world with 6 original players with Basium, Hyperborem and Ministor Khoun making it 9.

Both times in the time between when my turn ended and before the new turn begins, I'm alerted that I've just gotten a Great Prophet, the attack by the Mechanos against me continues and then right before my turn should start, it just dies.

I'm running a Win-Xp machine on a HP laptop with the full keyboard. (I always mention the keyboard size since there was a time where a laptop with a 10-key set seem to confuse certain games)

I'd really like to know what is going on since this happens a lot toward the end of games for me; rare is it that I can finish a game. Especially irritating with this one is this was my last needed Great Prophet before I could start building for a religious win. All Hail the Risen Emperor!

 

[Nadin Bytefelt]

By the way, I have added plenty of stuff I wanted to do for a long time. I plan to add a few more things while waiting for patch w, but a really big one is already in.
I have increased food per population to 3 . Farm base yeld is 2 instead of 1. Also, city starts with 3 (which makes settling at swamps a little less desirable I hope). Sacrifice the weak is 2 per population
My intention is to limit cities growth a bit (it is medieval world and populations far bigger, plus they grow too fast) and to make farms a bit more desirable. Also, it will tone Sacriface the Weak a bit.
It will probably need some tweaking and to properly judge if it was a right decision you will have to play, I know, but if you have any comments, please post them

My opinion. You need to limit the population per city for Scions of Patria.
Is a balance problem: Scion unlimitet population and no problem to go big ( just unhappy restriction) V rest civ. food + unhealthy problem.

 

[scutarii]

more python ex. errors.
http://www.2shared.com/file/4942516/51927228/python2.html

And for evil elf Longbowman is missing icon and game crashes when still try to choose longbowman for building

 

[Ahwaric]

@xienwolf
Thanks for the tip, I will check that out

@ Caradoc
That is intentional - you get 2 extra free promotions this way plus mesmerize - far from game breaking and I think it fits.
You should check fawn paladin if you can

@arkham4269
It is crashing for me as well. Basium on the island to the north is attacking a Calabim city (or rather gets attacked from it). Both deleting Basium or the city (or capturing it) seems to let the game continue. So far no idea what the cause is - if anyone has any idea, please let me know.

@Nadin Bytefelt
I doubt it will be a big problem. But if it will be, I will limit scions.

@scutarii
I guess the problem is svart longbowman. I have fixed the problem in patch d, but it breaks saves. On the bright side, I think that you just need to replace CIV4ArtDefines_Unit.xml I have attached it below - try it.

By the way, patch w does not seem to be close, so I decided to release mine instead. Here it is.

 

[Ahwaric]

@arkham4269

The problem is caused by nox nocis city I think. I reported this bug in FfH bug thread as it seems to come from unmodded FfH.

I messed with the save you posted some more and managed to unbreak it (at least for a while, played 4 more turns).
I hope you do not mind an extra great general
Anyway, if you still want to try, here is the "fixed" save

 

[Seon]

@Nadin Bytefelt
I doubt it will be a big problem. But if it will be, I will limit scions.

So what would be the new Scion pop cap? I hope it will be higher than 40

 

[arkham4269]

Am I missing something with the Scions?

I take it people only build 1-4 cities and just pimp them out in size?

Of course I do notice that cities captured by the Scions in Orbis don't loose nearly the amount they do under FF so maybe it would be better to let other Civ's build up nice cities and then 'enlighten' them of the Glory that is the Risen Emperor!

 

[arkham4269]

The problem is caused by nox nocis city I think. I reported this bug in FfH bug thread as it seems to come from unmodded FfH.

I messed with the save you posted some more and managed to unbreak it (at least for a while, played 4 more turns). I hope you do not mind an extra great general Anyway, if you still want to try, here is the "fixed" save

Thanks! I may still have to worry about graphics conking out later in the game, but I have managed to win a religious victory before and if I remember right it'll take about 100 or so turns to build the final altar so that should be around turn 438 which is way earlier than most my games end.

BTW, there isn't a way to make combat units able to build just roads, is it? One thing I liked in some old Civ mod about Rome (Civ III I think) was that Legionnaires could build roads which is very historically accurate. It would be cool if Scions could get that ability in their axeman, swordsmen and praetorians as a level up bonus.