PH07: The School of Athens

[Zophos]

Good turns. And it's nice to see that Asoka has come down in the world (and we've come up!). I also note that Churchill is no longer Buddhist, so we may well be able to kick him in the nuts, too, without bringing Biz and Shaka down on us.

 

[Codeman]

Nice set of turns; solid gains.

i agree. we appear to be moving forward quite nicely.

I'd be tempted to get peace from Asoka for whatever we can get then pick on Churchill. We'll get diplo hits but not enough to lose pleased status; we would gain a solid empire.

well...

Roster
Zophos >>on deck
Pholkhero >>
Codeman >>
Lukep >> just played
Pigswill >>UP NOW

i like taking the last 2 cities (bengal & lahore) before peace. but do like churchill next. at least enough to get his couple cities out of the middle of the Greek empire. and maybe annex those on the border.

i think that's all the warring our variant allows for. Pholk can clarify. since we are running a lot of specialists, shouldn't we start heading towards biology after rifling?

 

[pigswill]

I'm UP.

I've got it.

I've looked at it.

Lahore for silver (and lightly defended) looks good. Peace with Asoka after that. I'm not particularly keen on drafting muskets, rifles or infantry would be ok, even CR maces, but not muskets.

I'd look at another civics change: nationalism to feudalism; caste to slavery to whip cannon, courthouses, theatres.

Carrying on warfare means either war vs Asoka or peace with Asoka and take out Churchill's interloping cities.

 

[Codeman]

i vote 2 more cities on asoka, then churchill. don't give him a chance to recover before we launch a second attack to finish the job.

 

[Zophos]

Anyone have a feel for what sort of victory we're aiming for, here? We're allowed Diplomatic, Cultural lol or Space.

My first inclination is Diplomatic - if we add a few more cities to the empire, and make sure that we get the UN, we can (a) out-population everyone with all our farms, and (b) stay on Biz/Shaka's good sides, and we will probably have the votes we need.

Failing that, I think we try to get a DP->PA with Bismark, and run for space. Slap down Asoka as necessary to keep him from beating us there. Nobody else is really in the running, right?

 

[Codeman]

...DP->PA with Bismark, and run for space....

if PA was not selected in the game set up it will not be available. although a vassal would work the same. but i think pholk intended on this being a game with as little war as possible. more peacful building and running the SE. diplo and space (and time) would fit that.

this is from post 1 of the thread and as stated above

Victory Conditions: All enabled, but we can only win by Diplo, Cultural or Space
Variant Settings: NO COTTAGES. [Obviously, if there's no source of water nearby, we *can* use cottages, but they must be farmed over as soon as Civil Service is discovered. Also, if we conquer a city with cottages, farms must be laid down everywhere possible as soon as possible.

i think we should try for diplo.

 

[lukep]

Bismarck will go for space as well Asoka if he can.

So both should be crippled.

As we need to cut down also the english, the easiest way is backdoor domination via the diplomatic UN victory.

 

[Zophos]

if PA was not selected in the game set up it will not be available.

True. I typically have it set on my SP games, so I'd forgotten that it's optional. If it's not enabled here, then I think Diplomatic is our best (only?) choice.

 

[pholkhero]

As we need to cut down also the english, the easiest way is backdoor domination via the diplomatic UN victory.

though forgotten in the letter of the variant, this, i believe, is against the spirit of the variant; our win should be 'peaceful.' In my head, i thought we were aiming for space, taking out Asoka in order to get more land for production and also to cripple a rival for space. I don't think we'd be able to compete w/Shaka (most likely our rival) for votes well enough to win.

i vote 2 more cities on asoka,

I agree. Let's take it to him, while we still have our north *relatively* covered w/the common religion bonus. Once Germany goes free religion, Shaka may hate him, so perhaps we can save our attack until then ~ maybe jsut before he gets Panzers!

I'd look at another civics change: nationalism to feudalism; caste to slavery to whip cannon, courthouses, theatres.

maybe we should just stay in these civcs for now until we're out of war, and switch back to our GS-generating civics once we're finished. We'll have to make this switch again soon, so why not just save the extra turns in anarchy for now??

if PA was not selected in the game set up it will not be available. although a vassal would work the same.

vassal only counts for half for domination, they don't always work for you, and would be 'anti-variant,' i think, too. PA is not selected (I always forget its an option; it should default as on, and you should select it off; ahh well) ~ therey's always Civ5

edit for clarity: please note that our 'limited war' w/India is in accord w/the varaint b/c it's just to lower a rival a peg or two, and boost our ship-building capacity (as a war w/Germany would be).

also note, that the above are merely my thoughts, and not law, so if you want to argue with them, please go ahead. I could be convinced that a back-door diplo may be in the spirit of the game, but it would have to be good

 

[ruff_hi]

PA is not selected (I always forget its an option; it should default as on, and you should select it off; ahh well) ~ therey's always Civ5

There is a savegame editor that will enable you to add it. See here for the saveconvert program.

 

[lukep]

Note, i will be OOP till June 26 th.

I may (should) be able to follow and participate on board, but not to play

 

[pigswill]

Played 10 turns up to 1550ad.

Here's the save: http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/90414/Xander_AD-1550.CivWarlordsSave

Summary: Captured two Indian cities then peace; got steel; researching scimeth. NE and HE completed. No change in civics. Here's a few more details:

Spoiler :

1520 zzz

1523 zzzz

1526 Capture Bengal, no losses.

1529 zzzz

1532
Dye to Ch'ill for wheat.
Ivory to Tok for 5gpt
Bombard Lahore.

1535. Capture Lahore, lose grenadier at 97% (shrugs).

1538. Steel >RP confused: )

1541.
Sparta completes HE, starts cannon.
Chem to Ch'ill for RP.
(Switch research back to scimeth).
Chem to Bis for 50g+map
Chem to Shaka for 420g+map
Chem to Hanny for 40g+map.
Chem to Tok for 90g.

The cavalry come over the hill. Hurrah. (Oops they're Indians! ).
Time to give peace a chance:

1544.
Princeton NE>Theatre. Max scientists.
Asoka is speaking, gift him ivory (he's annoyed for some reason ).

1547.
Athens Theatre>Harbour.
Dartmouth; Theatre>Uni

1550.
Ivory to Bis for 15gpt.
Dye to Shaka for 13gpt (previously 11gpt).

Here's a list of our cities:

We're currently on 16% land, well short of domination.

Plenty of trades are available for steel.

Bismark is offering a DP.

 

[Codeman]

fyi.

will be OOP 6-23 through 6-29 so will need to be skipped if i'm up during this time.

 

[Zophos]

Yoiks! I'm up, but there is no way I'm getting to this before Saturday. I'd ask for a skip or swap, but it looks like everyone else is OOP, too.

Pholk, if you can play before Saturday, you're welcome to swap or skip me. Otherwise, I'll get to it over the weekend.

 

[pholkhero]

06/22/07 Roster
Zophos >> swapped, on deck
Pholkhero >> UP NOW
Codeman >> OoP until 06/29
Lukep >> OoP until 06/26
Pigswill >> just played

okay, have been surrounded by sines and arctangents and so on, will play tonight. Report tomorrow.

 

[frankcor]

okay, have been surrounded by sines and arctangents and so on, will play tonight. Report tomorrow.

There's gotta be a story behind that. So tell, already.

 

[pholkhero]

There's gotta be a story behind that. So tell, already.

I'm studying to be a math teacher! imagine me, pholkhero, teaching your children (pref. young women ages 16-22 at a catholic boarding school )

Well, the first report I had started got eaten by accidently closing the window here, so this one will be shorter.

On the Inherited Turn, I revolted:

I was going to go w/Pasc. AND bureau., but I thought the upkeep was too much (15-20 more gpt), and anarchy was an extra turn. Let me know if that was

I took the DP with Bismarck:

and started to trade around Steel:

I also got Corporation from Hannibal. Interestingly enough, we're @ WFYABTA w/Shaka:

I took OB w/Asoka to maybe appease him a bit:

He went from Furious to Annoyed.

Toku, though, loves us plenty:

I said yes simply b/c this was such a rare event, I couldn't say no.

A few turns later, Asoka demanded from us:

but no deal, says I!

I also notice that Churchill is out of Hinduism, so I check the relations screen:

Shaka loves us much more than him now ~ it's too bad we'd lose our DP and chance Asoka backstabbing us, but taking out Churchill would be sweet (though, may be quite anti-variant).

Once Sci Meth came in, I decided ot further boost our SE:

Also, we've struck oil:

the extra food will do us nicely, i think.

Lahore revolted during my set, and it looks like its going to be problematic:

We can't even reinforce it b/c of Indian culture!

We also got a GS during my set:

I'm not sure what the best use of him will be. He'll bulb Astronomy for 2677 beakers, he can make an Academy at Cambridge which currenlty produces about 80 beakers, or he could join to Princeton as a GS and get 9 bpt + boni extra. You figure we'll have about another 300 game turns before then, so perhaps settling him makes the most sense, right?? Help me out here, ya'll ~

 

[pholkhero]

Toku also came back, unhappy about us dealing w/India:

I told him, not so he cancelled OB with us. Interestingly enough, we've still got a defensive pact: "I'll help you if you get attacked, but do NOT step on my property!!"

And that was the most exciting thing to happen during my set.

Here's our finances:

not too bad...

We're lsoing say, 22 gpt at 60% sci, but we've got a good 1500 in the bank so we shouldn't be too bad.

Up next is . . .
06/24/07 Roster
Zophos >> UP NOW
Pholkhero >> just played
Codeman >> OoP until 06/29
Lukep >> OoP until 06/26
Pigswill >> on deck

but let's decide about that GS first, too ~

 

[Rex Tyrannus]

(pref. young women ages 16-22 at a catholic boarding school )

So, if I drees up in a pleated skirt and knee-length argile socks, will you factor some quadratics with me?

 

[pigswill]

I'd look at the save....
but I can't see one.

It looks like we're stuck on lightbulbing astro/physics. If we would trade for astro we might get to physics first for free GS, though Asoka may well have got it already (won't know till we pick up astro).