Player stats, sales, and reception speculation thread

itix said:
I see 12 positive and 28 negative. Does that mean at least 22 players got a refund? That would mean a 33% refund rate at the very least. Or am I missing something?
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If people write a review and then refund the game, the review stays up. I dont think you can review the game after a refund though. Either way, I got a few reviews of games that I refunded - they are still up.

Verified_Confection_Being said:
It's looking like the patch might have been over hyped, and people are starting to lose faith things can be fixed looking at the numbers.

Or perhaps because they probably represent new people trying the game, it's simply confirmation that the new changes aren't moving the dial for the majority of people who've steered clear so far.

Either way not good news, but what is good news is the concurrent players haven't dropped straight back down after a day this time - around 2k player bump has been sustained for 3 days now
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Yea, I keep hearing people saying it's a "gigantic" or "huge" patch, but I just dont see it. There's a lot of "unreliable narrators" on youtube and even in this forum. I get the monetary motive for a youtuber that has civilization as their main focus, but I dont get people around here gaslighting and spouting 100% false info when comparing to older titles. Maybe they just dont play other games, and dont know what a "huge" patch looks like?
 
Xur said:
Yea, I keep hearing people saying it's a "gigantic" or "huge" patch, but I just dont see it. There's a lot of "unreliable narrators" on youtube and even in this forum. I get the monetary motive for a youtuber that has civilization as their main focus, but I dont get people around here gaslighting and spouting 100% false info when comparing to older titles. Maybe they just dont play other games, and dont know what a "huge" patch looks like?
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What does a large / huge Civ patch look like then, for an older entry in the same franchise?
 
Verified_Confection_Being said:
I'm not sure why you've specified for older entry in the same franchise. Noone is suggesting firaxis do big patches - the opposite in fact compared to industry standard
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The post I replied to said "Yea, I keep hearing people saying it's a "gigantic" or "huge" patch, but I just dont see it." and that "Maybe they just dont play other games, and dont know what a "huge" patch looks like?".

This is what I responding to. I didn't say Firaxis should or shouldn't do big patches. But I do believe that 1.2.2 was a significant, substantial patch, especially when contrasted against other updates Civ games have received. Comparing across games is kinda foolish, because every game is different and requires (or gets) differing levels of post-release support. The respective amount of changes that happen vary between development studios, too.

And yes, I know what big patches look like. I'm playing Hades 2 :)
 
Gorbles said:
The post I replied to said "Yea, I keep hearing people saying it's a "gigantic" or "huge" patch, but I just dont see it." and that "Maybe they just dont play other games, and dont know what a "huge" patch looks like?".

This is what I responding to. I didn't say Firaxis should or shouldn't do big patches. But I do believe that 1.2.2 was a significant, substantial patch, especially when contrasted against other updates Civ games have received. Comparing across games is kinda foolish, because every game is different and requires (or gets) differing levels of post-release support. The respective amount of changes that happen vary between development studios, too.

And yes, I know what big patches look like. I'm playing Hades 2 :)
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There's still nothing in that quote about Civ games, you're shifting the goalposts
 
Verified_Confection_Being said:
There's still nothing in that quote about Civ games, you're shifting the goalposts
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We . . . are discussing the patch for Civilisation VII that recently dropped, right?

I'm not shifting any goalposts. I'm saying that by the standards of patches for games in this franchise, 1.2.2 feels big. Feel free to argue against that statement if you want. This is exactly why I asked Xur for examples. You're free to provide them as well.

If you want the claim to be "other games have bigger patches than 1.2.2, ergo 1.2.2 isn't big", then make that claim. I don't know what your point is here, except to falsely claim I'm shifting the goalposts because you don't seem to understand what I was asking another poster?
 
It feels big but oddly specific. I don't really care about huge maps personally, so a lot of the changes are tinkering around the edges.. Good tinkering though and with one massive exception.

This patch enabling steam workshop is the big one. It's also one which is going to take months or longer for its effects to be felt. I think this patch is going to look bigger in hindsight than it feels right now...
 
Gorbles said:
We . . . are discussing the patch for Civilisation VII that recently dropped, right?

I'm not shifting any goalposts. I'm saying that by the standards of patches for games in this franchise, 1.2.2 feels big. Feel free to argue against that statement if you want. This is exactly why I asked Xur for examples. You're free to provide them as well.

If you want the claim to be "other games have bigger patches than 1.2.2, ergo 1.2.2 isn't big", then make that claim. I don't know what your point is here, except to falsely claim I'm shifting the goalposts because you don't seem to understand what I was asking another poster?
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That's the claim that's already made. You've shifted the goalposts by restricting it to Civ games.

I don't know whether you are just on another planet sometimes.
 
I don't think it's ever going to be enough with the current crowd. Once people have formed an opinion, it's hard to change it no matter how good or substantive the updates are. Add in those who think quality is synonymous with popular appeal, and we get people who will think the updates aren't good enough simply based on others' negative opinions.

I believe in cases where titles have turned things around, there's a crowd that's willing to give them another chance after most of the bad PR has disappeared. Yes, that means for a recovery, we actually need the naysayers to become apathetic and stop spreading negative publicity and then for (new?) people to be won over by advocates later. The question is whether there will be enough people who can be won over.
 
aelf said:
I don't think it's ever going to be enough with the current crowd. Once people have formed an opinion, it's hard to change it no matter how good or substantive the updates are. Add in those who think quality is synonymous with popular appeal, and we get people who will think the updates aren't good enough simply based on others' negative opinions.

I believe in cases where titles have turned things around, there's a crowd that's willing to give them another chance after most of the bad PR has disappeared. Yes, that means for a recovery, we actually need the naysayers to become apathetic and stop spreading negative publicity and then for (new?) people to be won over by advocates later. The question is whether there will be enough people who can be won over.
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The issue is you aren't going to find that crowd of apathetic naysayers here... admittedly they will become more so, but with people who still think Civ 4 or 5 ruined the franchise ...yeah, the crowd here will get apathetic about 5 to 6 months after the first expansion in a year or so.
 
Verified_Confection_Being said:
That's the claim that's already made. You've shifted the goalposts by restricting it to Civ games.
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I'm not. I said "comparing across games is kinda foolish, because every game is different and requires (or gets) differing levels of post-release support. The respective amount of changes that happen vary between development studios, too."

Maybe you misread. If you disagree with my saying comparing across games is kinda foolish, then do that. Don't play the fallacy fallacy game, it's tiring. People aren't shifting the goalposts when they provide an explanation for why the original rationale was flawed.

Because by that logic, Hades 2 means that no game has big patch notes. Because Hades 2 has huge patches (in Early Access). It's a very silly assertion.
 
If indeed the best strategy to save the game is to drive away the people who aren’t fully convinced it’s a disaster and still complaining in the hopes it gets better, I am sure they could arrange that, just stop patching it and let the people who love it as is play for the next year then launch a big refresh later without any of the naysayers since they will have moved on by then.
 
Xur said:
Maybe they just dont play other games, and dont know what a "huge" patch looks like?
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They explicitly said “other games”

Gorbles said:
What does a large / huge Civ patch look like then, for an older entry in the same franchise?
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To which you replied confused assuming that they meant the same franchise, asking for examples. Then you said if they meant other games they should just come out and say it.

It’s all very confusing what you’re trying to do, is it leading to any particular point other than that they should have been clear they included other games, which they did? I don’t see how through this series of statements, what you meant to convey was actually that you understood what they said in the first place but disagreed and thought it was foolish?
 
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Krikkit1 said:
The issue is you aren't going to find that crowd of apathetic naysayers here... admittedly they will become more so, but with people who still think Civ 4 or 5 ruined the franchise ...yeah, the crowd here will get apathetic about 5 to 6 months after the first expansion in a year or so.
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I think you're referring to the crowd on CFC? Though I'm not sure I understand your post.

Well, in any case, the naysayers might change their minds if there's a critical mass of people saying good things about the game. But I think it's unlikely that the naysayers are going to be in that first wave of people to have a positive opinion of the updated game.
 
protocol7 said:
They explicitly said “other games”
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And I followed by saying comparing other games in terms of the size of patches Civ games get is a flawed approach.
protocol7 said:
To which you replied confused assuming that they meant the same franchise, asking for examples. Then you said if they meant other games they should just come out and say it.

It’s all very confusing what you’re trying to do, is it leading to any particular point other than that they should have been clear they included other games, which they did?
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I asked for Civ examples specifically, yes. This is conistent with my stance that comparing to other, non-Civ games, is a flawed approach.

But if all y'all want to do is pedant away and refuse to engage with what I actually typed, then Xur didn't actually specify games from other franchises, so "other games" does actually include other Civ games. But I don't think this level of pedantry is very helpful. I stand by what I said. It's a flawed comparison, for the several reasons I've repeatedly stated. If you disagree that it's a flawed comparison, then say that!
 
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