Poll: Should we join the ETTT?

[cav scout]

The Amazons have proposed an exclusive technology trading treaty (ETTT). Should we join?

 

[Provolution]

In principle I am for, but we should ask for Alphabet as an up front payment now, so we can direct our trades properly, we will trade them the techs they do not have. This is because we need to land metal casting on our own merit, yet mask that we are researching Alphabet, as we are saying we do, to Mavericks.

 

[cav scout]

Well the language of the treaty mean we will get Alphabet whenever we want it. If our very first request for tech was rebuffed than the whole alliance would fall apart before it even gets off the ground. I believe Amazons and Sirius are acting in good faith with the ETTT so i'm confident we will get Alphabet and any other techs on demand.

Something to consider though: If we get Alpha right away we are basically revealing the existence of the ETTT (the bump in score at the time of logging in would be apparent to all). So it might be better to get that first round of poaching trades done before we make a bunch of alliance-internal trades (which will clearly broadcast how teams are aligned into haves and have-nots).

If we are in a solid ETTT alliance with Sirius then it makes sense for them to be the ones to trade Alpha to Mavs for Metal Casting.

 

[Provolution]

Does the ETTT regulate espionage?

 

[cav scout]

There is nothing in the text that talks about espionage.

This will all become moot in the next few hours though as Amazons are prepared to move on to a team that can make up its mind on their offer.

EDIT: their latest message says we can negotiate a secret espionage treaty. Seems kinda strange to get an offer like that out of the blue... have you been talking to them Provo?

 

[CharlemagneXLII]

I think they really want us in, probably because we are furthest away from them. This is why they're sweetening the deal and threatening to go to Merlot. Sirius is probably pressuring them too, I hope we'll meet them soon. We also have a bit of a paradox here; we can't trade techs without alphabet, yet if we get alphabet, Merlot and Mavericks will suspect us and might not want to trade. Maybe we should get alpha on our own still, or at least wait a bit to make it seem like we got it on our own.

EDIT: We should also give them a bit of trouble for this, I don't want our team put in this position by another team again. Remind them that our team is small, and getting a few 'ayes' takes time, although maybe in a fllow-up message.

 

[galdarian]

If we time the trade correctly and ask for it as a gift based on a short term strategy to nab techs it shouldn't arouse too much suspicion. Particularly if we start researching a tough tech eg. Maths, CoL

 

[Earthling]

Timing techs correctly could be rather important, and I do agree that trading for Metal Casting is still a good deal to be sure to neutralize India (without this, some stray team could dare to break the ETTT alliance and ally with India anyway, in the short term before things go too far.)

The turn we are due to tech Math, could be a good time for us and one other team to login and trade techs - so that then it would be near impossible to determine if we had teched Alphabet and traded for Math + something versus what we are actually doing, teching Math most likely and trading for Alpha with Sirius or AMAZON. For instance, after AMAZONs meet Mavericks, we could propose something like "AMAZONs and the Q want to trade with the Mavericks (we insert something about distrusting our other neighbors, CDZ)" to convince the Mavericks to go along, but really we'll just get what we can and leave them behind. But let's not get too far ahead.

First and foremost though, I want to accept the agreement - with Sirius and AMAZONs already I fully support the alliance, and it will likely bring us even a bit more success.

 

[cav scout]

The turn we are due to tech Math, could be a good time for us and one other team to login and trade techs - so that then it would be near impossible to determine if we had teched Alphabet and traded for Math + something versus what we are actually doing, teching Math most likely and trading for Alpha with Sirius or AMAZON.

This would be a good way to do it... except won't every team in contact with Sirius and/or Amazons be able to see they have Alpha already? (it will show up as a trade option).

I would be fine with Amazons or Sirius trading Alpha to Mavs for MC. We would get MC anyways (from the ETTT) and Sirius would be less likely to get suspicious and back out of the deal.

Oh and we wouldnt be the team "tricking" them, it would be another alliance member doing the dirty work. So if we ever choose to leave the alliance we haven't burned bridges with our Maverick buddies

 

[Earthling]

Yeah, that works too, but Sirius not having contact with India (no boats out from either of them) could be a hurdle. However, AMAZONs could well sneak in past Mavericks, and I think if we and AMAZONs came to Mavericks with a fake offer of alliance (for Metal Casting in the end) they might actually trust that long enough for it to work.

 

[galdarian]

If the ETTT members are going to steal techs from the non-members then it shouldn't matter which members does the actual trade just so long as everyone benefits. In fact it would be better if it wasn't us, we don't need the -4 You stole our tech ;-)

 

[Arakhor]

Let's say yes and milk them for whatever technology we can get!

 

[MrBanana]

I didn't even bother to vote, it's an obvious yes.