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Post a (tough) Deity map for me to play

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by Lain, Jul 19, 2017.

  1. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Seen the first episode, and wow. What I thought would be a tricky map everybody else are twirling around their finger. Interesting that he settled north towards the tundra, but I suppose the PH (and more food) made it worth it. Very impressive start. And I was amazed how often he would go into the darkness and never have anything bad happen. That ruined my day so many times across the two attempts I had at this map.

    We actually started with the same techs, though, so I'm feeling a little better about going Hunting-AH now :p
     
  2. Olafeson

    Olafeson Chieftain

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    Indeed i was very surprised about his opening play.

    Spoiler :
    Never thought he would value the 2 hammer capital on a plains hill so highly that he would trade away river tiles for tundra tiles.:eek:
    Did work out pretty well though. Also the dity A.I. looks pretty cirppled in this game. GK and SB are nelow him in score after only 1 hour of gameplay. Indeed interesting since i moved to the south to create a Bureaucracy capital with more rivertiles later.

    Also compared to Pangaeas attempt the floodplains to the south have been ignored by the A.I. for a very long time. Looks like lets play deity 41 will be another cuirassier stomp. :lol:
     
  3. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Spoiler :
    I looked at the save, and you look to be in a pretty good position there. Justinian is a bit scary at 13 cities, and even more so when he got a peace vassal later, but other than that things look good. Don't have any particular advice, and it would be weird to try to offer that anyway when I've got my behind spanked on this map and everybody else have ruled it :lol: Probably the only thing that jumped out was to get IW for Alpha with SB (despite worst enemy status; it's a small trade), but you probably did that anyway, or got IW in some other way as you have Aesthetics as well.

    I've actually not seen this much of the map as I've given up earlier due to poor play and/or bad luck, but wow does Genghis have a sweet capital. Double gold and many rivers. Prime Hall of Fame material that (though ideally we'd want double food).

    Looking at how Lain did in that first video, and some others I've seen, one of the main things I would need to get better at is getting out more workers earlier, and chopping like a nutter.

    You "make your own luck" to an extent when playing on this level, but then I look at the spots stolen in my game and how the others in this thread + Lain managed to get them (much) later. Stuff like that can't exactly be controlled. If the AI happens to go for one of "your" spots super-early, they get it. Kind of similar to the other thread: If the AI DOWs the human by 2000BC, there isn't exactly much you can do about it.
     
  4. Olafeson

    Olafeson Chieftain

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    Update T 150 for the guys who are interested and maybe want to compare it with Lains approach. Also will not post my progress on this thread anymore. It is Lains thread and i think i misused it already enough.It is going pretty well after my defeat in the last NC game.

    Spoiler :
    Phew. Everywhere was war. Also i used my Ga to start a GA before the war. To reach CS and switch to Justis religion and Bureaucracy + Police state later in the GA without 2 turns of anarchy. I think it was worth it.



    upload_2019-4-8_8-56-39.png

    Justinian + his vassal tokugawa VS Shaka
    Dschingis Khan VS isabella and SB

    So i backstabbed DK with a rather small army of like 3 maceman, 2 pikes, 2 Xbows and 2 vultures + like 8 trebs. Unfortunately he made peace with Isabella the turn i attacked and 1 turn later also with SB.:rolleyes: So his small stacks of keshiks and Xbows came back and stopped my progress to his capital a bit after i took out his first city. I fortified in Ning hsia and he attacked me there and lost his army. So i continued and took his cap Karakorum. So my stack was a tiny bit too small when i started my attack and so i had to take some losses from the stray Xbow and keshik attacks from DK.

    Also always watching the war of Justi + toki vs poor Shaka. But suprisingly shaka stood his ground with longbows and lost only 1 city to toki. Then tokugawa did break free from his peace vassal and i gave him some tech to stop the war with shaka. Didnt want shaka to be capitulated. Shaka was fine on his own vs Justinian who had a poor army despite his 13 cities. later he also made peace.

    Then i was afraid of DK actually peace vassaling to either justi or toki, so i begged from Justi, declared war on tokugawa and bribed shaka again onto Toki, was pretty cheap since i was in war with tokugawa. Tokugawa shouldnt reach me at all, he is quite busy with shaka i think.

    So i think i handled the diplo really well. I had to beat Dk down to 2 cities and he still didnt vassal.:eek: But luckily i found some stray units that i killed and with the last Xbow that could move this turn i took out a swordsman. And that was enough to make him cap :D. So quite lucky. Not sure how to progress from here. Looks to me like i will start a 2nd GA and just tech to Lib without bulbing. Should be able to get it, only Isabella has paper yet, and she got it from me after a naughty demand.

    upload_2019-4-8_9-11-28.png upload_2019-4-8_9-11-28.png
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Apr 8, 2019
  5. unas876

    unas876 Chieftain

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    Well from what I read you didnt exactly hit a streak of great luck here :D Lain hasn't always either, as I seem to recall him losing a city early game on 97% winrate for his defender...

    Anyways, about the game:
    Spoiler :

    I think settling northwards helped him immensely with the barb trouble. Takes such a huge chunk out of the ice and tundra portion up there. More production early helped with early fogbusting. And he seemed really casual there, I thought he would have way more trouble, but indeed I dont recall him making careless moves. Seemed like whenever he moved into the dark it was because he had good reason to suspect there wasn't gonna be a barb archer there and when he could spare a loss because backup was in place already. Also don't recall him getting into any risky battles on not so great odds where a loss could have meant great danger.
    Personally I would have never thought to question going Archery early here. No immediate copper, tundra and ice in sight, not boxed in completely, AND right next to two of the top3 craziest warmongers in the game?
    Somehow again he makes it look so casual to avoid settling in anyones face and obviously he has good reason to suspect that anyone who might start plotting early would do so on Sitting Bull. I can't say how confident I would be that Shaka doesn't suddenly appear with a bunch of Impi and what not though.

    Haven't played the map myself, haven't looked closely at anyones games either to compare, but I would suspect the early production boost as well as chopping everything relentlessly is what gave him an edge getting land in the south, too. But if Genghis doesn't build the Wall, he probably doesn't get as much of that either. Thats something definitely beyond anyones control.
     
  6. mighty gandhi

    mighty gandhi Chieftain

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    My first deity win, not so sure it would be tough for you. The start is great and the leader strong.
    Huyana Capac, Deity , Fractal, No huts, No events, normal sea level, standard speed (playing it with bug+bull, hope it doesn't mess up things).
    Generated from the game and untouched.
    Spoiler start :
    20190409034658_1.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

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  7. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Just watched episode 2 (they're quite long), and he's spanking this map something fierce. Very impressive. Seems so easy when he plays. I know it isn't.
     
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  8. krikav

    krikav Theorycrafter

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  9. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    I wonder when people realize how easy typical pangaeaish games are for a player of Lain's caliber. ;) My favorite games have been ones with semi-isolation (like Fred with Nappy as neighbor) or 3-4 split (Shaka with Charlie and Kublai), since they often require real strategic decisions instead of typical elephant/cuirassier/cannon attack (rinse/repeat). Isolation can be interesting, too.
     
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  10. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Thanks for the link. I voted for Alexander. A tie right now, I see, between Alexander and Charlie.

    I've not watched a lot of his games due to being gone for a year, but @sampsa is probably correct. Looks like he'll pawn just about anything. (Semi) isolation is naturally harder, but I don't find them all that fun to watch. Doesn't feel like the game starts until after you meet the other AIs.

    This map that I posted for laughs and giggles an age ago is perhaps going a little too far though.
    Spoiler :
     
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  11. Fish Man

    Fish Man Chieftain

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    I voted Augustus. Everything else seems like a probable cakewalk for someone of Lain's caliber, especially the fantasy realm map which basically comes with 2 pre-improved BFC sheep.

    PS @Pangaea - yes, I used to be Und. You can change your name by asking nicely an admin to do it. And it's a reference that most people here will likely get ;). Explanation for the unaware:

    Spoiler :


    A while ago @Fippy posted cookbook #1 Saladin. Everyone played the start blind, with one HoF-esque attempt. The first stopping point was 45 turns. I was the only person to have settled the west fish city at that point. There was a lengthy debate on the wisdom of that decision but I fiercely defended my pescetarian plan and ended up winning conquest before everyone, though that honestly was a combination of luck (no Shaka plots on me) + a lot of people dropping out and not finishing through.

    Since then, I've made a lot of fish-related memes and comments that have only cemented my position as defender of seafood (and by extension fishing as a starting tech). Except I'm not Jason Momoa so I am unworthy of the title Aquaman, instead taking on the moniker "Fish Man".

     
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  12. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    I thought Charlie map is the only one where there is a small possibility of it not being a cakewalk. Auggie map is inland sea, and those tend to be straightforward maps.
     
  13. krikav

    krikav Theorycrafter

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    I voted Charly too, mediocre leader, not an overpowered start, standard settings, and a fractal suprise.
     
  14. AcaMetis

    AcaMetis Chieftain

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    Sounds like Lain ought to sift through this topic for maps if only one of the ones he rolled randomly is "the only one where there is a small possibility of it not being a cakewalk". That's assuming he's in the mood for a hard map, of course :king:.
     
  15. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Err, I've not seen the whole last video yet, but I voted based on the info in the poll itself. I've not seen any map images anywhere.
     
  16. krikav

    krikav Theorycrafter

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    You can see him go through the maps here:
     
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  17. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    Well, many maps posted into this thread have been very easy, game 28 (Isabella, pangaea, capital settled on stone) being the most blatant one.

    Of course, there is always a small chance that he gets plotted on very early on any pangaea map...
     
  18. AcaMetis

    AcaMetis Chieftain

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    True, there's a few easy(/easier) ones, but Charly, Qin and Alex I wouldn't call easy, Alex again (before?) and Sitting Bull I wouldn't call t0 won cakewalks...probably others that I missed as well. Should at least offer a greater challenge than "the only one where there is a small possibility of it not being a cakewalk", right?
     
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  19. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    Those maps would get my seal of approval, partly because the starts are poor and partly because of map scripts.
     
  20. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Cheers. I usually look at the playlists. Tried to vote for Augustus now as it looked like a pretty rough start, and no tech brokering could be interesting. Might make it easier as well, it depends. But was told I've already voted. Not that it matters. AC is way behind, so it will be either Alex or Charlie. Random events is something different, so then I hope for that map. Often they don't really impact much, but some of the events can be really annoying, for instance that slavery thing in your capital.

    Funny about the Gilga map though...

    Pangaea: "This looks like a tough map."
    Lain: "May be my earliest win, on video at least."

    :goodjob:
     
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