Question about homeschooling

[Hundegesicht]

One of the more popular responces here is condemning home schooling because it deprives children of "social experiences" they might have in public school. Would someone explain why the "social experiences" found in public school are necessary, or even desireable? As myself and others have pointed out, school experiences are often horrible and debilitating, and often times in schools children are often purposely brainwashed into to be close-minded and ignorant. (Don't beleive me? Think about all the cliques, "school spirit events", etc. at the school you attended) And High Schools are hardly the only place for teenagers to have social experiences.

As has already pointed out, churches, work, youth groups, sports teams, bands, homeschool groups, etc. already provide much superior communities than public schools do. Not to mention almost every single homeschooled person I've met (including people on this board) seem to be nice, intelligent, successful, well-rounded people. Certainetly not the freaks you guys automatically assume them to be.

All the above considered, why is public schooling so important?

(Note, in all the above, I'm referring to the American school system, which is, with a few exceptions, aweful. I realize some countries have much better schools, and home schooling may not be as good as an alternative there as it is here)

 

[klazlo]

One of the more popular responces here is condemning home schooling because it deprives children of "social experiences" they might have in public school. Would someone explain why the "social experiences" found in public school are necessary, or even desireable? As myself and others have pointed out, school experiences are often horrible and debilitating, and often times in schools children are often purposely brainwashed into to be close-minded and ignorant. (Don't beleive me? Think about all the cliques, "school spirit events", etc. at the school you attended) And High Schools are hardly the only place for teenagers to have social experiences.

As has already pointed out, churches, work, youth groups, sports teams, bands, homeschool groups, etc. already provide much superior communities than public schools do. Not to mention almost every single homeschooled person I've met (including people on this board) seem to be nice, intelligent, successful, well-rounded people. Certainetly not the freaks you guys automatically assume them to be.

All the above considered, why is public schooling so important?

(Note, in all the above, I'm referring to the American school system, which is, with a few exceptions, aweful. I realize some countries have much better schools, and home schooling may not be as good as an alternative there as it is here)

Yes, let's abolish public education! Every power to the parents! Let's go back in time!
Homeschooling can be fine in some cases and not in others. Pesonally I think that only in some cases can this be justified. My daughter is in a public school (in the US before someone asks), and the staff is just great.
Obviously not many people think about family dynamics when jump into homeschooling. And parents (and certain communities) can also be brainwashers, giving the kids a totally one-sided view on the world.
I'm not saying that homeschooling is an ultimately bad thing. It depends on many things, including the residential area, the personality of the kid, the skills and views of the parents etc. Not every homeschooler becomes a weirdo, just as not every public schooler becomes a brainwashed idiot.

 

[downtown]

Man, did everybody here get beat up in public school or something? geez guys

before moving away for college, i used to work at an internet charter school. it was set up so hundreds of homeschooled kids could use a sample ciriculum and have some orginazation to their studies. I got to talk to and meet a lot of these homeschool familes, along with check out a lot of data.

After you pass the 5th or 6th grade, homeschool kids fall WAAAAY behind. I'm not just talking socially, although thats huge. (its important to be able to deal with all kinds of people here, including bullies) Acedemically, they just dont compare. it isnt even close. 65% of these kids could not pass the state mandated tests for high school graduation, which, i might point out, are not exactly hard. the college placement for these kids is less than 10%. Im talking kids in this school, not homeschoolers in all of Ohio, but their statewide numbers were not much better

who was homeschooled? after 6th grade, most of these kids had either a physical problem that prevented them from going to school (like say, being pregnant. that was popular), or had crazy parents that didnt want their kids to be exposed to the evils of public school.

what to know something funny? one of my jobs was to remove pornography that these kids with crazy religious mothers put on their computers. yeah, that worked out well.

I think homeschooling is a bad idea for most cases. it can work, but ONLY if the student has a lot of other contact with kids his age (like other homeschoolers), and the parent doesnt try to teach everything herself. The state can provide homeschool ciriculums, or charter schools can provide help for homeschoolers. if you dont have this, these kids usually fail.

 

[IglooDame]

If I had children (as opposed to teenaged step-children) I'd seriously consider homeschooling them through at least fourth, fifth, sixth or so grade. What they're teaching at that level is well within my own knowledge level, I'd avail myself of curriculum layouts created by professional educators, and I'm told I'm a very patient and clear instructor. I'd also see about getting my hands on the local school's final exams every year so as to make sure my child is not falling behind the school grade level.

 

[Kayak]

After you pass the 5th or 6th grade, homeschool kids fall WAAAAY behind. I'm not just talking socially, although thats huge. (its important to be able to deal with all kinds of people here, including bullies) Acedemically, they just dont compare. it isnt even close. 65% of these kids could not pass the state mandated tests for high school graduation, which, i might point out, are not exactly hard. the college placement for these kids is less than 10%. Im talking kids in this school, not homeschoolers in all of Ohio, but their statewide numbers were not much better

Just a bit of anecdotal evidence that I can add (with all caveats of course). My sister is a high school science teacher (public school). In three years she has had two home schooled students. She found them to be the worst prepared of all of her students. In science background and in writing and organizational skills in particular. Those kids had a hard time.

 

[Rambuchan]

It's also worth pointing out that wizard academies are just not what they used to be. I would therefore just lock my kid under the stairs and wait for the training to whisk him away in a magical and mysterious fashion. It's a kind of homeschooling, without the effort. Think about it: No cost (except for the odd bowl of cabbage water to keep the runt alive until magicked away). Kid is off your hands. 'Under stairs and out of mind'. And he becomes an international star with plenty of merchandising revenue to fund your lifestyle. Pity I live in a bungalow.

 

[Kayak]

Pity I live in a bungalow.

Do you have an attic?

 

[Rambuchan]

No I live in a bungalow. Did you not read the post you quoted?

Actually I live in a normal house with plenty of room under the stairs to lock kids in.

 

[Mathilda]

This is totally outside of my cultural experience.
Could someone be so kind and explain to me how this works?
I presume it means one of the parents has to stay home the whole time.
So to home school your kids you need to give up work.
Or what are the little blighters going to do all day while you're at work?

Is there any standards set about the kids will have to know by say age 16?
Who checks they can read and write and know that earth orbits the sun, not the other way round.

 

[Rambuchan]

This is totally outside of my cultural experience.
Could someone be so kind and explain to me how this works?
I presume it means one of the parents has to stay home the whole time.
So to home school your kids you need to give up work.
Or what are the little blighters going to do all day while you're at work?

My mother stopped her teaching work to raise myself and my sister. As soon as we left our teens, she rejoined the world of work. She has no qualms about it. Raising children was way more important to her than making money, something that seems to be lost on a lot of parents (not just mothers) these days.

 

[klazlo]

My mother stopped her teaching work to raise myself and my sister. As soon as we left our teens, she rejoined the world of work. She has no qualms about it. Raising children was way more important to her than making money, something that seems to be lost on a lot of parents (not just mothers) these days.

The big difference of course is that once families were pretty much able to live from one earning, and now it's not the case (with some exceptions). Women choosing to go to work is not always about importance and values, but also economic necessity. Or if it's about values, how about gender equity?

 

[viper275]

This is totally outside of my cultural experience.
Could someone be so kind and explain to me how this works?
I presume it means one of the parents has to stay home the whole time.
So to home school your kids you need to give up work.
Or what are the little blighters going to do all day while you're at work?

Is there any standards set about the kids will have to know by say age 16?
Who checks they can read and write and know that earth orbits the sun, not the other way round.

I don't know about other places, but here's how it works here (California, USA). There are 2 options if you homeschool. One is to go through a program, which can be from a district or the county's department of education, or a program from elsewhere. You are allowed to just do it yourself if you went to college to be a teacher, otherwise you have to go through a program.

IMO this where it varies on whether homeschooling is beneficial or not. Even if you studied to be a teacher in college, you can still cause holes in the kid's education, where they're really far ahead in some subjects and really far behind in others. If you go through a program, they most likely have to follow the state's education standards (certainly will if it's from the school district or county's department of education) and would provide the curriculum materials necessary (books, required assignments, etc.) Furthermore, I think it depends on the reasons to homeschool. If the kid is homeschooling because they want to stay home and play video games all day, or if the parents want him to, the kid probably won't care very much and not do well as a result. If they want to homeschool for a different reason, like wanting more challenging assignments, it can be helpful. One more aspect of this is the kid's age. I think a parent could teach a 4th grader fine, but probably not a 9th grader very well. In other words, even if the kid homeschools, they should go to high school and maybe middle school IMO.

 

[Archbob]

Yeah, the church usuasally has a better crowd than public schools.

 

[Alphawolf]

I was home schooled for the 7th and 8th grade and it really helped me I was a D student and after I home schooled I was an A student and I am currently at college with a full scholarship. Home schooling can definitely help in the middle grades 6-8, but I would recommend regular school for the other grades. Public, private, or church you choose; my time in school I was at a public school and I would not give anything for my experiences at school (both good and bad) since home school kids the entire way through will skew there social skills.

-the Wolf

 

[Olorin0222]

I don't think I'm that screwed socially...

I mean, I spend my free time here with you guys and gals...

 

[Rambuchan]

The big difference of course is that once families were pretty much able to live from one earning, and now it's not the case (with some exceptions). Women choosing to go to work is not always about importance and values, but also economic necessity. Or if it's about values, how about gender equity?

This is all true. Economic necessity - well ain't it a beatch.

And like I mentioned, it's not just one gender being referred to here. I know at least two guys who stay at home to look after their kids whilst the lady of the house earns a crust.

 

[Narz]

This is all true. Economic necessity - well ain't it a beatch.

And like I mentioned, it's not just one gender being referred to here. I know at least two guys who stay at home to look after their kids whilst the lady of the house earns a crust.

Being a house husband!

 

[Hundegesicht]

This is totally outside of my cultural experience.
Could someone be so kind and explain to me how this works?

It differs from case to case. Some homeschool for religous reasons (see the amish, learning cooking, letters, and how to work hard), some for acedemic, some for social reasons, and some just because they want to have more control over their kid's education.

Likewise, some people have their children take classes entirely at home. There are educational organizations (see Saxon, for example) which produce textbooks and programs specifically meant to be used by homeschooled students, and include educational videos, online courses and grading, experiments, etc. This, of course, requires a lot of study and supervision from parents themselves, and is hard to do unless only 1 parent works.

Another popular form is "homeschool co-ops", where different parents with different degrees teach classes to high school students. For example, one man may have a degree in chemistry, another may be a lawyer, another an engineer, another a cook, another a mechanic. The mechanic would send his kids to take government classes from the lawyer, or the engineer might send his kid to take classes from the chemisty major. These classes are usually taken at a local church or community center. (The YMCA hosts a lot of these)

I've known several people who send their children to public school for one class, a co-op for 3 or 4, a private tutor for another, and teach the rest at home.

I presume it means one of the parents has to stay home the whole time.
So to home school your kids you need to give up work.

Generally, yes.

Or what are the little blighters going to do all day while you're at work?[/quote]

Is there any standards set about the kids will have to know by say age 16?

Depends on what state/country they live in. Homeschooling is legal in the USA, Canada, and most countries in Europe. For a real life example, Italy has rather strict regulations on homeschooling, while Idaho has very little. Others fall in between, with some states requiring annual tests, others tests at 12, 14, and 16 years old, others none. Some need licenses, others don't.

Who checks they can read and write and know that earth orbits the sun, not the other way round.

Life, I guess.

School education doesn't really matter compared to, say, college, or workplace experience. There's the ACT/SAT, and almost all colleges have special tests set up for homeschool students who apply, and whether you get a job or not doesn't really depend on whether they received standardized education... just how intelligent they are, and willing to learn.

 

[Syterion]

All I know is that in my district, or county, not sure which one, homeschoolers have like a 30% failure rate for MCAS. My school has <1% failure rate cause all the stuff on the 10th grade exam was practically 6th grade math/writing. I know public schools in my area are pretty good, but I can't imagine people who actually want to pass not passing. I can understand the larger amounts in the inner cities, but homeschooled in a rich area? I think it's foolish as a parent to believe you are qualified to teach every subject past 5th grade. I might supplement my child's education, with writing skills and advanced math and science concepts, maybe some broader history, and hopefully a foreign language. But in no way could I make sure my child understands what is needed without some clear grades.

 

[Olorin0222]

It also depends on your learning style: My parents did not need to "teach" me, as they could just give me the textbook, let me read it, and I would generally comprehend the material just fine.

From my experience in my area (Kansas City), the homeschool kids are pretty smart. As for passing tests and making grades, I did just fine, getting a 30 on my ACT.