![[to_xp]Gekko](https://civfanatics-data.community.forum/avatars/m/74/74677.jpg?1475248346){kind=avatar}
[to_xp]Gekko
QCT junkie
what I did is re-add the recon promotion tree rework from MOAR that was removed in S&T, it swaps guerrilla and spyglass and changes Ambush to be +20 when defending so it's not OP anymore
- Thread starter isau
- Start date
Guynemer
King
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2002
- Messages
- 887
Bug report: Using the latest beta. I am declared friends (and level 2 allies) with Robert the Bruce, and just discovered Reformed Church. In spite of the friendship bonus text saying that I should now be able to build golf courses with my builders, and I am unable to do so.
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
Torvald
Prince
Hi,
I am currently playing a game using mod version 5.0.4 Beta. Would it be safe for me to update my current game to mod version 5.0.6 Beta and continue playing, or do I need to wait until I start another game?
I am currently playing a game using mod version 5.0.4 Beta. Would it be safe for me to update my current game to mod version 5.0.6 Beta and continue playing, or do I need to wait until I start another game?
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
In general it is not safe not change the underlying SQL mid-game. I would finish your game in v5.0.4 and then upgrade to 5.0.6 when you are ready to start a new game. This is mainly due to how the database injects certain values into the game at Turn 1 (basically, game objects like leaders and units are cloned from the database and become their own permanent entities), and once they are established, any changes to them either are ignored or can cause CTD conflicts.
FYI this is also why this mod is so rarely updated on Steam--Steam does not let me control when the download happens, so it corrupts save games. Hence I only update on Steam every few months, and post the regular updates here where players have more control over when they upgrade.
I'm getting an error and can't start a game. After researching the fix listed elsewhere here, I ran into this in my modding.log:
[3062463.994] UpdateDatabase - Loading Gameplay/Quo_ZZ_Debug_Code.sql
[3062463.994] ERROR: Failed to release save point.
[3062464.012] Warning: Error when calling IComponentHandler::ApplyComponent.
This is the only Failed to release save point error in my log. Any recommendations?
[3062463.994] UpdateDatabase - Loading Gameplay/Quo_ZZ_Debug_Code.sql
[3062463.994] ERROR: Failed to release save point.
[3062464.012] Warning: Error when calling IComponentHandler::ApplyComponent.
This is the only Failed to release save point error in my log. Any recommendations?
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
Hmm, I have no ideas on this one. Quo_ZZ_Debug normally contains nothing special in it. Make sure you are using the most recent version of the of the mod, and that if you are subscribed via Steam that you don't have both the Steam and CivFanatics version of the mod enabled at the same time.
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
OK so there is one big final bug that is preventing me releasing a non-Beta version and rolling out to Steam. The issue is the new Government legacy policy cards. To be honest I'm not a fan of these policies in terms of balance to begin with. But there are the added problems that:
I'm deciding how to handle this. I think it's probably a good thing the extras added by this mod don't get applied by the cards, because that would create a policy card that is outrageously overpowered--the reason the governments were buffed was to make each one really different. Trouble is, I can't edit the text of the card separately from the text on the government screen. Part of me wants to just delete these special policy cards entirely, then create dummy versions of them or something that does close to the same things the cards do in a more balanced way. The mechanism for earning the card is hamfisted IMO (you get it when you complete a government building).
Another option would be to write it something like this (for Autocracy):
+1 to all Yields per govt building. (+1 Faith to each tile adjacent to a Wonder.)
...and then just explain in the pop-up window when you start the mod that anything in parentheses in a government policy card does not actually apply. However I feel like that would still be confusing.
A different way to do it would be to eliminate the government policy cards entirely and roll their bonuses into existing Policies that suck.
Still making a decision. I welcome thoughts in the meantime.
- Internally, the text of the card uses the same text description label as the government
- The extra abilities applied by this mod to governments, like Faith around each Wonder in Autocracy, do not actually work with the card
I'm deciding how to handle this. I think it's probably a good thing the extras added by this mod don't get applied by the cards, because that would create a policy card that is outrageously overpowered--the reason the governments were buffed was to make each one really different. Trouble is, I can't edit the text of the card separately from the text on the government screen. Part of me wants to just delete these special policy cards entirely, then create dummy versions of them or something that does close to the same things the cards do in a more balanced way. The mechanism for earning the card is hamfisted IMO (you get it when you complete a government building).
Another option would be to write it something like this (for Autocracy):
+1 to all Yields per govt building. (+1 Faith to each tile adjacent to a Wonder.)
...and then just explain in the pop-up window when you start the mod that anything in parentheses in a government policy card does not actually apply. However I feel like that would still be confusing.
A different way to do it would be to eliminate the government policy cards entirely and roll their bonuses into existing Policies that suck.
Still making a decision. I welcome thoughts in the meantime.
Strange - it seemed to be related to having Legendary Start selected. I scrubbed my folders, started with this mod and added a single mod at a time, launching small map base games. I got all mods working, then attempted an advanced start map - large, continents, epic, emperor, legendary start, abundant resources, wet, low sea level. I was sent back to the title screen. Started doing one of those items at a time and made it up to everything except the legendary start with the game working...
In regards to the government legacy cards, I'd be interested to hear what you come up with as replacement cards. I can see your points though. I'm sure you'll end up with a decision that works well in the game.
In regards to the government legacy cards, I'd be interested to hear what you come up with as replacement cards. I can see your points though. I'm sure you'll end up with a decision that works well in the game.
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
isau updated Quo's Combined Tweaks with a new update entry:
Quo's Combined Tweaks v5.0.7 BETA for Rise and Fall
Read the rest of this update entry...
Quo's Combined Tweaks v5.0.7 BETA for Rise and Fall
Read the rest of this update entry...
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
isau updated Quo's Combined Tweaks with a new update entry:
Quo's Combined Tweaks v5.0.8 for Rise and Fall
Read the rest of this update entry...
Quo's Combined Tweaks v5.0.8 for Rise and Fall
Read the rest of this update entry...
Guynemer
King
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2002
- Messages
- 887
I like a lot of those changes, isau. The one thing I am hesitant about is the Religious Settlements buff; I already tamp down the border expansion to 200 or 250 in the myoptions file; 650 up from 500 isn't a huge bump, but 400 from 250 is substantial. The primary draw was always the extra trade route, but now... that's gonna be hard to pass up.
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
Yep that's the reason I left the original 10% value unmodded til now. I suppose I could do some kind of math on it instead of setting a hard value. Make it equal to 1/4th the value of the border speed buff or something. In the meantime if you want to lower it for your own purposes you can do this in the MyScratchpad.sql file:
Code:
UPDATE ModifierArguments SET Value='150' WHERE ModifierID='RELIGIOUS_SETTLEMENTS_CULTUREBORDER' AND Name='Amount';Just change 150 to whatever value you think is balanced for you playstyle. The text will still say 150 unless you also change that but otherwise this should work.
I am having the same issue. Unfortunately for me, changing start position (or any of the other setup parameters) does not fix it.
Playing with all of my mods minus Quo works fine. Playing with only Quo does not.
Version 5.0.6 has worked fine, but both 5.0.7 and 5.0.8 do not.
Myrrdin_Emrys
Warlord
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2011
- Messages
- 112
I just finished a game with your mod, it was the first time i tried your mod.
Overall i really like your mod, it is a great job to balance the game for the human player, to let the player have real choices so it is making the game really more interesting.
I think i will keep playing your mod for a while cuz it seems really interesting. I can't totally have a worthy opinion just after one game but here are my 2 cents (the good and bad points... well the bad points are not a call to change or to balance those things just my opinion)
-> you did change the tech and culture tree, good idea, no more dead end except for exploration (the civic which unlock the maritim republic tier 2 government)
-> the delay for the holy site is a great idea, coupled with the wild card policy while in chieftain government it really make an interesting race for great prophet with the AI. I really love this change.
-> your buffs towards coastal cities are really elegants and balanced i think.
-> the wall restriction for encampment .... well i dont have a clear opinion on it yet... dont know if i like or dislike this idea. Would it be possible to increase the costs of walls by 300% (value is arbitrary i just say this value to clarify my idea) and give the barrack/Stable a buff of 300% production speed for walls. Like this the player would have the choice between building walls really expensive if necessary or building it via encampment faster... but maybe the AI would not understand this choice.
-> the buff to AI district is an elegant and efficient way to buff the AI trought the whole game without giving it huge advantages at turn 0 !
-> the total removal of science/culture per pop again leave me doubtful.
I like this idea because you really have to specialize ur cities. But at the same time it flavors too much the wide (having a lot of cities) gameplay style (i miss the tall gameplay still - having fewer cities but with a lot of pop). Would it be possible (not necessary in your mod i ask about modding) to do something like science per pop in function of the pop of a city (to be more clear for example [values are arbitrary again and surely not balanced] a 0.2 science/pop for city between 1 and 9 citizens, 0.4 for cities between 10 and 14 citizens, 0.6 between 15 and 20 and 0.8 above....)
-> the increase movement speed of all units is a way to counter the not so usefull roads of civ 6, it works fine, is it the best way to fix it ? idk, anyway at least warfare is more interesting now
-> the little tooltip at start of the game to say hat change is really a cool idea. Would it be possible to but a page in the civilopedia in game to state all the changes ?
-> the bonus for declaration of friendship are cool ! are they balanced it is another story (can't tell just after one game)
-> i dont know if it is due to my game, but wall with catapults were steal really hard to break ! (even a city without walls in medieval/renaissance)
-> maybe the thing i did the less appreciate was the new anti cavalry units ... why do they have both ranged and melee attack ? especially at the beginning of the game it makes the spearman crazy powerful ! they just need 15 xp to get the +10 against melee class, and they reign in king of the battefield. they can shoot without retalation melee or ranged classes, can cut through cavalry due to their innate bonus, until the discovery of iron (and u have to secure iron to get swordman) they are so though ! and they make slingers totally useless....
i think they should have a reduced attack range value if u still want them having a range attack (i still wonder why ...) and/or a little rework of the promotion tree for them because a unit (with 15xp) that can deal very well vs ranged/melee/cavalry is definitly not balanced.
Greeks were not in my game, but i dont even want to imagine how powerful and unstoppable they can be early game...
for my game, i did random Georgia on fractal map... the buff towards government plaza is maybe a bit too high.
+2 faith to every tile in 3 range mean a potential 6+12+18=36 tiles buffed so potentially +72 faith per turn....
I did build very early (in my capital) the plaza and settle 2 cities around so i had a lot of tiles buffed (maybe not 36 but maybe 30 !) that is a bit too much i think. +1 would be clearly enough i think (and if u really want to compensate u can give them +XX% bonus prod toward the plaza)
Anyway thanks for ur mod, i had fun thx to you !
sorry for this long text and for my english (im not native speaker)
Overall i really like your mod, it is a great job to balance the game for the human player, to let the player have real choices so it is making the game really more interesting.
I think i will keep playing your mod for a while cuz it seems really interesting. I can't totally have a worthy opinion just after one game but here are my 2 cents (the good and bad points... well the bad points are not a call to change or to balance those things just my opinion)
-> you did change the tech and culture tree, good idea, no more dead end except for exploration (the civic which unlock the maritim republic tier 2 government)
-> the delay for the holy site is a great idea, coupled with the wild card policy while in chieftain government it really make an interesting race for great prophet with the AI. I really love this change.
-> your buffs towards coastal cities are really elegants and balanced i think.
-> the wall restriction for encampment .... well i dont have a clear opinion on it yet... dont know if i like or dislike this idea. Would it be possible to increase the costs of walls by 300% (value is arbitrary i just say this value to clarify my idea) and give the barrack/Stable a buff of 300% production speed for walls. Like this the player would have the choice between building walls really expensive if necessary or building it via encampment faster... but maybe the AI would not understand this choice.
-> the buff to AI district is an elegant and efficient way to buff the AI trought the whole game without giving it huge advantages at turn 0 !
-> the total removal of science/culture per pop again leave me doubtful.
I like this idea because you really have to specialize ur cities. But at the same time it flavors too much the wide (having a lot of cities) gameplay style (i miss the tall gameplay still - having fewer cities but with a lot of pop). Would it be possible (not necessary in your mod i ask about modding) to do something like science per pop in function of the pop of a city (to be more clear for example [values are arbitrary again and surely not balanced] a 0.2 science/pop for city between 1 and 9 citizens, 0.4 for cities between 10 and 14 citizens, 0.6 between 15 and 20 and 0.8 above....)
-> the increase movement speed of all units is a way to counter the not so usefull roads of civ 6, it works fine, is it the best way to fix it ? idk, anyway at least warfare is more interesting now
-> the little tooltip at start of the game to say hat change is really a cool idea. Would it be possible to but a page in the civilopedia in game to state all the changes ?
-> the bonus for declaration of friendship are cool ! are they balanced it is another story (can't tell just after one game)
-> i dont know if it is due to my game, but wall with catapults were steal really hard to break ! (even a city without walls in medieval/renaissance)
-> maybe the thing i did the less appreciate was the new anti cavalry units ... why do they have both ranged and melee attack ? especially at the beginning of the game it makes the spearman crazy powerful ! they just need 15 xp to get the +10 against melee class, and they reign in king of the battefield. they can shoot without retalation melee or ranged classes, can cut through cavalry due to their innate bonus, until the discovery of iron (and u have to secure iron to get swordman) they are so though ! and they make slingers totally useless....
i think they should have a reduced attack range value if u still want them having a range attack (i still wonder why ...) and/or a little rework of the promotion tree for them because a unit (with 15xp) that can deal very well vs ranged/melee/cavalry is definitly not balanced.
Greeks were not in my game, but i dont even want to imagine how powerful and unstoppable they can be early game...
for my game, i did random Georgia on fractal map... the buff towards government plaza is maybe a bit too high.
+2 faith to every tile in 3 range mean a potential 6+12+18=36 tiles buffed so potentially +72 faith per turn....
I did build very early (in my capital) the plaza and settle 2 cities around so i had a lot of tiles buffed (maybe not 36 but maybe 30 !) that is a bit too much i think. +1 would be clearly enough i think (and if u really want to compensate u can give them +XX% bonus prod toward the plaza)
Anyway thanks for ur mod, i had fun thx to you !
sorry for this long text and for my english (im not native speaker)
[to_xp]Gekko
QCT junkie
good point, the older +5 -5 formula for anticavalry without melee attack was probably more balanced
isau
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2007
- Messages
- 3,071
It's interesting that you guysare finding Anti-Cavalry to be overpowered. In my playthroughs they've been really weak. I was thinking I needed to buff them again. Are you buiding lots of calvary armies? I suppose I build a lot of Infantry armies and that is why I seem to wipe them out. Poor AI Greece tried to build its UU and I wiped the floor with them. Maybe its a difference in tactics?
The rule that Walls require Barracks/Stable was implemented specifically because of how the game played around December of 2016. The AI at that point was simply incapable of taking a city with walls, even from another AI. The Encampment was moved to its location on the Civics tree because it goaded the AI at the time to build Encampments. The idea was at least if not every city had walls, the AI would be capable of occasionally taking other cities and snowballing its empires.
The more I look at how the game plays in R&F the more I notice that peaceful AIs don't bother with Encampments at all. I like the vulnerability that the Walls rules create in players, but I think the AI needs to understand better how to react.
All that being the case, the Walls rules have always been one of the biggest topics of controversy for this mod. That is why there is a built in setting in the MyOptions file that lets you turn that rule off.
The rule that Walls require Barracks/Stable was implemented specifically because of how the game played around December of 2016. The AI at that point was simply incapable of taking a city with walls, even from another AI. The Encampment was moved to its location on the Civics tree because it goaded the AI at the time to build Encampments. The idea was at least if not every city had walls, the AI would be capable of occasionally taking other cities and snowballing its empires.
The more I look at how the game plays in R&F the more I notice that peaceful AIs don't bother with Encampments at all. I like the vulnerability that the Walls rules create in players, but I think the AI needs to understand better how to react.
All that being the case, the Walls rules have always been one of the biggest topics of controversy for this mod. That is why there is a built in setting in the MyOptions file that lets you turn that rule off.
Jason Farber
Chieftain
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2016
- Messages
- 22
Has anyone noticed that the AI is not settling cities in areas where there is minimal negative loyalty? My son mentioned it and he has been playing Civ quite a bit more than me lately. This would be a big disadvantage to the AI, if that is what is happening
dudeSDCA
Prince
Similar issue - 5.0.6 was stable for me, 5.0.8 is causing conflicts.
1) Most notable is a conflict between Quo's and JFD's Rule with Faith. -- 5.0.8 won't load with other mods; when just Quos + JFD then the civics tree screen won't open
2) I think changes to pantheon in 5.08 are causing conflicts with mods that affect religion faith (religion history, rule with faith, etc.)
Sticking with 5.0.6 now as it's stable for me.
