Realpolitik CIV - An Interactive AAR

[Aysee]

Ravus-York (I think, based on the story)

Just a little thought, to put things into perspective:
Those who are in the administration today can just as easily be in the opposition tommorow; and vice-versa.

 

[arya126]

Whosit- I personally think we should save Chinook. That would save on settlers. But if you think we should burn it and place somehwer else, ill do it. *sigh*. You all say i ignore everyone leses opinion, but then you forget I AM THE PRESIDENT, and my opinion is allowed to count as well. I had ONE TURNSET and everyone says i ignore evryones positions. I admit, i didnt take into account as much as i should have, but most of the crap i counted out was from the opposition, and was stuff i would never ever do in a turnset in this situation. They are as close to the opposite of my opinion as you can get most of the time. They can institute their ideals if they ever get re-elected to office.

 

[Whosit]

Whosit- I personally think we should save Chinook. That would save on settlers. But if you think we should burn it and place somehwer else, ill do it. *sigh*.

Saving a Settler is good, but when doing so interferes with an otherwise superior location, I'd rather spend the extra 100 hammers than have a sub-par city for the rest of the game. When Barb cities pop up in better locations, I like to keep them.

 

[MathNerd]

Arya, people are saying that you don't listen to the people because you haven't. I consider your recent plan simply a political tactic, but at least its a step in the right direction. Arya, Aysee and Ilduce are correct. The administration may not be as set in stone as it may seem.

And Ilduce, I don't need you to join my coalition. As a matter of fact, I think that some healthy competition does good for all parties.

Also, wouldn't we need to wait for Chinook to grow to size 2 before taking it if we don't want it to auto-burn? I agree with Whosit on the city location. Burn the Barb city.

 

[W|M]

IC: Relocate inhabitants to a much better place.

 

[arya126]

Okay i need opinions on something for the plan of the next urnset. What do we do with the deficit? Letting it run may be an option if we had a larger treasury, but we dont. In 2 turns we will be at 0. Opinions?

 

[arya126]

Look how about we stop with all this IC stuff? That wasnt how realpoltik was originally, or ever, meant to be played. We make the decisions for the country. But if we start acting like we are really there (like the slavery debate. We should decide based on whats going to affect the game, not the world of day to day lives in the game).

This is just a suggestion. I think it might make things alot simpler if we took the morality issue out of the equation. It just creates heated arguements since neither side would be willing to move, and alot of the time decreases what we can do in the game. Dont take it the wrong way. This is not a political tactic. Its just it stresses me out big time when i have to debate about the 'ethics' of slavery and how it affects people that dont exist. Talking about how it increases productivity is much simpler.

EDIT: sorry for double post.

 

[MathNerd]

Oh. I thought the relocate inhabitants thing was a given! We can move them a few (OOC) tiles (back IC) to the side into our new city.

I think we should run 0% for a turn, then run 100% for as long as we can, then run 0% for one turn again, then run 100% again, etc. Binary research, you know.

Also, we must build more cottages. In the late game, cottages become indispensable. And we also must build workers. Lots of workers.

OOC: Arya, in my mind it ruins all of the fun (and much of the point) if we stop making IC comments.

 

[mechaerik]

Look at the election, you don't have a majority government, if me and whosit left you, we would split parliament 50-50.

Both the PCE and the Imperial Party received 4 votes. The CoF recieved 12 more votes than the Philosophers. So yeah, thats a majority.

Also, I don't particularly think Whosit is planning on turning on us.

Also in this government every president seems to retire after one term. So for all they care they could up the country and retire nicely.

Not necessarily. I don't think its a rule that the president has to retire (otherwise we would run out of electable people quick).

The current political situation is not working. I dont want to be against you arya, but I fear I will have to be if their is any chance of change coming to England. I would rather this revoloution be a silent one, where the leaders of the rebels (Me, MN and WIM) can have a discussion with you and settle this revolt peacefully.

Change will come. This is a crisis situation, where the existence of this country is under threat from outside forces. Our military is dangerously weak, and yet we continue to bicker.

 

[ilduce349]

okay i need opinions on something for the plan of the next urnset. What do we do with the deficit? Letting it run may be an option if we had a larger treasury, but we dont. In 2 turns we will be at 0. Opinions?

run a surpluss!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Whosit]

Okay i need opinions on something for the plan of the next urnset. What do we do with the deficit? Letting it run may be an option if we had a larger treasury, but we dont. In 2 turns we will be at 0. Opinions?

I made some rough calculations based on the screen shots (again, having direct access to the save file would make this much easier/accurate), but I think that if we run max gold for about 7 turns and max research for 10, we can get through Metal Casting. By my estimates, it's still 17 turns even if we turn the slider down.

I estimate that our total costs are about 23 gold per turn, though I'd like to see the Financial Screen to see how that's broken down (yeah, technically the realm of the Financial Minister, but I thought I'd point it out). I also estimate that we will earn about 34 gold per turn at max gold (max income being about 57 commerce), barring additional costs.

To make the most of this Binary Research, I'd normally recommend building some Libraries during the max gold phase, but I don't think that any of our cities would really benefit from them at this time, since we do not really have any cottages outside the capital. Which is bad.

 

[MathNerd]

You're right, (see! I'm trying to be less politician-like) you guys still have a definite majority, but its less definite than before anything happened.

I don't think of its as a revolt, but instead as a revolution.

And there is no need for running a surplus. Extra gold generally goes to waste later on in the game, the only time I think a surplus is OK is when getting ready for a "First to get to gets a..." race.

EDIT: So it looks like we all agree on MORE COTTAGES, correct?

 

[arya126]

We dont really have the workers to build cottages. I dont feel comfortable building too many workers with peter and ragnar still on their toes about us. But ill see what i can do (as usual).

LH-Can you please give us some clarification on what happened there?

EDIT: Revolts and revolutions end up the same most of the time. If you try and incite a revolution, i consider that a crisis. What you are doing, is basicly trying to say the adminstration is too strong (or the president is too strong) and that you need more power, even though you werent voted in. So i will react to any revolt/revolution badly and consider the use of my options (powers).

 

[Whosit]

EDIT: So it looks like we all agree on MORE COTTAGES, correct?

It depends on where you put a city and, to an extent, what your overall goal is, although cottages (economy) are always very, very important. The cities in Iberia will not have cottages. Too many hills. They will gain commerce from resources and from the sea, and will otherwise focus on production, I think. Europe has a lot of grasslands and many rivers, which is perfect terrain to build cottages. It would make an excellent financial core, although I think we need to take more of it (but we need an army, first).

So, short answer: Yes, more cottages. After we get more Workers.

 

[MathNerd]

Our workers usually can just retreat to the nearest city for defense. And even with the workers we do have, we might as well use them for cottages.

 

[ilduce349]

Both the PCE and the Imperial Party received 4 votes. The CoF recieved 12 more votes than the Philosophers. So yeah, thats a majority.

Also, I don't particularly think Whosit is planning on turning on us.

there where 26 votes
you and arya got 13

Not necessarily. I don't think its a rule that the president has to retire (otherwise we would run out of electable people quick).

True, but everyone seems to be retiring after one election.

Change will come. This is a crisis situation, where the existence of this country is under threat from outside forces. Our military is dangerously weak, and yet we continue to bicker.

I voted for expanding the military. I also voted for running a surplus (something arya promised but didn't fulfill) and locking Ravus up (something almost everyone except arya voted for)
I don't want to trust a government that is so large, but relies to much on one person. The president doesn't so whats best for the people, he does what the people want. In this case the people have voted on locking Ravus up for his massacre of the Buddhists. They are still human and deserve to live for they did no wrong. This isn't a democracy, this is an elected dictatorship. I WANT A DEMOCRACY.

 

[Whosit]

Our workers usually can just retreat to the nearest city for defense. And even with the workers we do have, we might as well use them for cottages.

I think that our Worker priority is to connect the strategic resources in Iberia, and hopefully the Gold and Silver once we get the city down (increasing the happiness limit is very important). Meanwhile, we increase our military presence in Europe so that we can protect the Workers we send there.

I WANT A DEMOCRACY.

A democracy is where we act according to majority decision. In such a case, parties are meaningless. In truth, there are no large scale democracies. Even the United States is technically a republic (a democratic republic, but a republic nonetheless). There are problems even with pure democracy that I won't get into here, because this isn't even a real "republic," anyway.

 

[mechaerik]

There were 22 votes. The other 4 are lurkers that didn't vote.

13/22=.59>.5

Therefore, more than half the votes cast were for either the Modernizational or Liberal Marxist parties.

And yes, we must expand our military.

 

[W|M]

This isn't a democracy, this is an elected dictatorship. I WANT A DEMOCRACY.

All of the post above, but especially the quoted part. Also, this is Noble - On this difficulty, I can afford an extremely scant military.

EDIT: Double X-Post, and I agree with Whosit: The amount of great Iberian resources is too much for us to ignore.

 

[MathNerd]

I always consider resources to be of utmost importance. Get those first. In this case I meant that instead of building, say a random farm, we should build cottages.