Resource Management Discussion

[Trav'ling Canuck]

I don't think you're getting copies of the resources slotted in that city, rather the ones produced by that city's improved tiles. The only way those could be removed from the city is by swapping tiles to another city (if that's possible) or culture bombing them (if it's possible to steal them in that way).

That makes a lot more sense than my interpretation.

Then the main interaction for the trade route, after established, would be if all sources of that resource produced by that city were pillaged (assuming pillaging is still a thing).

 

[Zaarin]

pillaging is still a thing

We saw pillaging in the Antiquity stream but not specifically how it interacts with resources or trade.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

That makes a lot more sense than my interpretation.

Then the main interaction for the trade route, after established, would be if all sources of that resource produced by that city were pillaged (assuming pillaging is still a thing).

I'm anticipating that there will be some sort of Trade Embargo diplomatic sanction that you can enact to stop the flow of all resources from your civ to the target. It may be a Modern Age specific thing though. Also, I expect that trade will cease if you declare war.

 

[Krikkit1]

For some reason, I thought that only applied to resources assigned to that settlement, not empire-wide resources.

Now that I think about it, I wonder what that means for trade routes that are created and then the resource gets reassigned out of the origin settlement. Does that immediately break the trade route? Is this a cheesy way to mess with your neighbours, or does the trade route have a finite lifespan that stays in place until its normal end date? Or something else entirely?

The Tile with the resources can supply 1 copy to every player in the game.

You get 1 copy you can’t trade away (although you can decide what settlement benefits if it is not an empire resource)

Anyone allowed to trade with you can get their own copy of that resource for their empire (or to assign to one of their cities). they get a copy by sending a trade routee to the source, the Tile

 

[Josephias]

I don't think that's the case. Also, you don't decide who your resources get traded to. A merchant or trade ship approaches your city and creates a trade route, which gives the sender copies of that city's resources. Unless there's some intervening diplomatic step that hasn't been discussed, you don't get to make that choice to allow or disallow trading of specific resources.

I’m positive you will have a diplomatic action / stance to implement embargos on other players, but that is probably your only (or one of your few) means of control.

(Edit: well you just said it afterwards, so… ninjd?)

Edit2: just to provide some additional content to the post: as an alternative option? Do we know if we have privateer-like units that could pillage foreign trade routes coming into your towns?

 

[Siptah]

I’m positive you will have a diplomatic action / stance to implement embargos on other players, but that is probably your only (or one of your few) means of control.

I liked HK's three level approach for that: forbid trade, allow trade of luxuries only, and allow trade of all resources. I could see something similar for civ 7: embargo, allow trading settlement resources, allow trading all resources.

 

[chaosprophet]

I’m positive you will have a diplomatic action / stance to implement embargos on other players, but that is probably your only (or one of your few) means of control.

At least, you need a good relationship with someone to have more than one trade route with them. So not having good relations in a way already reduce the amount of possible trade routes.

 

[B0RDERL1NE]

Duplicate copies of Resources, either Empire or in the same Settlement, do stack.

 

[Seek]

Yep, resource management system is the second thing which worries me in terms of tedious micromanagement. The first is potential adjacency planning - the interface could help you with current numbers, but planning future age civ buildings has to be made inside player's head.

I’m not too worried about resource allocation micro, given how they have removed so much of city/empire micro.

As to your second point, I’ve already started making a spreadsheet to compare adjacency bonuses… I won’t lie, I do enjoy this kind of thing though!

 

[Siptah]

So, with multiple resources stacking confirmed, I really wonder how rare gold is. 5 copies would be sufficient for a 100% gold discount…

But that’s great news for Iron and Horses for sure!

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

So, with multiple resources stacking confirmed, I really wonder how rare gold is. 5 copies would be sufficient for a 100% gold discount…

Another argument for another mechanic I've thought the game needed for years: Random Reveal of Resources later in the game:
Gold Rushes!

Especially if even one new Gold Resource can give you a 10% boost, it would be worth striving to get and exploit a new Gold resource on the map . . .

 

[Josephias]

So, if multiple resources stack, I really wonder how rare gold is. 5 copies would be sufficient for a 100% gold discount…

% stacks are always tricky ¿is stacking 5 20% a 100% discount (1-5*1/5)? or a 66% discount ((1-1/5)^5=1024/3125)?

 

[Zaarin]

Another argument for another mechanic I've thought the game needed for years: Random Reveal of Resources later in the game:
Gold Rushes!

Especially if even one new Gold Resource can give you a 10% boost, it would be worth striving to get and exploit a new Gold resource on the map . . .

We've definitely been told new resources will appear in new ages so that will at least partially happen, I think. Scrambling for new resources seems like it will be very thematic of both Exploration and Modern, though in Modern it will probably be raw materials for manufactured resources, which have already been teased.

 

[Siptah]

Another argument for another mechanic I've thought the game needed for years: Random Reveal of Resources later in the game:
Gold Rushes!

Especially if even one new Gold Resource can give you a 10% boost, it would be worth striving to get and exploit a new Gold resource on the map . . .

Could also be a fun scenario!

 

[8housesofelixir]

% stacks are always tricky ¿is stacking 5 20% a 100% discount (1-5*1/5)? or a 66% discount ((1-1/5)^5=1024/3125)?

Reminds me that in Humankind, all the percentage stackings are additive, and as a result it is actually possible to have something like a -95% discount on unit productions or something.

 

[Krikkit1]

So, with multiple resources stacking confirmed, I really wonder how rare gold is. 5 copies would be sufficient for a 100% gold discount…

But that’s great news for Iron and Horses for sure!

It's not a discount -20% cost... instead gold spent on it is 20% better... so a 100$ thing will only cos 84$ with gold (84*1.2=100)

so 5 gold copies make it 1/2 cost

50$ *(1+0.2*5)=50$*2=100$

 

[JNR13]

Oh no, empire-wide resource stacking made resources so horribly OP in Humankind that every other aspect of the yield economy became more or less irrelevant...

Not sure why we even need empire-wide resources other than for non-city effects such as military power. The settlement-based allocations seem like a fine system for all resources affecting yields. In a settlement, the power of stacking is kept in check by three of a kind also requiring three slots. And it's always for one city.

But the risk of breaking the economy is high when one resource copy for a single-city empire does 20x less than two copies for a ten-city empire. Production volume depending on consumption is quite the odd economic feedback loop.

I also wonder how this will affect map sizes. In Civ VI, the extra luxuries you gained on larger maps were balanced out by having to supply more cities with Amenities. Both resource availability and consumption correlated to map area. Now for empire-wide resources, availability still scales but consumption is constant.

I can't wait though for musketeers beating tanks with the power of really good niter supply chain management.

 

[Evolena]

Although, unlike Humanking, you won't be able to trade for literaly every resource on the map.

 

[Krikkit1]

Although, unlike Humanking, you won't be able to trade for literaly every resource on the map.

It depends on how many trade routes you can get. If you have good relationships with everyone, and a high enough limit on your trade routes... you could get all the empire resources on the map

 

[Vitruvian Guar]

Not sure why we even need empire-wide resources other than for non-city effects such as military power. The settlement-based allocations seem like a fine system for all resources affecting yields. In a settlement, the power of stacking is kept in check by three of a kind also requiring three slots. And it's always for one city.

Even military power can work great with settlement allocation of resources: units created in the settlement with the resource get the bonus; units created in other settlements do not. Makes perfect sense and motivates settlement specialization.