Thanks, I will try that one out.
RFC Europe playtesting feedback thread
- Thread starter st.lucifer
- Start date
Thanks, I will try that one out.
You might not have played far enough then because I'm playing the 1.1 version as well and late game they have settlers in almost ever city.
Chep
Emperor
true, as my computer is not the strongest and the game seems to crash more often the later it gets I have yet to play beyond 1650.
If the computer builds many settlers after that then it is stupid and should be fixed but usually shouldn't affect the game too much, or?
gilgames
Priest-King
its somehow does affect the game, 'cause if AI build troops or wonder instead of settler, that might change something....but thats all settler issue, looks to me, like a power-demonstration 
(do you see, stupid player, how much 
capacity i have? Muhahaha)
(do you see, stupid player, how much capacity i have? Muhahaha)
Chep
Emperor
okay, Austria does get a little boring in the late game. I fulfilled the UHVs by ~1600 and now have to wait...well at least I managed to get all but 4 colonies
the only difficulty currently lies in keeping my vassals and not destabilizing them via culture^^
and yeah, the AI really does build settlers when it runs out of useful things to build but mostly it switches from "build research" to "build settlers" from what I've seen.
but researching is sort of fun with Austria. They seem to have some nice basic modifiers and then I have +150-250% research in each city (50% protestantism, 25 each for catholicism+orthodox).
the only difficulty currently lies in keeping my vassals and not destabilizing them via culture^^
and yeah, the AI really does build settlers when it runs out of useful things to build but mostly it switches from "build research" to "build settlers" from what I've seen.
but researching is sort of fun with Austria. They seem to have some nice basic modifiers and then I have +150-250% research in each city (50% protestantism, 25 each for catholicism+orthodox).
rfcfanatic
Mercantilist
Yep, same here. When I played as Austria on Viceroy, I really had to hold myself back in 1700 AD and later in order to avoid Domination victory. I had like +95 stability, but it simply had to go to waste because I struggled to stay below the domination threshold of 25% land area. I tried hard and even gifted away cities, but I "failed" in 1725 AD.
I think that 25% is way too little for Domination. How about increasing it to 50%?
Chep
Emperor
naaa...I think the rules for domination are okay. Usually domination is something you try when you fail your UHV-goals. But then 50% is far too much. 33% might be debatable but I think its still okay the way it is.
But Austria could maybe get a more interesting third UHV. Research everything before XX for example. That would give you an incentive to keep the "Habsburger Reich" small so you don't get the research penalty for having too many cities, while still having a civ that "needs to be played to the end of the mod".
I just tried with Kiev....seems rather tough (played untill 970), but the barbs always come from the same place, so maybe there is a good way to defend. I'll try again, but if anyone has any pointers I'd be glad.
But Austria could maybe get a more interesting third UHV. Research everything before XX for example. That would give you an incentive to keep the "Habsburger Reich" small so you don't get the research penalty for having too many cities, while still having a civ that "needs to be played to the end of the mod".
I just tried with Kiev....seems rather tough (played untill 970), but the barbs always come from the same place, so maybe there is a good way to defend. I'll try again, but if anyone has any pointers I'd be glad.
gilgames
Priest-King
yes i'll give you a box of info about them, when i would have more time , but soon
so:
There are a lil' issue with the names, I'll use what appear in the kievian game.
Settler's location is not a problem, tha land is outstanding everywhere! But you might have some problem, to settle tha map, cover all ress AND fullfill the conquest uhv too. Cities you must take by force are: Kursk-inital army, Minsk might be wisefull take it early or the very end. Smolensk and Novgorod. usually thats it, the war part. The foos stuff aint a problem, if you can guard your lands, but thats a problem!!!!
A usually move 1 settler far east and build a fort and halfdozen spearmen
tha main prob is the catedrals, in you avarage city it takes about 30-40 turns /wo stone, and 10-20 turns /w stone. there is only 1 open stone north of kursk not really close (foreign region)....
All you do in this game is balance workers-settlers-guards!!!! and about that all nonstop barbs are coming from east/south-east. do not forget your land pillaged gives you instability!!!!
The big horde of tatars from 1250-to enf game are fearsome! can be compare to seljuuks, but you rarely have knight till than!!!
Good luck
, but soonso:
There are a lil' issue with the names, I'll use what appear in the kievian game.
Settler's location is not a problem, tha land is outstanding everywhere! But you might have some problem, to settle tha map, cover all ress AND fullfill the conquest uhv too. Cities you must take by force are: Kursk-inital army, Minsk might be wisefull take it early or the very end. Smolensk and Novgorod. usually thats it, the war part. The foos stuff aint a problem, if you can guard your lands, but thats a problem!!!!
A usually move 1 settler far east and build a fort and halfdozen spearmen
tha main prob is the catedrals, in you avarage city it takes about 30-40 turns /wo stone, and 10-20 turns /w stone. there is only 1 open stone north of kursk not really close (foreign region)....
All you do in this game is balance workers-settlers-guards!!!! and about that all nonstop barbs are coming from east/south-east. do not forget your land pillaged gives you instability!!!!
The big horde of tatars from 1250-to enf game are fearsome! can be compare to seljuuks, but you rarely have knight till than!!!
Good luck
Chep
Emperor
I am now in the year 1200 and I think I have almost won.
I encountered a bug though.
I have 9 temples, 2 cathedrals and 8 cloisters (+3 temples and 1-2 cloisters under construction) - but still I fulfilled the "build 3 cathedrals"-uhv already. I mean it wouldnt be much of a problem for me to finish it (I took care not to build one of the cathedrals in my capitol so I can build one there in roughly 10 turns..)
I have the 10 provinces as well and am currently at 13k food with a production of around 250-300/turn (still increasing).
I think the most important thing was to find out that there is one hill where 90+% of the barbs will attack you. (see attached pic) So I posted my inital axemen there and later some spearmen.
My mounted archers went to meet and greet everybody
I think taking Kursk with the inital army is a very good idea, but I didn't do that and got lucky around 1100 or so, when there suddenly was only 1 spearman guarding it -> I still had 1 surviving axeman -> mine
However Nowgorod has walls and strong defenders!
I settled my 3 initals settlers in the Kiew and Podolia Area, the next one north (southern end of the smolensk province) where my 4th starting-archer was already waiting and then my 5th city was the one next to the stone, because I figured I need stone for the walls (and later saw that I need it for the cathedrals as well).
(in the pic the my starting cities are the ones on the left - meaning only the one in the upper right corner was build later)
From there on it was "build 1 spearman, 1 settler, 1 missionary and go build another city" in the main cities and "build worker, temple, walls, cornhouse, cloister" (in this order) in the new cities.
I find the provinces a bit strange...that I'm supposed to settle in unstable regions is okay, but why Rostow and Wologda and not Nishny Novgorod? Or Donasz?
Anyway the provinces I don't have are Novgorod (City with walls and 2 defenders one of which has 2city-defender-promotions), Wologda (too far north and is there any good spot to settle?) and Wolhyn....whatever it's name is. I figured I'd settle a useless city there just before the deadline but then I conquered a city in Rostow so now I'll maybe use it as a backup.
I went straight for "wood-chopping" (after trading my initial techs with Byzantium for all the basics ) and then knights (reached them around 1170).
I like the UU, even if I only used 1 of them before moving on to knights, but the UB seems useless. I mean it is a nice building...but you never have the time to build one -.-
I'm now preparing for the mongol onslaught and expanding to meet the food goal without difficulties
But I think that hill really was the important factor for me.
edit: stability...well I only started to care once I build city nr 10 or so, until then I hadn't build any stability-buildings so now I usually could build the manors (?) in 3-4 turns in my bigger cities -> stability so far is no problem..but I'll go and build some just to make sure, yeah
I encountered a bug though.
I have 9 temples, 2 cathedrals and 8 cloisters (+3 temples and 1-2 cloisters under construction) - but still I fulfilled the "build 3 cathedrals"-uhv already. I mean it wouldnt be much of a problem for me to finish it (I took care not to build one of the cathedrals in my capitol so I can build one there in roughly 10 turns..)
I have the 10 provinces as well and am currently at 13k food with a production of around 250-300/turn (still increasing).
I think the most important thing was to find out that there is one hill where 90+% of the barbs will attack you. (see attached pic) So I posted my inital axemen there and later some spearmen.
My mounted archers went to meet and greet everybody
I think taking Kursk with the inital army is a very good idea, but I didn't do that and got lucky around 1100 or so, when there suddenly was only 1 spearman guarding it -> I still had 1 surviving axeman -> mine
However Nowgorod has walls and strong defenders!
I settled my 3 initals settlers in the Kiew and Podolia Area, the next one north (southern end of the smolensk province) where my 4th starting-archer was already waiting and then my 5th city was the one next to the stone, because I figured I need stone for the walls (and later saw that I need it for the cathedrals as well).
(in the pic the my starting cities are the ones on the left - meaning only the one in the upper right corner was build later)
From there on it was "build 1 spearman, 1 settler, 1 missionary and go build another city" in the main cities and "build worker, temple, walls, cornhouse, cloister" (in this order) in the new cities.
I find the provinces a bit strange...that I'm supposed to settle in unstable regions is okay, but why Rostow and Wologda and not Nishny Novgorod? Or Donasz?
Anyway the provinces I don't have are Novgorod (City with walls and 2 defenders one of which has 2city-defender-promotions), Wologda (too far north and is there any good spot to settle?) and Wolhyn....whatever it's name is. I figured I'd settle a useless city there just before the deadline but then I conquered a city in Rostow so now I'll maybe use it as a backup.
I went straight for "wood-chopping" (after trading my initial techs with Byzantium for all the basics
) and then knights (reached them around 1170).I like the UU, even if I only used 1 of them before moving on to knights, but the UB seems useless. I mean it is a nice building...but you never have the time to build one -.-
I'm now preparing for the mongol onslaught and expanding to meet the food goal without difficulties
But I think that hill really was the important factor for me.
edit: stability...well I only started to care once I build city nr 10 or so, until then I hadn't build any stability-buildings so now I usually could build the manors (?) in 3-4 turns in my bigger cities -> stability so far is no problem..but I'll go and build some just to make sure, yeah
gilgames
Priest-King
Its really strange indeed and lucky too. Maybe I shouldnt move to far east, to stop barbs ahead. your deffendibg hill, used to be my center spot of my emipre and i usually build a def city near the iron! S-E of kursk. Aside I warn you These mongols are not the same whom appear in poland or hungary or in bulgaria, they just keep coming!! And will come from 2 location: 1 is Serkel, 2 is N-E of Kursk...
You can have lots of knights, but they must regain str. somewhere and defend the improvements too. so do something with your east border, or they might cause some problem too. If you truly have the power to stop them, a few reload can bring you the victory
ps: anyway inpressive game
and lucky too. Maybe I shouldnt move to far east, to stop barbs ahead. your deffendibg hill, used to be my center spot of my emipre and i usually build a def city near the iron! S-E of kursk. Aside I warn you These mongols are not the same whom appear in poland or hungary or in bulgaria, they just keep coming!! And will come from 2 location: 1 is Serkel, 2 is N-E of Kursk...You can have lots of knights, but they must regain str. somewhere and defend the improvements too. so do something with your east border, or they might cause some problem too. If you truly have the power to stop them, a few reload can bring you the victory
ps: anyway inpressive game
Chep
Emperor
okay I just won
I reached the 20k food in 1263 so I only had to survive until 1290 for UHV3.
I had 5-6 knights ready when the mongols first appeared and all my cities had walls plus I had the wonder that gives +25% city defence. Still it was sometimes close during the first few turns and the mongols took my city in Donasz (which joined me 5 turns later only to be immediately reconquered by the mongols^^).
stability wasn't really a problem since my golden age started around the time the mongols really caused damage -> always around +10-15
but one problem were those pesky Lituanians. They settled a city in Minsk! (stealing me one of my 10 provinces) So I had do declare war on them @ ~1275 -.-
fun game, a really close call sometimes, definitely one of the harder ones since you only have a short time period for everything.
I'd still recommend thinking about buffing them a little (maybe give Kursk only 1 archer instead of 2 and reduce the inital barb spawn (880-1050) a little).
If it weren't for the bug with the cathedral I might have had more problems since this allowed me to build 1-2 more knights before the mongols appeared...
edit:
which iron do you mean? The one were I drew the red circle? Thats where almost 50% of all keshiks attacked...unfortunately it was one of my later cities (so only walls no castle) but still...nice defensible position.
the orange circle is where i build my last city, which was the one taken by the mongols. close to the iron in the north there also appeared keshiks but rarely more than 2 per turn.
unfortunately I didn't manage to score the no1 spot from Byzantium
I reached the 20k food in 1263 so I only had to survive until 1290 for UHV3.
I had 5-6 knights ready when the mongols first appeared and all my cities had walls plus I had the wonder that gives +25% city defence. Still it was sometimes close during the first few turns and the mongols took my city in Donasz (which joined me 5 turns later only to be immediately reconquered by the mongols^^).
stability wasn't really a problem since my golden age started around the time the mongols really caused damage -> always around +10-15
but one problem were those pesky Lituanians. They settled a city in Minsk! (stealing me one of my 10 provinces) So I had do declare war on them @ ~1275 -.-
fun game, a really close call sometimes, definitely one of the harder ones since you only have a short time period for everything.
I'd still recommend thinking about buffing them a little (maybe give Kursk only 1 archer instead of 2 and reduce the inital barb spawn (880-1050) a little).
If it weren't for the bug with the cathedral I might have had more problems since this allowed me to build 1-2 more knights before the mongols appeared...
edit:
which iron do you mean? The one were I drew the red circle? Thats where almost 50% of all keshiks attacked...unfortunately it was one of my later cities (so only walls no castle) but still...nice defensible position.
the orange circle is where i build my last city, which was the one taken by the mongols. close to the iron in the north there also appeared keshiks but rarely more than 2 per turn.
unfortunately I didn't manage to score the no1 spot from Byzantium
Chep
Emperor
I'm trying Lituania now.
So far I'm more annoyed than entertained by them. Whats the point of forcing me to produce nothing but culture for 60+ years while I get hit by a plague and mongolian hordes? I reached 2035 culture in 1383^^
but unlike the close limits with Kiev it never seemed fun (yay, press enter once more and hope no Keshiks appear...yay, repeat...)
I think the last 2 UHVs are easy now, but still it feels weird. Why not let Lituania start with less units or something. Why force this...passiveness?
also...the AI seemed strange. When producing culture the governor assigned people to tiles where they only produce 2 food while there were still unused forest tiles (2food + 1 shield) - almost as if it were trying to avoid producing culture -.-
edit: found another bug:
I researched Printing Press in 1500 with Lituania, but didn't found Protestantism (religious advisor says "not founded" I even ran state religion so I could move to Protestantism now ).
edit2: I gifted it to my vassals....apparently you have to be catholic to found it. why?
edit3: I won, okay the culture-part is the only difficult thing about Lituania, still...
So far I'm more annoyed than entertained by them. Whats the point of forcing me to produce nothing but culture for 60+ years while I get hit by a plague and mongolian hordes? I reached 2035 culture in 1383^^
but unlike the close limits with Kiev it never seemed fun (yay, press enter once more and hope no Keshiks appear...yay, repeat...)
I think the last 2 UHVs are easy now, but still it feels weird. Why not let Lituania start with less units or something. Why force this...passiveness?
also...the AI seemed strange. When producing culture the governor assigned people to tiles where they only produce 2 food while there were still unused forest tiles (2food + 1 shield) - almost as if it were trying to avoid producing culture -.-
edit: found another bug:
I researched Printing Press in 1500 with Lituania, but didn't found Protestantism (religious advisor says "not founded" I even ran state religion so I could move to Protestantism now
).edit2: I gifted it to my vassals....apparently you have to be catholic to found it. why?
edit3: I won, okay the culture-part is the only difficult thing about Lituania, still...
Chep
Emperor
well but then there should be an info somewhere. I mean I had catholicism in at least half of my cities.
Why is it so implausible that the reformers fled to some non-catholic nation before advertising their interpretation of the bible? Or if there is a catholic city within that nation, why is it impossible that Luther & co were born there?
Again...not a problem if you know what to expect but bad information within the game. (because then I'd just switch to catholicism shortly before I finish researching the printing press).
Why is it so implausible that the reformers fled to some non-catholic nation before advertising their interpretation of the bible? Or if there is a catholic city within that nation, why is it impossible that Luther & co were born there?
Again...not a problem if you know what to expect but bad information within the game. (because then I'd just switch to catholicism shortly before I finish researching the printing press).
The UHV for Kiev is 2 cathedrals and not three.
I tried Kiev and I had no idea what to expect when the mongols came. Did not look nice. I should have build more settlers and gotten stone earlier. I think domination victory should be pretty easy for Kiev. If I had not spend 3000 hammer on religious building I would have no problems with the mongols.
I tried Kiev and I had no idea what to expect when the mongols came. Did not look nice. I should have build more settlers and gotten stone earlier. I think domination victory should be pretty easy for Kiev. If I had not spend 3000 hammer on religious building I would have no problems with the mongols.
Chep
Emperor
thank you, another mistake in the German translation found. Next time I'll just check the xml-files before I chose another civ to get the real goals, why was I so stupid to install the game in German instead of English? -.-
About Kiev: Yes, it is rather difficult and yes, you have to know what to expect. I did and it still almost overwhelmed me. I think the stone is essential (or you go for Knights and somehow get 15+ before the Keshiks appear so you can always be the one on the offensive...).
You 'll probably lose some cities to Moscow in 1380 and also Lituania will try to attack you, but yeah, domination should be possible. But I only really care for the UHV
You get some sort of warning in the initial "welcome screen" which talks about a dream of endless hordes coming from the east but a general warning as I've suggested a few times before a couple of turns before the mongol spawn would be nice.
As I said you hardly have time to build any buildings except the religious ones and some walls (+ barracks&stables in your production-heavy cities).
I really recommend beelining for woodchopping and then knights. The chopping helps with the production of the buildings and gives you additional resources while combat2-knights are pretty effective against keshiks (85% chance of winning).
I sold some ressources to the Byzantines, French and Arabs for money in the early game to keep my research at 100% until I had the knights. via trading you should get all the other techs you might need. (Byzantium gives you 4-6 for your inital horseback-riding or whatever its called on the first turn. I paid them some gold to include feudalism so I could switch all civics immediately.)
and finding out where the barbs will attack a stationed unit gives you the possibility to focus on expansion early on. put 2 units on a hill where they often appear and attack and give one the healer promotion and the other one hill-defense (if you find a forest-tile where they attack instead of moving past you, even better)
About Kiev: Yes, it is rather difficult and yes, you have to know what to expect. I did and it still almost overwhelmed me. I think the stone is essential (or you go for Knights and somehow get 15+ before the Keshiks appear so you can always be the one on the offensive...).
You 'll probably lose some cities to Moscow in 1380 and also Lituania will try to attack you, but yeah, domination should be possible. But I only really care for the UHV
You get some sort of warning in the initial "welcome screen" which talks about a dream of endless hordes coming from the east but a general warning as I've suggested a few times before a couple of turns before the mongol spawn would be nice.
As I said you hardly have time to build any buildings except the religious ones and some walls (+ barracks&stables in your production-heavy cities).
I really recommend beelining for woodchopping and then knights. The chopping helps with the production of the buildings and gives you additional resources while combat2-knights are pretty effective against keshiks (85% chance of winning).
I sold some ressources to the Byzantines, French and Arabs for money in the early game to keep my research at 100% until I had the knights. via trading you should get all the other techs you might need. (Byzantium gives you 4-6 for your inital horseback-riding or whatever its called on the first turn. I paid them some gold to include feudalism so I could switch all civics immediately.)
and finding out where the barbs will attack a stationed unit gives you the possibility to focus on expansion early on. put 2 units on a hill where they often appear and attack and give one the healer promotion and the other one hill-defense (if you find a forest-tile where they attack instead of moving past you, even better)
Chep
Emperor
@ezzlar & adrien: the tech description says "the first one to discover founds protestantism". That needs to be corrected. Yes it is really rare that someone not catholic will found it, but I think there are ways to argue on behalf of both solutions, it just should be clear what the status quo is so as not to get disappointed because the game behaves differently from whats advertised.
gilgames
Priest-King
I told you had a lucky game, due to the tach trades, for me they want to trade for nonsense deals only!!!! and YES i put my def city exactly there and spam unit aournd them... but they still used to bypass me and pillage what they can....
if you read the deep-help infos you can find this protstantism stuff there with exact requirements. also not easy to find it! oh and pls junk your german versionDDDDD
ps: you getting better than me, scroll back a few pages and read my Lithuania post, among others. it was very instresting to me even on viceroy :/
and spam unit aournd them... but they still used to bypass me and pillage what they can....if you read the deep-help infos you can find this protstantism stuff there with exact requirements. also not easy to find it! oh and pls junk your german version
DDDDDps: you getting better than me, scroll back a few pages and read my Lithuania post, among others. it was very instresting to me
even on viceroy :/
Chep
Emperor
yes, if Byzantium has already researched the "horsebackriding"-tech then you'll have a harder time trading when playing as Kiev.
And of course the barbs pillage. but that never really bothered me. I just lowered the tech research by 10-20% and bought some of the luxury res from the AI vs money.
I just went and gave Arabia another try. Have they been changed in the SVN-version? Because I stopped playing around 870 when there appeared 2-3 Ghazi + 1-5 mounted archers in Arabia each turn.
Okay UHV1 has to be some sort of "challenge" but...meh..it didn't really like it. The barbs cut my empire in half by separating Alexandria from Jerusalem. Also I feel like this is one of those "supposed to do things this way"-games. Is it better to try and take over a large part of the Byzantine Empire or just the 1-2 cities to the north of your starting position + north Africa (Alexandria and that useless city...)? I feel like I could reach ~25% spread of Islam around 800, or is it possible to get to 35 early on?
The arabs have this cool building that gives 100% research but then you always have to build units so you never get to use it, what's the point here?
If Arabia and France have been changed as well as Cordoba in the SVN-version I'll probably go through the hassle of figuring that stuff out to install it. At the moment France seems to be "either fullfill UHV 1 by doing exactly this and then that (and by having luck with the barbs) and you have won the game OR simply expand and dominate the world". If there's (almost) no error margin in the French game...blech..
About this "deep-help" what is it and where can I find it?
And about Lituania: I razed both cities above Kiev (Smolensk and the other one) before the start of Moscow, so they had less cities and I just had to build up some army and stability before going after them. Also: The mercs you get are awesome (light cavalry that does collateral damage), use them.
How can I change the language of my civ4 - do I need to reinstall everything? Or is there some settings file somewhere where I just have to change a variable?
And of course the barbs pillage. but that never really bothered me. I just lowered the tech research by 10-20% and bought some of the luxury res from the AI vs money.
I just went and gave Arabia another try. Have they been changed in the SVN-version? Because I stopped playing around 870 when there appeared 2-3 Ghazi + 1-5 mounted archers in Arabia each turn.
Okay UHV1 has to be some sort of "challenge" but...meh..it didn't really like it. The barbs cut my empire in half by separating Alexandria from Jerusalem. Also I feel like this is one of those "supposed to do things this way"-games. Is it better to try and take over a large part of the Byzantine Empire or just the 1-2 cities to the north of your starting position + north Africa (Alexandria and that useless city...)? I feel like I could reach ~25% spread of Islam around 800, or is it possible to get to 35 early on?
The arabs have this cool building that gives 100% research but then you always have to build units so you never get to use it, what's the point here?
If Arabia and France have been changed as well as Cordoba in the SVN-version I'll probably go through the hassle of figuring that stuff out to install it. At the moment France seems to be "either fullfill UHV 1 by doing exactly this and then that (and by having luck with the barbs) and you have won the game OR simply expand and dominate the world". If there's (almost) no error margin in the French game...blech..
About this "deep-help" what is it and where can I find it?
And about Lituania: I razed both cities above Kiev (Smolensk and the other one) before the start of Moscow, so they had less cities and I just had to build up some army and stability before going after them. Also: The mercs you get are awesome (light cavalry that does collateral damage), use them.
How can I change the language of my civ4 - do I need to reinstall everything? Or is there some settings file somewhere where I just have to change a variable?
