Discussion in 'Civ4 - Creation & Customization' started by Rhye, Mar 18, 2006.
I like the idea - but perhaps it could be implemented into the extended version, based upon Warlords
No, I think that it must change.
I don't like the current completely automatic approach. (Though I don't really like that Hinduist Egypt all the times)
For now I see 3 solutions but I'm sure we can refine them:
1. How it was before the change: semi-automatic. Religions will be born automatically in certain turns, but if one player arrives first, it founds it. It would need some AI tweak, if possible, to drive some AI to some techs in particular.
2. First to discover a technology doesn't found the specific religion of the tech (Islam=Divine Right etc.), but another one appropriate to its location. So, if China arrives first to Monotheism, will found Confucianism anyway.
3. 1+2 combined.
I would like the multiple holy cities idea but I find it very difficult to implement. We'll see...
For now, here's v065.
Big balancement changes this time:
- Added population bonus and improvements upgrade speed modifiers
- Plains graphics slightly changed
- Added free buildings for late starts: USA in particular will benefit from this change
- Limitations for ancient wonders production by late starting civs set active
- Updated some founding areas to fix japanese settlers spam
- Reduced settler production weight in city AI for Egypt, Japan and Aztecs, increased for some European powers after Astronomy
- Barbarians warriors can’t appear on partially impassable terrains anymore
- Slightly reduced amount of some starting units
- Shrines can produce max 20 commerce. This way Arabia will be a little less rich (being Christianity so widespread, its income was huge)
- Aggressive AI game option enabled
- Tuned some modifiers
- Hinduism and Taoism founding bug really fixed this time
- Removed multiple new era splash screens
- Jungle can be mined with just Bronze Working
- Improved Incan terrain
- Removed some jungle in Brazil and Papua
- Removed some food from Japan, China, Egypt and Arabia
- Removed some flood plains from Egypt
- First 6 city name maps updated by Red Threat
- City rename correspondances expanded
I think 1+2 combined will be the best solution ATM. With the new restriction on commerce produced by shrines, multpile shrines sound even more attractive to me, but I guess it is up to you.
I like the idea of combining 1 and 2 if it can be made to work.
What food is being reduced from Arabia? I was unable to get Mecca very large the last time I played. In terms of Japan, i think that the food recourses are necessary if the player intends to put 6 cities on the Japanese home island. I do agree though that China can get too big (strange since it hasn't been at the top of my leader board in awhile)
In my current game as Mongolia (a switch from an English start), China is barbarian. My Keshik are driving into Chinese lands, but it is fun to be at constant war! Since I cannot negotiate with the barbs, I am building a huge military to defeat the menace. It is also interesting that since the Mongols started with Guilds I was able to be the worlds tech broker giving Guilds to Europe in exchange for the much needed techs to catch up, which in turn is helping me to move up the leader board.
Arabia is HUGE, as they destroyed the Persians and the Indians. The Greeks and Romans have a huge presence in the middle east still, and Christianity is the religion of Europe. Spain remains Islamic.
Rhye, will you remove the peaks that block South America from Central America, and some that isolate the Incas? They were there in the first place to limit the Incan growth and to prevent the Aztecs from going south, but perhaps with the new directed Settler AI they are not necesary anymore...
barak -> version?
elhoim -> why do you want to remove them?
062. posted that before i saw that you posted version 065
View attachment 129220
View attachment 129221
these are two pictures illustrating the "black hole syndrome" that the map has. i dont think anyone has noticed the one in Hudson Bay before- i'm not sure.
Rhye, there is a mod somewhere that makes religions founded not by techs, but by great prophets, would this work for the mod? I would say a mix between this and #2 would be best.
thank you, but I've solved the problems with just solution #1 and I'm proud of the results so far
In my last test:
Hinduism founded in 2550BC in Delhi (India)
Taoism founded in 1950BC in Beijing (China)
Buddhism founded in 1500BC in Viskhapatnam (India)
Confucianism founded in 975BC in Nanchang (China)
Judaism founded in 825BC in (Egypt)
Christianity founded in 30AD in Mediolanum (Rome)
Islam founded in 620AD in Mecca (Arabian)
all of this, with no automatic interference. Just tweaking AI preferences.
The only programmed thing is that Arabia is born with Divine Right, but if someone discovers it first, it can found Islam.
I will just re-add automatic scripts for Judaism and Christianity in Jerusalem, because barbarian cities otherwise have no chance of founding that religion through research. But they won't contain static dates (let's say that a random turn between 30AD and 300AD will trigger the Christianity script if it hasn't been founded yet).
Hope everyone's happy now!
well it's just a gulf syndrome. The mediterranean and the hudson bay are made that way
I think that is a good system Rhye.
Great! I'll be checking out USA soon; the Aztecs were annoying, barbs easily dispatched with my cannons of doom.
Let's see how Arabia does now, although this will limit the other religions' power, as well. I see the reasoning; Islam almost ALWAYS spreads more than the eastern religions anyway. I'll test anything once (or 12+ times )!
This will make India and Inca more interesting to play as! I'm a fan of India, ya know. Also a fan of losing badly, so Inca will be fun, haha.
Spain seems to have a lot of food early on, but I haven't played them yet. Looking good! Playing...
Sweet! Religions are my thing. You're the king, Rhye.
that's a shame...but never mind.
your mod is still the best out there.
Even tough geographically they are quite correct ( http://www.geographicguide.com/south-america/map.jpg ), those areas were not completly isolated. Right now there are roads over those regions (red lines in the maps) and in the age of discovery, in the Incan area was the Virreynato del Perú, from were roads parted to the south cities in Chile and Argentina, and this was in the 1500s and 1600s, so they were not using modern techniques to build the roads. This are all realism reasons, but from the gameplay perspective I could argue that is kinda annoying to move troops to a transport everytime I want to go from SA to CA.
It would be nice if the mountain in the border of Panamá and Colombia is replaced with a hill, and some passes added to the Incan area, most especially to the south.
i agree with him. i'm sure people go to worldbuilder and make these changes when they start a game anyway. maybe you could let roads and railroads be built over mountains when you learn a technology?
I thinks it is VERY difficult, as new graphics and road algorithm must be made, as well as conflicts with the terrain tipes, as I think that peaks are completly impassable for all units, and that´s not changeable, I think.
Personally I like impassable peaks, as they give a nice strategic layer with passes that must be defended. All roads would clutter the map a lot, and lots of roads through mountains are not common. For example, in the map linked in my previous post, there are only four passes across the Andes between Chile and Argentina, and that´s because there were natural valleys there. Most of the mountanious terrain there is impassable.
Thanks for supporting my idea!
Well, I added 2nd starts in version .60 for Egypt, India, China, Greece, and Persia. I recognize having the full number of civs is not conducive to later gameplay and turn waits, but I figure it could eventually be an option or simply my own personal mod of this mod.
I uploaded the RiseAndFall file which I updated. If anybody wants to look at it and give some pointers feel free. Remeber to back up your file (I'm sure a new version will replace it anyway) although the added lines are easily commented out.
crayton -> compliments, you've managed to understand the complicate paths of my mind!
Unfortunately your version of the file is out of date: why don't you mark your changes with your name, it would be easier to keep it updated with the main mod.
elhoim -> I will try to open a couple of passages, but if I see them colonizing zones that should be kept empty for the Spanish arrival, I'll reclose them.
Separate names with a comma.