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[BNW] Rhye's Catapult 2020-06-02

now a question for everyone:
what can be each civ's "mission"?
My aim is to customise the scores and assign "Role Playing Victories". It's similar to historical victories, but rather than being strictly 3 conditions, it's more flexible and integrated.
The Aztecs could win by adding to their score a bonus for each enemy unit killed, for example. What about the others? Feel free to throw in you ideas.
I already wrote something for China in your Facebook post but seeing your post here on the forum clears it up a bit so I wanted to clarify and refine my idea for a potential China mission:

China gains score (100, 200, 500) for each city within its borders with its religion as majority religion at population milestones (10,20,30) and half score for every city outside its borders following its religion that reaches population milestones (50, 100, 200). For the same reasons I stated in the Facebook post, this should reflect China's historical position as a regional hegemon, militarily, politically, ideologically. This should also steer China to want to have a large, heavily populated empire, and really weigh the cost-benefit dichotomy of going to war when it can also win with peaceful means. It can seek to spread its hegemonic culture overseas like the Tang with Heian Japan, or it could seek to militarily dominate a region like the Tang expansion into Central Asia.
 
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now a question for everyone:
what can be each civ's "mission"?
My aim is to customise the scores and assign "Role Playing Victories". It's similar to historical victories, but rather than being strictly 3 conditions, it's more flexible and integrated.
The Aztecs could win by adding to their score a bonus for each enemy unit killed, for example. What about the others? Feel free to throw in you ideas.
First of all, I want to thank you for the wonderful RFC mod, and wish you success in further development !!!

The idea is this. Let's say each civilization needs to score, let's say, 500 points. On the example of the Aztecs. 1) For each killed unit 1 point. 2) For each unit sacrificed 2 points (if such is planned). 3) For each city on the continent without religion 10 points.

P.S. Perhaps it is worth adding the opposite effect, for each unit lost in battle, for the Aztecs, minus 1 point, the same applies to cities
 
now a question for everyone:
what can be each civ's "mission"?
My aim is to customise the scores and assign "Role Playing Victories". It's similar to historical victories, but rather than being strictly 3 conditions, it's more flexible and integrated.
The Aztecs could win by adding to their score a bonus for each enemy unit killed, for example. What about the others? Feel free to throw in you ideas.
Regarding new ideas. I'll take Russia.
1) For each railroad tile 1 point. 2) for each impassable area and tundra 1 point. 3) And for each space module built 20 points.
P.S. Naturally, everything requires balancing and adjustment.
 
In Civilization 4's RFC, there was an event known as the "Conqueror" which I presume was the event referencing the New World Colonization period by the Europeans.

In Civ 4 RFC, this was triggered by the first European nation to meet any of the New World nations. Which would trigger plague in the new world and spawn units for the European to "take over" the new world.
Not just European!
I saw it happening with Japan as well! Was awesome!!!
I think even Arabia once.
(although the Dutch were the best at it)
 
Hi Rhye,

I just discovered this thread, after your announcement here, I was just watching that other thread waiting for the release of the mod. Now I read this whole thread and I'm ready to test your mod, I've just re-installed Civ V.
Do you need help on something in particular? testing?

I have some time right now so let me know
With all the thousands of hours enjoying Civ 4 RFC I owe you that much :)

Cheers

PS: if you want to attract Civ 6 players, maybe reply here
 
2. city states don't seem to use workers unless you save and reload the game. This is a bug I couldn't solve, and as a slightly less worse solution, I've set city states not to produce workers.

If this possibility remains, then it's not that big of an issue:

upload_2021-3-10_10-54-31.png


Can we use our workers to enhance their tiles? (it's the case in civ 6 if you are suzerain of the CS)
 
Hello Rhye, long time. Sorry for my answer is late, didn't have time to play again. Actually, it's also you fault, for not letting us test new versions of your mod ;).
1. Viking missions:
Raiders - points for every pillaged improvent, additoinal point for every captured worker or settler, plunderd caravan or born greate general.
Colonizers - points for every city, captured or founded outside Scandinavia on Atlantic, Baltic, Meditteranian or Black sea cost. Additional point for every city in England and America. Additional points for beeing first, who found a city in America.
Traders - for every trade route, sent to a city in Asia, Constantinople includet. (I don't know, how long are trade routs in your game now, so may be you can make a time limit here, so it wouldn't be too easy to achive it in late game). Points for every turn beeng first in traded goods in demografics. (when your check demografics tab, you can see which player is first in solders, litracy, manufactured goods and so on). Additional points for every great merchant.
2. Japan missions:
Bushido: points, for every turn, player is first in culture, or/and in faith or/and in demografics in solders. Additional points for every great prophet or great general.
Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere: points for every city, controled in East Asia outside Japan, on a pacific island, in Australia, India or in America.
Economic wonder: for every turn, beeng first in demografics in litracy and manufactured goods. Additional point for every great scientist or great engineer.
3. England missions:
Sun never sets: for every city, found outside Europe. Additional points for controlling a city in India, Suets and Panama canals. Aditional points for every great admiral.
Factory of the world: for every turn, beeng first in demograics in traded goods and manufactured goods. Additional points for every great trader or great engineer.
Motherland of Newton: additional points for every technology, discovered first and for every great scientist.
Actually, if player would achive those goals, he will win anyway.
Tell me, is it helpful? I can do more.
Also, if you don't mind, a couple of suggestions:
1. Rocky mountains are too rocky. The only way from California to the East Coast is in Canada or in Mexico. Also, there are a couple of tiles, workers cann't reach becouse of mountains, espeсially coal tile in Canada. And settlers cann't travel there anyway becouse of the desert. And it would be nice to have a northen passage through Himalayan from Afganistan, where Alexander came to India.
2. Could you change places of some tecnologies? I find it stupid, when I get atomic bomb before buttleships and carriers. Could you move Electronics to the place of Radar, Radar move to the place of Nuclear Fisics, and Nuclerar Fisics move where Electronics is now, please, if it's not too hard.
3. It would be realy nice to have more religious belives. Firaxis made just a few realy usefull belives. It's not a problem on a small map, when everyone appears at the same time, you just compet for religious bonuses. But, in your mod, when early civs pick all the usefull belives, it makes no sense to found a religion for a late civ. But AI still founds useless religions. May be you could just duplicate all belives, and duplicate religious buildings several times, and we will find new names for them? That could be the easiest way to fix the religions problem.
4. Could you make a canal improvement? Just like in this mod, only script their appearances in Suets, Panama and Bosphorus, becouse AI may not build them. This improvement could also give gold.
5. Would it be possible, to give a scientific bonus for having few cities, so small civs could catch up the big one? You can do it with trade routs. Now, when you send a caravan to a city of another civ, you get a scientific bonus, if that civ is ahead of you in science. Just multiply that bonus by 20? and divide it by a civs cities number or civs population number. And than multiply it by 2 or 4 during the golden age, to simulate a time of fast modernization, that happend in Japan or Russion history, like Meiji restoration. Becouse sometimes it's just boring to play, when big civs are going much further, than small. Remember, in Civ IV that was fixed by a penalty for having many cities, so small cives were sometimes far more advance, than big?
6. Could you please remove combat penalty for strategic resourse shortages for units? It gives you 50% combat penalty, when you use more strategic resourses, than have. I think, barbarians don't get this penalty. This makes new civs very weak, becouse they swordsmen and horsmen can't fight properly, while they are improving their strategic resourses. It also makes useless strategic resourses trade. Imagine, you bought some iron from your neighbour, made some swordsmen, and then your neighbour declares war on you, and you swordsmen worth nothing. It also weakens small cives, that don't have much strategic resourses, so they cann't fight with big one.
7. And I also been thinking about rivers as a roads. May be it make sence to make a hidden free-maintenance road on a tiles with river? With no bridges, of course, if its possible. Or only on one side of a river. Becouse, in Russia, for example, in some Siberian places only road you can use is still just a river.
8. Would it be possible to force European AI to colonize the New World? Sometimes, they just don't. May be you will give them some Liberty policies on start, so they would more willingly build settlers?

Sorry, for beeing such bothersome, eager to see your new mod.
Thank you.
 
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Thank you for your input!
I have to apologise for posting so few updates recently.
In fact, I am overwhelmed by work, and I am trying hard to dedicate at least a few hours per week.

Regarding the most recent progress, most of my effort went into fixing bugs that were reported by some tests, rather than advancing on new features.

Here is the most recent progress track:
• Autoplay mechanism: 100%
• Civs roster and minor civs: 100%
• Advanced autoplay start: 100%
• Civs rotation (>22 civs): 100%
• Rise mechanism: 100%
• Collapse mechanism: 100%
• Respawn mechanism: 100%
• Rule changes: 100%
• Tech tree revision: 100%
• Settlers maps: 100%
• Settlers map manager: 100%
• City names maps: 100%
• City renames: 100%
• Icons: 100%
• War/peace status: 100%
• Plague: 100%.
• Rebel factions: 100%
• Integration with smart AI: 100%
• Yield manager: 100%
• Stability: 70%
• Stability advisor: 70%
• New natural wonders: 100%
• Extended timeline: 100%
• Victories: 10%
• Revised civ unique abilities: 10%
• New World events: 0%
• Victory events: 0%
• Popups with options at a neighbour civ’s spawn: 0%
• Dawn of man descriptions: 0%
 
Dear all and, especially, dear Rhye,
Thank you so much for this news. I'm a great fan of RFC, and I recurrently come back to RFC, RFC-DOC, RFC-Europe, RFC-Greek World, and even the RFC boardgame. But I've been loosing my interest on civ series due to lack of an hexagon-based Rhye's mod or somehting simmilar. The developments you have been presenting here over the past 12 months are something amazing, it is a 10 year old dream come true. I hope the development is going well.

Unfortunately I only noticed this mod a few days ago (as I commented, I did loose my hope on civ series... until now), so maybe i'm arriving a bit late to the testing party...

In any case, could you please explain how to does the civ rotation system works and which civs are present on the game?
Thank you very much, keep on the amazing work!
 
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Manifest for a Civilization-Themed MOBA Game

Dear Rhye

There comes a manifest for a Civilization-Theme MOBA Game.
Read carefully and search on web if you has any doubt.

In Sid Meier’s Civilization V, we have technology as main restriction to get buildings, resources, units, wonders, improvements and more technology.
To get most of modern things, you need to secure resources through exploration and expansion, need to do warfare to put yourself on a winning position through exploitation and extermination (the 4X genre), all of these are accomplished by producing units, buildings, unique units, unique buildings, national wonders, world wonders, spaceship projects, settling new cities, improving terrain and doing espionage/warfare.

In Sid Meier's Civilization V, there are multiple paths to win.
Domination: occupy all other civilizations capitals.
Diplomacy: be elected as world leader at United Nations.
Science: reach Alpha Centauri first.
Culture: be influential in all other civilizations.
Time: have highest score after 2050 A.D.

In DotA, each hero has 3 main stats, which they are Strength, Agility and Intelligence, one of them are chosen as main for boost attack damage, while Strength boost health and hp regen, Agility boost attack speed and armor, Intelligence boost mana and mp regen.
Each hero has its unique set of skills, some are active and some are passive, and can use same items as everyone else, items are adquired by gold or on neutral creep kill, levels are adquired by experience, both gold and experience are adquired on anything kill, except deny.

Sid Meier’s Civilization is Turn Based Strategy, belonging to 4X domain, and DotA is Real Time Strategy, belonging to MOBA domain.

List of suggestions for a fusioned game:

0→ Each hero is a historical character, from any Civilization available in Civilization V.
1→ Each Civilization should be automatized, and each player only control their own hero, as happens in DotA.
2→ Each hero unique set of skills should be unique replacements for skills that everyone access, meaning that hero access their uniques while other heroes access the generics versions.
3→ Each hero unique set of items should be unique replacements for items that everyone access, meaning that hero access their uniques while other heroes access the generics versions.
4→ Each hero unique set of powers should be unique replacements for powers that everyone access, meaning that hero access their uniques while other heroes access the generics versions.
5→ Combat should be a minor component to gain resources and experience, restricted as Scavenged Resources and Combat Experience, and to get most of Resources and Experience offered by game content you’d better not being fighting at all.
6→ Culture, Research, Espionage, Mapping, Farming, Hunter-Gathering, Building and Crafting Experience does not come from combat and they are all useful for your team economy on Peace time.
7→ Combat Experience is tied for each Weapon Category and/or for each Element Spell Category and/or for each Armor Category and/or for each Divinity Spell Category, this way a hero who uses a Sword can never gain Combat Experience for Rifling Combat.
8→ Multiple Victory conditions, as happens in Civilization V, within a Real Time Strategy game, as happens in DotA.
9→ (Optional) Support to Procedural Map Generation, as happens in Civilization V, so players can never memorize map for tune their strategy, as frequently happens in DotA.
A→ No more Sword winning a Gun fight.
B→ Roles are much more fluid in this suggested game than they are on DotA, as you may adapt your strategy on fly by changing your equipment, and by consequence changing your current skillset aswell.
C→ Multiple types of currency, most of them are only gathered on Peace time.
D→ Instead of 3 Stats for everyone, as happens on DotA, each hero should have 1 Unique Ability, as happens on Civilization V.
E→ Heroes dying in combat should not respawn, unlike happens in DotA, to prevent griefers from complaining too much about teamates dying frequently or trolling about it.
F→ The world is quite mythological but the mythology in that world is based on every Historical Civilization V culture, expect dealing with Ares when Greeks are at game or with Hanuman when Indian are at game.

I hope you get this post as an advise to seek how to create your own historical version of Civilization V when partialy fusioned with MOBA genre.

By the way, nice job on your mod. I hope you have success with it, and with this another mod i've just suggested.
 
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Dear all and, especially, dear Rhye,
Thank you so much for this news. I'm a great fan of RFC, and I recurrently come back to RFC, RFC-DOC, RFC-Europe, RFC-Greek World, and even the RFC boardgame. But I've been loosing my interest on civ series due to lack of an hexagon-based Rhye's mod or somehting simmilar. The developments you have been presenting here over the past 12 months are something amazing, it is a 10 year old dream come true. I hope the development is going well.

Unfortunately I only noticed this mod a few days ago (as I commented, I did loose my hope on civ series... until now), so maybe i'm arriving a bit late to the testing party...

In any case, could you please explain how to does the civ rotation system works and which civs are present on the game?
Thank you very much, keep on the amazing work!


You're not late! It's the others who were too early! :P

The rotation works as follows:

In Civ5, there is also a hard limit of civs that can be in a single game (22). This limit is eluded by a mechanism of rotation: during game setup, player chooses a civilization amongst a list of 30, but up to 21 computer major civs and up to 35 minor civs are selected depending on player choice. For instance, by selecting Japan, Korea will be among the opponents, while by selecting Greece, Korea will be represented by city-states. Furthermore, not all are alive at the same time, leaving room for colonising overlapping territories. In general, the maximum alive civs at the same time are around 15, and it’s regulated by a mechanism of stability.
 
Rhye,

Long time fan of RFC, its the only thing that keeps me playing 4 over 6, but looking forward to returning to 5 for Catapult. I also noticed this getting attention in the past couple of days and hope there is still room for more testers!

Either way looking forward to playing Catapult soon!
 
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1. Rocky mountains are too rocky. The only way from California to the East Coast is in Canada or in Mexico. Also, there are a couple of tiles, workers cann't reach becouse of mountains, espeсially coal tile in Canada. And settlers cann't travel there anyway becouse of the desert. And it would be nice to have a northen passage through Himalayan from Afganistan, where Alexander came to India.
2. Could you change places of some tecnologies? I find it stupid, when I get atomic bomb before buttleships and carriers. Could you move Electronics to the place of Radar, Radar move to the place of Nuclear Fisics, and Nuclerar Fisics move where Electronics is now, please, if it's not too hard.
3. It would be realy nice to have more religious belives. Firaxis made just a few realy usefull belives. It's not a problem on a small map, when everyone appears at the same time, you just compet for religious bonuses. But, in your mod, when early civs pick all the usefull belives, it makes no sense to found a religion for a late civ. But AI still founds useless religions. May be you could just duplicate all belives, and duplicate religious buildings several times, and we will find new names for them? That could be the easiest way to fix the religions problem.
4. Could you make a canal improvement? Just like in this mod, only script their appearances in Suets, Panama and Bosphorus, becouse AI may not build them. This improvement could also give gold.
5. Would it be possible, to give a scientific bonus for having few cities, so small civs could catch up the big one? You can do it with trade routs. Now, when you send a caravan to a city of another civ, you get a scientific bonus, if that civ is ahead of you in science. Just multiply that bonus by 20? and divide it by a civs cities number or civs population number. And than multiply it by 2 or 4 during the golden age, to simulate a time of fast modernization, that happend in Japan or Russion history, like Meiji restoration. Becouse sometimes it's just boring to play, when big civs are going much further, than small. Remember, in Civ IV that was fixed by a penalty for having many cities, so small cives were sometimes far more advance, than big?
6. Could you please remove combat penalty for strategic resourse shortages for units? It gives you 50% combat penalty, when you use more strategic resourses, than have. I think, barbarians don't get this penalty. This makes new civs very weak, becouse they swordsmen and horsmen can't fight properly, while they are improving their strategic resourses. It also makes useless strategic resourses trade. Imagine, you bought some iron from your neighbour, made some swordsmen, and then your neighbour declares war on you, and you swordsmen worth nothing. It also weakens small cives, that don't have much strategic resourses, so they cann't fight with big one.
7. And I also been thinking about rivers as a roads. May be it make sence to make a hidden free-maintenance road on a tiles with river? With no bridges, of course, if its possible. Or only on one side of a river. Becouse, in Russia, for example, in some Siberian places only road you can use is still just a river.
8. Would it be possible to force European AI to colonize the New World? Sometimes, they just don't. May be you will give them some Liberty policies on start, so they would more willingly build settlers?



sorry for the huge delay in the answer. Lately I even have to save time in answering posts in order to dedicate a little bit more on the mod itself...
point by point:
1- Done as you requested (the Rocky mountains were already modified since quite long ago).
2- The tech tree has changed already. But I don't see any relationship between atomic weapons and battleships. Also, since nukes requires the Manhattan project which requires time to build, it's better to enable it early on. I will later post screenshots of the new tech tree.
3- I see. It seems not possible to add technologies as prerequisite to some belief. That would solve the problem...
4- Interesting mod, but Suez, Bosphorus and (in recent versions of the map) Panama can hold a city, so why bother?
5- it's already that way, there's a much higher cost compared to the vanilla game proportional to the number of cities
6- 50% penalty is big but the example you made sounds realistic, actually
7- rivers are at the border between hexes. I don't know whether a movement bonus could be applied that way
8- they are, they are.
By the way, I sent you a private message quite some time ago. I guess you didn't see it.
 
Was wondering how are the victory conditions coming along and if it's particularly difficult?
Also, i think it might be helpful to add a tutorial on the first post on how you would prefer us to report bugs to you if we happen to find any!
 
I am making the framework right now.
There are several things to do, namely:
the victory panel, a sample calculation of all the parameters, update based on events, triggering victory, and disabling other victory types.
In this phase I do not need any additional testing, but I will need as soon as these components are all working and I can start to tweak the conditions. By then, all the civs will have to be tested.
 
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