Rhye's of Civilization - the fastest loading mod Expanded

[Blasphemous]

You are missing my point - War Elephants is the UU for India replacing the Knight. If that is suddenly crippled something else needs to be done to compensate for this or India is without a Knight type unit.

...
India would get Knights just like veryone else, and their UU would get new stats and replace the Elephant Archer that comes in with Riding.

 

[tshong]

This is simply the BEST mod I've ever played. I've already played as the French, the Persians, and the Chinese. Currently I'm playing the Iroqouis for a challenge. I think there's a definitely need to rebalance N. American and S. American civs. From what I noticed we're always behind in tech if I pick any N. American country. Currently as Iroqouis I'm an entire age behind all the people in Asia and Europe. They have SETI wonder already built and I'm still on Knights. So yeah... I think there's a definitely problem with the European and Asian teching.

Another note about Iroqouis is that the Barbarian hordes arrive A LOT at a time. Its crazy how much you have to fight against. Its so uncomparable to what I was dealing with as a European or Asian civ.

A bug I found is that when the Aztec's border influence goes beyond the Northern mountains, any barbarian horde that arises for the Aztecs appears behind the mountains (around Texas) rather than in front of the mountains (in Aztec border). So there's a massive build up of barbarians since they can't reach the Aztecs. This is problematic when Iroqouis or America trys to expand near that area.

GREAT MOD THOUGH! I hope this helps.

 

[Rhye]

Thank you tshong.
American civs were crippled to make them develop only after the arrival of Europeans. Even a human player will be hampered, but there are still some tricks that can make you stronger.
About the barbarians, I agree that some camps must be removed.

In case you don't know, I'm looking for people for writing small strategy guides - for each civ. As you've played some, would you like to write something (for example the French, as the other civs balancement may change in next patch due to the elephants and camels additions)? It will be posted in the new site

 

[tshong]

Oh! I'd be honored to submit a few guides. I'll have to do it after finals next week though.

About the American thing, yes I know you crippled the Northern and Southern America's to retain historical accuracy. However, the Europeans and Asians are already using modern tanks and nuke capability at 1870's while I'm using knights. It just seems that the difference is a bit too much for accuracy...

In terms of tricks, I've been playing the Iroqouis for 3 days now. About 7 hours a day in between studies.. Here's the tricks I've tried. I tried to get to the other side of the ocean to trade techs asap, but I'm hampered so much in tech that the oversea civs are already teched too far. I've tried to give free techs to the civs around me so that they can develop techs that are parrallel to mine, so that we can benefit from trading techs, but the problem is ALL the civs around my area tech slow. So, we all can't compete with the European/Asians. If you have any other tricks I'd really appreciate the help.

Oh and about the barbarian camps. Sorry, I didn't mean the camps that are occupied when the map is generated. I mean the barbarian "hordes" that randomly pop up in North America.

 

[ibcoltscrew]

Thank you tshong.
American civs were crippled to make them develop only after the arrival of Europeans. Even a human player will be hampered, but there are still some tricks that can make you stronger.
About the barbarians, I agree that some camps must be removed.

In case you don't know, I'm looking for people for writing small strategy guides - for each civ. As you've played some, would you like to write something (for example the French, as the other civs balancement may change in next patch due to the elephants and camels additions)? It will be posted in the new site

Hi Rhye
First iwould like to say... your mod i great...i really like it ...but... I'm canadian and you should replace the Iroquois by Canada and remove some barbarian camp to make it more easier for N.America player. Its hard to deal with 20 barbarian when you only have 5 spearman. They kick my ass everytime i try to move to the north. You should change the rule for the American cause the worker cant clean the bad area and the unit cant climb the mountain. Canada have a good reputation for being able to fight in any situation... mountain or plain it doesnt really matter for canadian soldier.

I'm sure you can do it better.. there is my three ideas.
1. Replace Iroquois by Canadian.
2. Replace Aztec by Mexican and add Brezilian nation.
3. Remove some barabrian camp to the north and the south america.
4. Put more plain into the north america. We have a lot of plain in canada.

I hope it will help and im sorry about my bad english, i'm french-canadian.

Very good work for the other civilization.

 

[bjorn]

I think if any civ should be changed it should be the Americans - replaced perhaps with such civs as the Cherokee or Apache. At the moment they stick out like a sore thumb between all the pre-industrial and pre-european contact civs.

 

[Rhye]

Changes in v2.4 (for now):

- Renamed Horseback Riding to Riding
- Renamed Ivory to Elephants
- Add Elephant Archer available with Riding (3/2/2, +1hp, requires Elephants, cost:50)
- War Elephant available with Riding only for India (3/2/2, +1hp, requires Elephants, cost:35 (as Indian elephants were smaller and easier to tame))
- Elephants a strategy resource instead of luxury, as it is required for some units
- Remove HP bonus for Ancient Cavalry for balancing reasons
- Add Camel Rider (2/1/2, requires Riding, cost:30, ignores desert movement cost)
- Camel a new strategic resource only available in some deserts
- Redistribution of oasis (less), horses (less), elephants (less and far from the coasts to make exportation in Europe more difficult), wines (less), dyes (less), wheat and cattle (more in America)
- Reduced number of barbarian camps in America
- Removed the goody hut in the Azores
- Added a river near Carthage
- Added more plains in Canada
- Tuned Babylonian, Indian, Iroquois, English and Dutch strength
- New floodplains.pcx
- Updated ntp02.pcx (lighter Dutch cities and borders)

Still to do:

Wait if Aluminium converts a Elephant Archer unit better than the one I have
Test if the civ that was changed are balanced
And all the work about the Civilopedia




If anybody doesn't agree with the additions, please tell now.

 

[bjorn]

sounds good, cant wait to dl it

some other ideas regarding the map though; the south pacific part of the map could be a bit more precise. one sea square off the coast of eastern Australia theres an island where there shouldnt be any. I can only asume its supposed to be New Caledonia, one of the French colonies in the area. I myself would place it at least 2 squares east of its current location, and seeing its one of the larger (if not largest) pacific islands at least make it 2 or 3 squares in size.

2nd Id remove the 2 Islands west of Chile (San Felix & Juan Fernandez) and replace them with Easter Island (located further west of Chile), seeing Easter Island had great cultural and historical importance and the 2 other islands hardly to none.
Maybe you could add some hills or forests on some of the Pacific Islands so they can actually be settled - although I must admit the jungle is a nice touch.

And 3rd; The Indonesian islands of Sumatra and Java are linked on your map when they shouldnt be. Furthermore Java is one of the most densely populated places on earth, it would be nice to add perhaps an extra land that could be settled (although techincally you already can on the sugar and hills).

And lastly I didnt see the grassland tile in Greenland I posted about earlier, perhaps I could twist your arm?

Please tell me if my nitpicking gets annoying Id be happy to edit your latest map with these changes. The Pacific (and other islands) is a bit of a hobby of mine, and to be frank the map isnt very precise in this area - but as said Ill be more than happy to send in my take.

 

[ibcoltscrew]

Changes in v2.4 (for now):

- Renamed Horseback Riding to Riding
- Renamed Ivory to Elephants
- Add Elephant Archer available with Riding (3/2/2, +1hp, requires Elephants, cost:50)
- War Elephant available with Riding only for India (3/2/2, +1hp, requires Elephants, cost:35 (as Indian elephants were smaller and easier to tame))
- Elephants a strategy resource instead of luxury, as it is required for some units
- Remove HP bonus for Ancient Cavalry for balancing reasons
- Add Camel Rider (2/1/2, requires Riding, cost:30, ignores desert movement cost)
- Camel a new strategic resource only available in some deserts
- Redistribution of oasis (less), horses (less), elephants (less and far from the coasts to make exportation in Europe more difficult), wines (less), dyes (less), wheat and cattle (more in America)
- Reduced number of barbarian camps in America
- Removed the goody hut in the Azores
- Added a river near Carthage
- Added more plains in Canada
- Tuned Babylonian, Indian, Iroquois, English and Dutch strength
- New floodplains.pcx
- Updated ntp02.pcx (lighter Dutch cities and borders)

Still to do:

Wait if Aluminium converts a Elephant Archer unit better than the one I have
Test if the civ that was changed are balanced
And all the work about the Civilopedia




If anybody doesn't agree with the additions, please tell now.

It could be a good idea to rename the Iroquois with Canadian cause look,its an insult for the canadian people to be see as Iroquois. Iroquois is close to indian people and we are closer to american people than indian. We are Democratic in canada and Iroquois are not Democratic.
If you want, i can change it and post the add for the canadian player. I can do a more realistic canada. But if you dont like the idea i will considere to do it only for me cause i really like your mod but i dont like the iroquois and too bad for me, the iroquois take place in Canada. I cant play my own country
Aztec take the mexican place too... im sure some people will be happy to see Mexican instead of Aztec. Brezilian are missing too... but its not a big deal.

 

[Blasphemous]

ibcoltscrew, my country doesn't even exist in the game. You should be glad to have the honor of misrepresentation, it's better than no representation at all.

 

[ibcoltscrew]

I think if any civ should be changed it should be the Americans - replaced perhaps with such civs as the Cherokee or Apache. At the moment they stick out like a sore thumb between all the pre-industrial and pre-european contact civs.

The probleme is... if you play as west nation like German, england or French for exemple, you will not be able to contact the american till years 1800 so whats the point if you meet Cherokee or Apache in years 1900... dont you think it will not be realist. Think about the second wolrd war... that was not the Cherokee or the Apache that save France form NAZI... that was the american and the canadian with all the other nation around the world. Its an important part of history that i know can happend in this mod. It already happend to me when ive play America. But that was not realist cause Iroquois had nothing to do with this war cause they was not Democratic like america was. Anyway i know this is just an idea but i want to give a chance to my country to be part of this mod and a lot of French are gracious to Canadian people like England are gracious to American people since the end of WW2.

 

[Blasphemous]

Is it any better that England comes over to the east coast in the fifteenth century and is greated by America?

 

[ibcoltscrew]

ibcoltscrew, my country doesn't even exist in the game. You should be glad to have the honor of misrepresentation, it's better than no representation at all.

I dont know what is your country but you should find what is the country that replace yours and fix it. Its important i think to fix the mod to make it the more realistic as possible. I'm not happy cause i hate Bush administration and i dont really like playing with Washington and Lincoln but i dont really have the choice to play with theme cause Iroquois are so bad and Ugly. My other option is to take France and conquer the Iroquois... or play with England and do the same. Its the best way i found to play like we are now and make it realist.

I juste want to make it better you know... this mod is the best mod i have never seen and i know we can make it better for everyone.

 

[Blasphemous]

Even though I think my country, Israel, totally deserves to be in the game, I don't add it because I have no special desire to play as Israel or the Hebrews. If you really want to play as Canada, then play as Canada... That doesn't make it particularly realistic to repalce the one civ representing pretty much all native north-americans with Canada.

 

[ibcoltscrew]

Is it any better that England comes over to the east coast in the fifteenth century and is greated by America?

Yea but Canada should be there too. Cause canada is a mix of England and France people. We are very different then american people... Our policy is very different.

 

[ibcoltscrew]

Even though I think my country, Israel, totally deserves to be in the game, I don't add it because I have no special desire to play as Israel or the Hebrews. If you really want to play as Canada, then play as Canada... That doesn't make it particularly realistic to repalce the one civ representing pretty much all native north-americans with Canada.

I TOTALLY agree with you... ISRAEL should be there... Very important to Add Israel for me. More improtant to add israel then canada cause you guys are there since a long time and Canada & America are yound country.

 

[bjorn]

Think about the second wolrd war... that was not the Cherokee or the Apache that save France form NAZI... that was the american and the canadian with all the other nation around the world.

It was actually the Russians that saved us from the Nazi's, but you guys saved us from communist oppression
Anyways not to dwell on politics, I think Rhye's idea with this mod is for it to follow our earth's history as closely as possible. Therefor I think he did a good job on the Americas; the fact of the matter is that when you play a European civ you do in fact get to America somewhere between 1000-1500 AD, and you meet a bunch of peoples who arent as technologicly advanced as you at that point - as it was in our history.
I agree with Blasphemous that when England or France or whoever cross the Atlantic they should be meeting Native American peeps. Not that Im the best example myself; my people (the Dutch) only started their fight for independance in 1568, but at least they were a people/culture well before that.
Anyways lets not get nasty about it I just feel when you play a game covering 6000 years of Earth's history you should'nt focus too much on the last two centuries.

 

[Rhye]

Listen, ibcoltscrew.
I understand that you want your country in, as everybody else. I'm Italian and Italy is important, right? But there isn't any Italian civ as there already is Rome. Furthermore, I'm from Tuscany, so I would see myself Etruscan more than Roman. But Etruria doesn't deserve to be in the top 31 civs.
It wasn't my choice to keep Canada out of the 31 civs but Firaxis', and talking about historical importance, most of the people including me agree with this decision. If we're talking instead of importance today, well, most of non-Americans see Canada as USA's 53rd state, no offence.

I keep working on this mod because most of the people like it and agree with my decisions. Substituting a native american civ with Canada would simply get most of the people of this thread angry.

But this doesn't mean that can't be done.
Here's my solution:

1-Let me finish this patch
2-You can edit the mod how you want, and you could do a good work if you added a leaderhead and civilopedia as well to your package. I'm sure you'll find all these things in these forums.
3-Upload the mod here at CFC and post a link here
4-I'll add a link with description of your mod at the official site "alternative mods" page: http://rhyesciv.uw.hu/alternative.html

 

[Lachlan]

Rhye : when you post the 2.34 ? I will test Carthage !

Second advice : the map is too big for my 512 Mo of RAM, i suggest a 140 x 140 World Map

 

[Rhye]

Bjorn -> Thank you, I'll see what I can do. You know, Pacific ocean is very compressed; I'll check on the atlas if there's something inaccurate. About the greenland, I prefer not to add the grassland, because keeping loading times low means not adding spots for cities unless strictly neccessary.

Lachlan -> Hello, nice to see you Last test went pretty well, and soon I'll begin updating the civilopedia. But I'm sorry to say that re-drawing a 140x140 world map would mean restart again a work begun last December
As soon as 2.4 is out, I'll complete the "random map mod": the name says it all. It will lose much of historical accuracy, but allow to play in smaller maps without renouncing to the rules changes introduced in this mod