RR13 - Hearts and Minds

[r_rolo1]

Bah, who wants to be a friend of Shaka ? To be honest , I would be delighted to see someone beating up SB a little , but expecting that in the times where SB archery units are so ridiculously promoted is maybe a pipe dream

 

[LKendter]

GAG - How did Bombay get polluted GP pool? 8% change of a blasted spy?
That city is our only hope for a priest and we will need the shrine income later.

Nice to see we are getting a better idea of the shape of the world. It looks like we are more centered in this map. So far we have 1 north, 2 east, and 1 west. I suspect DeGuale is west. We aren't ready for war yet, but I'm now all but convinced SB it target one. I didn't want to go SB first if most of the world was in the west - that was big thing that killed us last game.

The target for tech will be music. IMO Sistine is a must for culture border push. +5 from state religion buildings and +2 per specialist. It will really speed up getting the initial culture into another city to set up the spy push.
If my turn set goes long enough, calendar after music.

Settler goals: Try and grab the rice city north of Varanasi. "X" will be a secondary target.
Building goals: units and workers. Furs won't come online my set due to waiting for border pops.
Immediate hire priest in Bombay - we only have one chance, and it is now. One Sistine is built either Bombay is polluted, or Delhi way out produces.

I plan to play tonight - ~8 hours from now.

 

[r_rolo1]

The target for tech will be music. IMO Sistine is a must for culture border push. +5 from state religion buildings and +2 per specialist. It will really speed up getting the initial culture into another city to set up the spy push.
If my turn set goes long enough, calendar after music.

Yes, Lit->Music ... I'm pretty sure you will not finish Music in your set, though.

Settler goals: Try and grab the rice city north of Varanasi. "X" will be a secondary target.
Building goals: units and workers. Furs won't come online my set due to waiting for border pops.
Immediate hire priest in Bombay - we only have one chance, and it is now. One Sistine is built either Bombay is polluted, or Delhi way out produces.

Settler goals, Agreed
Building goals: more workers than units Ideally more 5 or 6 workers. The furs will take a while, indeed :/
yes, hire priest in Bombay. That spy GPP was most likely one of those dreaded governor assigns :/ Anyway it will take atleast 20 turns to get the GP

 

[lymond]

Once Bombay gets out the mish for Lahore it can focus almost exclusive on units. Cities like Agra can be worker pumps once they grow and we can just 2pop them into buildings. Once Delhi grows back into specialists it can continue focus on Settlers.

I don't think we will need to self tech Calendar. Maybe put a turn or 2 into it. I imagine it will be trade-able by the time Music comes in.

You could get music in your TS if you really want too.'

Those Gspy points should wear off quite fast. If we get another religion we can rush a whatever mish down to Bombay for another temple and priest.

 

[LKendter]

50 AD
I wake up the axe and start moving him toward the rice site.

I hire the priest as already mentioned in Bombay.

I queue a monument before the library in Calcutta. Fighting a creative civ means lots of ASAP culture.


75 AD
The chop is over kill for the work boat in Lahore. I switch it to Moai to get a jump on those.


100 AD
(IT) Judaism has spread to our lands in Agra.


125 AD
I hate building research this early, but I want Agra to grow in 2 turns before starting worker duty.


150 AD
The Maya have founded Christianity.


175 AD
This was an unexpected deal. Zara gives us calendar and $40 for currency.
The pressure for more workers goes up!
(IT) These are the ones I really hate. Converting to Buddhism keeps #1 Brennus happy, but hurts relations with the rest of the world.
I finally decide yes with him being the worst enemy of SB. An ally for the upcoming war is too valuable.


325 AD
We switch back to no religion.


The market in Vijay is praying for a high-odds prophet to multiply the shrine income.
Agra is on indefinite worker production.
Lahore has Moai half done, work boat waiting for border expansion, and should whip the court ASAP.
The worker south of Delhi is building roads toward city "X" and should hit the corn next. I would like to start that city with the corn already up and running.
Our scout is heading toward the other side of the map to find De Gaulle.
Sistine Chapel in Bombay as soon as music is done.

I really wanted to see if we got the priest before handing over, but can't tell where to settler rice.

(WEST bound scout - fixed in game, but picture was from before)


r_rolo1 - Up
Thy_Spellcraft - on deck
nocho -
lymond -
LKendter - just played

 

[lymond]

Looks good, LK. No, I did not intend for the chop to go into the wb. I started a workboat though so that it will finish around the border pop so we have the food up first thing when that happens. Expect to put the chop into a granary or somesuch. Maoi is fine, but would have been even better with stone up first.

I like Sistine in Bombay. I figured it should go in one of the border cities and Bombay has good hammers.

I disagree on the monument in Calcutta. In fact, I would either not build one or whip it immediately at pop 2. The city was going to get Conf in a couple of turns anyway. Neither here nor there really, but I don't think we are in much trouble from Zara near a secondary city. We will continue culture whoring in that city.

Great trade for Calendar. I figured it would open up to us soon.

We should get some of that gold AIs have for us to finish Music in 2 turns.

We can start hitting SB with spies pretty cheaply

We could consider doing the Jew thing. Grow Agra on a Jew monastery or mish and 2 pop whip the worker into one of those. Switch to Judaism and spread it around.

 

[LKendter]

Stone is up - that was one of my early worker actions.
Maoi is already 1/2 complete between whip and chops.

Any thoughts on rice city? That is the main reason I stopped where I did.

I was already thinking Sistine in Bombay, especially now that it owns the flood plain cottage square for more food.

 

[lymond]

I'd settle right where it is....leaves us a possible city east once we start pushing back Zara

oh...good job on the stone.

i probably added some points to my post after you read it...i re-edit all the time.

We might want to run a few cheap spy missions in Mound City to speed the flip along so we can then start pushing on Cahokia.

 

[Thy_Spellcraft]

Good set LK at least from what I can see from the report.. And concerning the settler: I#m tempted to even go 1NE onto the desert title.. Yes it would get two more desert tiles but it also would grab the FP to the west and would net us some more land we needn't to culture-fight for!

 

[AJ11]

Good set LK at least from what I can see from the report.. And concerning the settler: I#m tempted to even go 1NE onto the desert title.. Yes it would get two more desert tiles but it also would grab the FP to the west and would net us some more land we needn't to culture-fight for!

Lurker:

*cough*NW*cough*

 

[r_rolo1]

Ok, looks good

GOT it and will say more after seeing the save

 

[r_rolo1]

Ok, I am looking into the sae now ...

Oh, dear, SB is not exactly the most loved one around In fact I think that both of the hands full that are in game now ( Shaka and Brennus ) have good chances of being directed to him, especially Brennus. I'm not sure of how to deal with it ...

So we are close to music, nice. Sistine after it in Bombay looks nice .... but :

- What to tech next ? Drama and CS are the obvious next techs ( more CS, I guess ). Any other sugestions ?

- Do we want any other wonder ? I mulling over the idea of getting the Parth, the GL or MoM ( not all OFC ) ...

On the rice city ... 1 NW would give space to the east to make a decent city ( after irrigation and chopping ) ... say 1 W of the lake ( where the scout is ). I think it is the best compromise ... do you agree ?

The moai city will need to get it's own WB , unfortunately, due to ice ... that is definitely not optimal

I'll play during the weekend. Feel free to drop input

 

[lymond]

Lahore has a WB already built...it's just waiting on the border pop

Looking at the game, I am a bit curious as to why Workers are building roads all over the place. There is SO much to do other than building useless roads.

We also need to try to get granaries up asap in cities, even before CHs

Personally, I don't like 1NW in the slightest for that settler. I think settling on the desert hill is fine and still leaves room for a city in the East.

 

[LKendter]

Looking at the game, I am a bit curious as to why Workers are building roads all over the place. There is SO much to do other than building useless roads.

Our troops were getting slowed done big time moving, and it was because of no roads to use.

We almost lost the race to the north city due to lack of roads - I had to take SB roads to get there. If I didn't sent the escort early we would have lost that site.

I can't tell you how much movement wastage I had due to lack of roads.

Several resources such as sheep weren't used due to lack of roads. Corn still isn't connected. We are connecting mostly happy resources such as silk along with HR. We need the matching health connected.

The barb city really kills our mobility. I was trying to road around him.

The road to "X" will speed up the settler getting there, and can fix the corn next to get ready for the settler.


I disagree that they were useless.

 

[lymond]

Well, if a resource is not hooked up yet, I ask myself "Do I need that resource yet". Roading up to the city up north is more than fine. I always road cities before settling them unless there is a natural hookup. However, I do see workers building roads to nowhere or on empty tiles around cities. Cities still need improving or chopping which buys us much more. That sugar needs to be improved. We could have workers jumping all over that rice the minute the new city is settled. Lahore could get a granary chopped.

The road you built all the way from the west into the jungle could have been place on 1 tile from the road in the east near the point we settle - that site is not in any danger. We don't yet have the luxury to send workers off roading like mad. The roads are "useless" in the short term when it matters - in the long term roads are not useless.

 

[r_rolo1]

I agree with LK, those roads are not a luxury. We can discuss if we could had used the worker-turns better, but we are really hampered by that barb city ...

Anyway, what I want to do in this set:

CS->Drama ( or the other way around ) after Music.

Sistine in Bombay. I still want input on extra marble based wonders, especially GLib

Settle the rice city 1 NW of current position. Prepare a settler for the "west bound scout" spot.

Make granaries. And workers. And units ...

Eat pop corns while SB is attacked by Brennus ( hopefully )

Use incoming GP as a shrine if a prophet. In case of a ( knock on wood ) GSpy ... dunno. SY somewhere ?



I'm thinking on playing tonight ( maybe 5 h from now )

 

[LKendter]

I agree with LK, those roads are not a luxury. We can discuss if we could had used the worker-turns better, but we are really hampered by that barb city ...

I will concede I could have skipped some of them. I was extremely frustrated that set with unit movement wastage, and lack of mobility. I got roads stuck on my brain.

The time to move some of the units such as missionary from Bombay up north was horrid due to the existing roads badly built around the rivers.

CS->Drama ( or the other way around ) after Music.

If we are heading to drama, then we should discuss the GT city.
Varan has potential, but three hills, horses, and cows says natural production city.
To be honest, I don't I really don't see a city I like. I like all food, and almost no shields.

I still want input on extra marble based wonders, especially Glib.

GL does nothing for me. It doesn't help push borders like Sistine, doesn't add EP, etc. Right now I would rather have more units and workers. I added 2 workers, 2 under construction, and we are still way short. Workers far exceed GL with all the jungle. Plus we still need more military.

Also we have stone connected, so let us talk all wonders that multiply.
Once we are close to engineering I would like to review Norte Dame. It is too early to decide right now. Everything else of interest is too far away to even look at right now.

Prepare a settler for the "west bound scout" spot.

Make that 2 - we still want "X" that I have a worker heading toward.

Use incoming GP as a shrine if a prophet. In case of a ( knock on wood ) GSpy ... dunno. SY somewhere ?

Any cottage city is good planning for when we up the slider. Vijay next as the court is already built and we and something multiplies now.

 

[Thy_Spellcraft]

I think Parth is a no brainer.. About GLib: for Vijay I'd vote yes otherwise I'd rather leave it behind!

 

[r_rolo1]

Yup, parth was part of the discussion package ( and MoM as well, in lesser degree ). The issue is where to put it without messing the GPP pools.... Bombay will be making Sistine, that is far more important and I'm not sure if we want the cap with anything besides spy GPP. That leaves ... Vijav ?

LK, GT is not a necessity, but it would be a nice to get nat wonder. I really also don't see a good place for it :/

 

[nocho]

Commenting from the phone here, so you can readily discard what I say, but is NE part of the discussion package? We haven't built it yet, did we?