SCH0001 - Learning FFH

[schwartz]

Well.. We don't want AV because of hell terrain.
The problem is we need to give the bravery (courage?) promotion to our horsemen else they won't even attack Hyborem. So.. Heading in that direction makes sense (down Magic line..)
Cheshiremythos is up now.

 

[Quotey]

Well I'm sure we could take out Arturus with our horses if we wanted then we'd get to do the late game of FFH which I personally haven't done yet...

AV means hell terrain = little commerce/production/food = BAD

The most difficult thing about learning FFH is choosing a victory condition... it isn't like normal Civ where you can just default to Space.

 

[schwartz]

Well I'm sure we could take out Arturus with our horses if we wanted then we'd get to do the late game of FFH which I personally haven't done yet...

AV means hell terrain = little commerce/production/food = BAD

The most difficult thing about learning FFH is choosing a victory condition... it isn't like normal Civ where you can just default to Space.

Good point.. I usually end up just building the tower of mastery after I conquer the whole continent. Never been too
good at naval invasions.

 

[c.fe]

[...]
AV means hell terrain = little commerce/production/food = BAD
[...]

Lurker's comment:
The last game I had hell terrain was with Hyborem so I might be a bit off here but: As far as I hell gives the same commerce/production and food as normal terrain but you loose your health resources and irrigation doesn't spread anymore. Additionally all demons get +10% on hell terrain and all of Hyborem's units are demons.

 

[Krick19]

Wow. Nice one. Unfortunately, my computer isn't starting right now. I might get it up soon, might not. I think I'll try restalling windows and hopefully I can get it up for my turns.

 

[PaulusIII]

My planning as for victory:

Decius
Tebryn Arbandi
Arturus Thorne
Hyborem
Cassiel
The Unknown Faction

 

[Quotey]

Lurker's comment:
The last game I had hell terrain was with Hyborem so I might be a bit off here but: As far as I hell gives the same commerce/production and food as normal terrain but you loose your health resources and irrigation doesn't spread anymore. Additionally all demons get +10% on hell terrain and all of Hyborem's units are demons.

Really? You're prolly right. I just read something that said it's less good yieldwise. Well, how about this plan:

Let hell terrain spread to our horses, which makes them Nightmares, which means stronger mounted units? Can someone c/d or check the Pedia on how fast we can use nightmare units?

 

[Cheshiremythos]

Congratulations on killing off the Sheaim. Council of Esus will be useful if we encounter a stronger civ as the final faction. It takes money to spread but it allows you to double click on the city and look inside. If we ever need espionage for some reason open borders and spread the deceit.

I didn't know about the irrigation bit but the things to watch out for with hell terrain is the removal of most agricultural and animal based resources. I think the agri. is replaced by snake pillars, which get bonuses with the evil tech line, and the animal ones are replaced by toads. Not sure what happens to incenses or anything that provides happiness. Oh and marble/stone turn to sheut stone.

Nightmare is a promotion for mounted units, I assume it comes from having nightmares, that gives +10% on all hell terrain and +1 attack and defense. I have the save but will not be able to play tomorrow. My report should be up on sunday though as that day seems free.

Questions: Are we converting to AV? Should be we actively be searching for arcturus? Do we need more military? In my ten turns these should be the only answers I need to play. Oh yeah and how long till we fight again?

 

[Krick19]

Good news, my computer works; I'm installing civ soon.

 

[PaulusIII]

Good to hear that Krick.

The Ashen Veil conversion is the classical Power At A Scary Price™ deal. Converting to the AV will give us stronger horsemen, increase happiness and research, and keep Hyborem happy. But it will screw up our terrain and mark us Evil for all time. (Not like that's a bad thing, but still... )

If need be and we really want to keep hell terrain out we can still go a bit towards the magic line to counteract Hell terrain spread. For now, I'm in favor of conversion because we are not yet able to stand up to Hyborem. If you can't beat them, join them.

 

[Cheshiremythos]

180 Inherited turn. Set up workers to build a road from Vallus to Corond.

181 Torrolerial wanted to join the infernals. I said no but we might run into a culture problem there. Grottiburg comes back from revolution and I turn on monument.

182 Infernals wanted open borders. I decided against it.

Spoiler :

183 We were hit by the river of blood spell. Meaning of the hidden Civs we know one is Grigori/Cassiel, an adventurer was born this turn as well, and the other is Calabim. We lost two population from every city. Workers begin a road from Steinvik to the capital. Horseman comes online in capital now building another horseman. Corond finished the training yard and his now building a horseman. Steinvik finished a warrior and is now building a ranch. Writing is finished and Trade is started with 8 turns to go.

Spoiler :

184 Nothing.

185 Ashen Veil passively spreads to Corond Mor.

186 Ashen Veil passively spreads to Rondonnor. Warrior finished in Tongurstad, work begins on a ranch. Horseman built in capital work begins on a library. We could use the research boost as we keep having to go lower and lower for support costs.

187 Rondonnor finishes a horseman and begins a pallaside both so it can continue to grow and so our support cost for units does not over extend us anymore.

188 Glaveholm finishes a warrior and begins work on a monument.

189 Trade is finished. Research begins on Masonry which is a prereq for construction so we can get chariots. Construction is qued on as well. Corond Mor finished an axeman and started working on an Inn. Gives us more trade routes. Fiess Mabdon finishes a granary and begins working on an Inn as well.

190 The turn I end on. Goblins are coming up on Graelvig (Who made that name up?) but are no match for the horseman stationed there. 1 turn until masonry is done.

Our Empire:

Spoiler :

A decent city spot:

Spoiler :

The city ruins will probably need to be sanctified to get rid of them. But otherwise it gets copper cows and a mana which can be used to get life mana to sanctify the area. To get courage put on our units so we can fight Hyborem we need Spirit mana. So I think that means we need Divination to get both the courage spell, immune to fear, and the sanctify spell, destroys the city ruins.

 

[Krick19]

1S would probably be better, seeing as we don't want useless coast tiles(no lighthouse, harbor, etc.) Anyways got it, but as I'm juggling NCSG 4 and this, I'll wait a bit for advice.

 

[Cheshiremythos]

The biggest deal with AV I have is the usual increase in armageddon counter that comes with it. Hell terrain isn't too big of a deal although it can add another mana we need, water, to put out the fires. AV gives us more research which would be nice. If we do switch to AV the other thing we need to be careful of, especially when fighting Hyborem, is each unit that dies for us can turn into a mane for him. I am pro-AV I guess.

Edit: Why would we move it down south one has that has more coast than the original one. Or did I misunderstand you?

 

[Groogaroo]

I'm back,

Krick is saying that Building a city one tile of the coast means you can't build a lighthouse and there for can't make the water tiles 2food. Then again we don't have the needed techs for lighthouses allthough we do have some coastal cities now so it might be an idea to invest in that at some point (Not a priority I know).

Totally don't have an idea about the AV discussion... really need to read up on the civilopedia for FfH.

Roster

Schwartz > Up Now
Krick19 > On Deck
Quotey
Groogaroo
PaulusIII
Cheshiremythos > Just Played

 

[schwartz]

Oh. Got it.
Thought Krick was up. 1S is definitely a better spot. It can at least get a lighthouse+harbor. Although we'd need to tech fishing and sailing (or whatever the corresponding techs are called)

 

[schwartz]

Okay.. I can probably get to this some time tomorrow night after I get back home from class.
What should our plan be moving forward.
Paulus' idea of hitting Thorne first makes the most sense.. But we don't want a backstab from Hyborem. We should keep hitting hard for as long as we can, IMO, before the defenders start getting stronger.

 

[Groogaroo]

Paulus' idea of hitting Thorne first makes the most sense.. But we don't want a backstab from Hyborem. We should keep hitting hard for as long as we can, IMO, before the defenders start getting stronger.

I can see the sense in pressing our advantage while we still have it and if thats the route we want to take then fine, however I'm not not sure taking out Arturus is such a good idea. With Arturus gone Hyborem will definatley go for us next, I'm thinking it might be better to prepare/tech whatever we need to take Dis, wait for Hyborem to leave to go on the rampage against Arturus and backstab him.

I assume if we take/raze Dis Hyborem will just dissapear if thats his only city? We would need a lot of suicide troops but we I think we could take it.

There's alot of assumption in the thoughts above and I know very little when it comes to Hyborem and the Infernals.

 

[Diamondeye]

LURKER:
Why haven't I seen this thread before? I haven't tried FfH but it sounds just epic. Really my kind of mod as far as I can see - just read entire thread in one go (blame my boring school, wish I was in sch0001 instead )... If you have room for one more (now or at start of Sch0002), I would be delighted to join!

 

[schwartz]

LURKER:
Why haven't I seen this thread before? I haven't tried FfH but it sounds just epic. Really my kind of mod as far as I can see - just read entire thread in one go (blame my boring school, wish I was in sch0001 instead )... If you have room for one more (now or at start of Sch0002), I would be delighted to join!

I'll shoot you a PM when I start setting up another one! It'll be another FfH game for sure.

Glad you enjoyed the game so far

EDIT:
Actually if Quotey still can't play maybe we can slot you into the roster now.
Is the computer back up, Quotey?

 

[PaulusIII]

Looks like the economy has recovered, nice.

The city makes more sense 1S of the spot. North is only desert: never useful. South is sea: marginally useful.

Considering the increase of the AC and hell terrain spread, once we get nightmares and start building more units in Tongurstad we will profit from an increasing AC as well since Nightmares are stronger on hell terrain, and Tongurstad adds the Stigmata promotion to all units built there which increases strength corresponding to the AC.

Before we should even consider war against Hyborem, we will want a stronger type of mounted troops. This would mean either horse archers or chariots, which means either heading for Stirrups or Trade and Construction. In my experience, unless instigated by someone else, Hyborem is actually fairly slow in declaring war. With our current tech rate getting stronger mounted troops is not out of the question.

And if there's going to be a Sch0002, I will certainly play in it.