SGOTM 04 - Geezers

[markh]

If you mean move the scout to the proposed site SW then I agree.

Of course to the site.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

I am guessing we are north of EQ.

I'm pretty certain they changed the resource arrows in Warlords so that they all point the same way in order to prevent this type of spoiler info.

 

[markh]

I did read that Diplo victory was disabled but forgot it. However presumably the UN itself is still valid in terms of passing other resolutions? Something to bear in mind anyway.

Yes, but this does not convince me that we have to build it ourselves. To be honest I am fed up with votings for secretary for the time being.

 

[markh]

BTW do we have any volunteer for the first set ?

 

[Sam_Yeager]

Looks like we'll have to download the start save again according to this post.

 

[Jenarie]

I was just looking at the opening picture. I can't think of anything that would make me want to move to the south hill to start. Moving Ragnar away from the ocean would take something amazing there I'd think? All we can see there atm is the mountain which means at least one unworkable tile (is that mountain going to block the view if we move scout there?).

The north circle looks interesting with all the hills. All the resources we can see would be in either the north or middle cross but we'd pick up hills which would be nice for production. But sadly no way to scout that way with where the scout is placed so... *shrug*

I love dotmaps. This one isn't all that useful without more of the map showing but I made it so have one anyway...



It did make me realize that a possible benefit of settling north or south is that we'd have two cities there instead of one but again there is really no way to tell if that is a good thing or not.

 

[markh]

I think the first player will have to move the scout on the hill to the proposed site SW, save the game and post a screenshot to enable us to have a look what we have there. Normally the programme only offers sites if there are some goodies around.

 

[Jenarie]

I guess my question is that is there anything that is good enough to spend two turns moving plus lose the ocean? I can't think of anything that would make me settle there - every unknown square would have to have something on it to make it seem like a good move to me? And even if they do, maybe it would still be better to use those resources for city two?

Btw to all - I'm not trying to be argumentative. I know that everyone here is a better player then I am so if anything I'm just trying to pick your brain and understand. And maybe once in a while I'll get lucky and one of my what-if questions will actually help.

I'll be happy with whatever is decided I'm just curious why that site is under serious consideration when it seems like either of the other two would be better. I'd probably move the scout north west.

 

[markh]

Yes, you are absolutely right about the city placement. It would have to be much better than the site the settler is now to consider moving the settler and waste two turns. Nevertheless I would take a look and see what Gyathaar placed there.

 

[markh]

Well, Thrallia, your question about getting into a peaceful state with Gandhi via another route has just been answered by Gyathaar in the maintenance thread.

 

[AlanH]

Gyathaar has answered your question, I guess. If you can get peace with Gandhi then teach Gyathaar how to do it

 

[Sam_Yeager]

Pfftt! Since Gyathaar posted in the maintenance thread Thrallia's idea is known to everyone. Of course this may have been the intention.....

The matter may be moot anyway if this post's suggestion is accepted.

 

[markh]

Oh, master Thallia I am impressed. Have a look at the maintenance thread.

Still nobody has volunteered to take the first set. I will give everybody until tomorrow morning. Then I will set up a roster.

 

[Thrallia]

I'll volunteer I think I did a decent job last time.

I just saw the maint. thread, somewhat of a downer now that everyone knows about it, but hey...if we can still do it, it'd be nice.

There is a risk though, in the way they say we'd have to do it...we'd be risking Gandhi getting wiped out if he refused to capitulate to the other civ.

I think I'd personally right now prefer the safer method depending on what exactly we find out there in the great unknown

 

[Sam_Yeager]

I'll be happy with whatever is decided I'm just curious why that site is under serious consideration when it seems like either of the other two would be better. I'd probably move the scout north west.

As far as I'm concerned I wouldn't really say the site is under active consideration. However I still think it's worth seeing what's there before we decide where to settle.

We want to actively scout in any case. Since the tiles to the north will become visible if we settle in situ it makes more sense for the scout to go south instead.

 

[Thrallia]

As for the first turn moves...I'd suggest moving the scout S/W to the hill, so as to uncover more coast and then reach the blue circled hill.

I'd also move the settler 2N to the other blue circle. Losing 1 turn on epic isn't bad, and at the cost of 4 forests, we gain what looks like a possible 3 hills and 2 forests...along with the possibility of some other resource, without losing the pigs, corn, or clams(which will give us a powerhouse of an early wonder anyway).

Here's my midterm-longterm thoughts:

Early Game:
Explore land and sea diligently in order to find Gandhi and the other AI
Focus on science and build the Great Library(Pyramids too, if we get a chance)
Establish a number of cities we can simply allow Gandhi to steal once they reach size 2

Midgame:
Get to CS and Machinery early so that we can use our UU to take out the civs we don't want interfering with us or Gandhi(warmongers, science powerhouses that generally arent' good trade partners, irritating leaders-Izzy)
Increase our GPP production to lightbulb critical techs.
Get free GPs from techs
Get Liberalism

Lategame:
Research everything as fast as possible still
Make sure we've got a military capable of holding off a modern Gandhi war machine and remove any competition for Gandhi
Become SecGen to turn off Manhattan Project(wouldn't be good to get nuked every few turns by Gandhi instead of him building that spaceship)
Build Space Elevator and gift to Gandhi
Possibly build Internet and gift to Gandhi if he's hopelessly behind in techs.


Overall:
Those two early wonders, to me, are very important. As the Library can give us early GS's, and the Pyramids would greatly strengthen our specialist science, along with giving us GE points, something we definitely want to get to ensure we give Gandhi the Space Elevator...the earlier we get it, the easier it will be to ensure we get one.
Additionally, it seems to be that lightbulbing techs with GP will greatly increase our tech speed. It appears GS, GE, and GM are the most important for the techs we'd be interested in. Getting the free ones from techs should be a goal as well.
I agree with everyone else we don't need to bother building the UN, but we should assure ourselves of becoming the SecGen so that we can disable nukes if it looks like Gandhi is interested in building them
Also, we should probably get our Scotland Yard up and running ASAP to build spies and get a picture of what Gandhi is building in his big cities.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

I'd also move the settler 2N to the other blue circle. Losing 1 turn on epic isn't bad, and at the cost of 4 forests, we gain what looks like a possible 3 hills and 2 forests...along with the possibility of some other resource, without losing the pigs, corn, or clams(which will give us a powerhouse of an early wonder anyway).

It would be three turns if we go for our current spot. The more I look at our current spot the more I like it. It reminds me of 'Spain on a lake' for those who read RB1.

Early Game:
Explore land and sea diligently in order to find Gandhi and the other AI
Focus on science and build the Great Library(Pyramids too, if we get a chance)
Establish a number of cities we can simply allow Gandhi to steal once they reach size 2

I think we should be thinking of taking out, or at least weakening, any nearby aggressive civs.

Lategame:
Research everything as fast as possible still
Make sure we've got a military capable of holding off a modern Gandhi war machine and remove any competition for Gandhi
Become SecGen to turn off Manhattan Project(wouldn't be good to get nuked every few turns by Gandhi instead of him building that spaceship)
Build Space Elevator and gift to Gandhi
Possibly build Internet and gift to Gandhi if he's hopelessly behind in techs.

I don't think we can gift stuff to Ghandhi when we're at war.

We need to remember that it will be very difficult to do all the things we would like to do. We have to to make sure that those things we can do, we do well.

 

[Jenarie]

In the maintenance thread discussion people seem worried that some other civ may vassal Gandhi but I sorta assumed we'd be a little more protective of him then that. Of course I suppose it could be hard to protect someone who is trying to kill you.

I think in my head I have us as strongest (military and tech) and then Gandhi right behind us in tech and hopefully top half in military so he doesn't seem like a good target to anyone and he doesn't feel weak enough to voluntarily vassal to one of his friends. I think an AI at war will automatically build troops so I'm thinking that keeping him strong shouldn't be a problem but I'm not sure about that.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

What's people's thoughts on starting build & tech?

I think start build should be warrior and probably worker after that.

Not sure about start tech. We start with Fishing so we could go straight to Sailing but probably not worth it for the first tech. Agriculture is useful to farm the corn if we settle in situ but I think we've got plenty of food anyway although we'll want Pottery soon. We could go direct to Animal Husbandry, Archery or Mining. I think I prefer going the boring Mining route but I'm sure other people will different ideas.

 

[Htadus]

I'm pretty certain they changed the resource arrows in Warlords so that they all point the same way in order to prevent this type of spoiler info.

I was basing my thought on the location of jungle. I ran bunch of fractal maps and found a good number had jungles near toward EQ of the map.