[BTS] SGOTM 25 - Home Slices

[Kaitzilla]

LowtherCastle is performing the turnset now, right?

If so, thanks for all the hard work these last 2 weeks Babybluepants.

 

[WastinTime]

It costs 78 base-h to set up for a max OF whip.

It's often not good to max OF a forge--base hammers are reduced, but I'll keep it in mind.
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I'm still not a big fan of religion + OR this early. Maybe after I look into the Kremlin I'll want it more.

 

[LowtherCastle]

WT, are you working on a Kremlin plan? I'm a bit in limbo.

 

[WastinTime]

WT, are you working on a Kremlin plan? I'm a bit in limbo.

ok, let me put some time into that now.

 

[WastinTime]

ok, let me put some time into that now.

fyi, thx for keeping links to the latest test saves in post #3. Handy.
I can't seem to get motivated to do the Kremlin planning in any further detail than bbp already did. Do you see any reason to try to do any better than T38 here?

 

[LowtherCastle]

Okay, we've got forests to burn in Beijing. I'll try to get it done asap without slowing our warring. Depends on how many workers we'll have.

 

[babybluepants]

fyi, thx for keeping links to the latest test saves in post #3. Handy.
I can't seem to get motivated to do the Kremlin planning in any further detail than bbp already did. Do you see any reason to try to do any better than T38 here?

The only thing is we might want to save some forests and delay a bit? Though I don't think we need to be shy about chopping here. Not like we need OU or a space part.

 

[LowtherCastle]

What about rebasing the bomber to Beijing t13 and striking the lbm and then capturing Bis worker on the copper t14? Does that minimize the chances of an attack on our archer? I want more workers asap.

 

[babybluepants]

What about rebasing the bomber to Beijing t13 and striking the lbm and then capturing Bis worker on the copper t14? Does that minimize the chances of an attack on our archer? I want more workers asap.

I think that's a good idea.

The one downside is that we would lose the chance to recon from London for 1t, which would reveal London's BFC and help with circumnav. When it says that the worker has 2t to complete the copper mine, does that means it moves T13-14 IBT or one later?

Edit: not looking at the save, but can we capture it on the way to cow in 2t?

 

[LowtherCastle]

I think that's a good idea.

The one downside is that we would lose the chance to recon from London for 1t, which would reveal London's BFC and help with circumnav. When it says that the worker has 2t to complete the copper mine, does that means it moves T13-14 IBT or one later?

In the save from last turn, the road was already complete. Iiuc, deity AIs need 1t for plains roads and 2t for plains mines, so that mine is now halfway done, I guess.

So I suppose that means it will have moved by the time I could attack it there. Instead I'll have to move the bomber t14 and capture the worker on the cows on t15. He'll have a couple turns to build an axe before we can strike the copper mine.

On the bright side, that gives 1t to recon England.

 

[LowtherCastle]

If I complete a chop during a revolt are the hammers lost? What about overflow hammers? Lost or kept?

 

[LowtherCastle]

Struggling my way through this PPP, folks. Don't think I'm not working on it. Hopefully get something out today.

 

[babybluepants]

If I complete a chop during a revolt are the hammers lost? What about overflow hammers? Lost or kept?

No, they're kept.

 

[LowtherCastle]

PPP (working draft)
Overview: Steal Bis wkr t15. Recon LondonFarNorth, Help capture Bis, if needed, Recon RoosyEast and West, see if circumnavigation quickly possible.
Start city captures on T20: Mongolia(t22)-HongKong(t26)-Shanghai(t29)-Manchou(t33)
Complete the Kremlin (t32)
No revolt to Taosim or OR.

Notes
T12
Stop worker action -- watermill
Put eps on TOku? (for eventual CS steal)
Trade Toku resources?

T13
In theory, Moscow should have grown to p2, cows pastured?
Check TRs with Gua after Manchou border pop.

MM (conditional, turn by turn)
Yanan: granary-sword-chariot-as needed
Beijing: granary-chariot-Kremlin
Gua: granary-wb-choko(15h)-galley(2h)-chariot-choko(2whip)-sword(25h)-galley(2whip)-sword-choko(2whip)-chariot

Improvements
Wkr 1: waIv(T12)-mnIr-waIv-quarry-chopKremlin
Wkr 2: paHorse-waFp
Wkr 3: chop-fmRi-chop-boardGalley-mnGems
Wkr 4: cancel(T12)-mnIr-waIv-quarry-chopKremlin
Wkr 5: mvStone-rd-quarry-chopKremlin-???(5t)-chopKremlin

Units
Bomber plan
Recon Farthest N from London(1t)-use to capture Bis wkr(3t) if necessary-Recon RoosyLand-(~3t)- ~T20 Begin city capture plan
Our Moscow archer arrives on cows on t18

Diplomacy
Who knows? DoW everyone and their uncle?
Stay at peace with Mehmed and Julius.

Every Turn
Check AI scores for IW completion, power for IW completion
Check dG for OBs
Watch for Moscow worker roading to Mongolia
Don't accept extortion causing 10t DoP with anyone but Meh, JC, Roosy

Questions
1. We need to plant our GSpy before stealing CS or any other tech to get the 50-60% bonus. Where? He needs to be in
location to do that at the right time. Now he's on walkabout.
2. Eps on Toku?

working thoughts
time mongola DOW with Moscow worker capture
skip gift Gua to Churchill, produce more units first for dG?
time revolts with Gua gift to dG?
focus kremlin build on chops (which are less valuable after K is built) rather than whips
watch Mongolia's build to t14. If settler, then consider whipping a sword 1t earlier in Yanan instead of choko, and chopping another chariot.
beijing pops borders on 33(T12)+39(13t)+30(6t)= T31 plus any revolt turns

Hopefully I be able to play Monday and Tuesday. Feedback?

 

[babybluepants]

All sounds really good. much more minimal approach.

How many / what kind of units are you projecting for each city capture with this plan?

 

[WastinTime]

I suppose we will use Toku for our various EP plans (not even counting CS steal), so yea put EPs on him for now.
The rest looks great.
Smart to consider more chops and less whips for Kremlin. It would also be nice if all our other cities weren't whipped down to size 1 right before Kremlin, but do what you gotta do.

Is there any plan, or need, to mine the 3rd ring gold? or are we settling near other gold(s)? and not worrying about mining any til after Kremlin chops.

 

[babybluepants]

focus kremlin build on chops (which are less valuable after K is built) rather than whips

FYI, this inspired me to try again from an in-between save and skip the choko whips. I got T34 with a quick OR+forge run. I think I can shave a turn down to T33 with better worker management.
Then I tried from 1520BC with forge whip without OR, using your worker management, and got T34. I don't think I can shave a turn there.
So, I guess they do slow Kremlin down a bit. It makes sense. Forge costs 120h, but contributes only 85h to the Kremlin build.

 

[babybluepants]

Is there any plan, or need, to mine the 3rd ring gold? or are we settling near other gold(s)? and not worrying about mining any til after Kremlin chops.

If we steal the Moscow worker, it could help with improvements west of Yan'an. It will be a little while before we can hook up that gold with only two Yan'an worker, though. I think we should at least finish a couple of FP watermills first. But, that should still be faster than settling gold.

 

[babybluepants]

time mongola DOW with Moscow worker capture

We can probably capture the worker several turns sooner than the attack on Mongolia. Would you delay the worker capture? If it is roading towards Mongolia, that may be ok.

skip gift Gua to Churchill, produce more units first for dG?

Yes, this seems to work really well. There is so much food in Gua, we can just keep whipping units for a while.

 

[LowtherCastle]

How many / what kind of units are you projecting for each city capture with this plan?

Mongolia: plan is sword+2chariots+archer vs. lbm+archer
HongKong: choko+sword+chariot(+archer if needed) vs. lbm
Shanghai: choko+2chariots(+archer if needed) vs. lbm+archer; expecting more defenders so +1t will add the galley with choko+sword, assuming not dead
Manchou: survivors from Mongolia+chariots from Yanan, as needed.

If Stalin is Modern-aged, Mongolia is building a settler which is dubious, so careful monitoring of his SabProd, along with all other targets. Maybe Mongolia finishes a worker next turn. He'll improve a tile or three for us.