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SGOTM2 Germany - Team scout

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession GOTM (SGOTM)' started by mad-bax, May 15, 2004.

  1. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Drastically increased corruption. OCN(in addition to distance corruption) is an effort by firaxis to give smaller empires a chance against larger ones.
    I don't really see an advantage to having a large amount of territory, besides our rings & those couple extra lux/resource cities.
    I have no idea, there's an OCN calculator around here somewhere but I've never used it.
     
  2. scoutsout

    scoutsout Minstrel Boy

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    @Mistfit: Exceeding the OCN will disproportionately increase corruption.

    @Gengis: IIRC, this is a "Large" map... so our OCN should be a little higher... (I don't recall exactly how to get the OCN...)

    As far as "abandoning selected cities" goes... I don't really like it, but I follow your logic. As long as we are giving up nothing but some crappy jungle, I don't mind it... but I don't want to give up any tundra (yet) and I don't want to give up anything that claims a resource.

    IIRC, we don't have anything like that over near England...the cities to the West and Southwest either fit into a ring, or claim something. Giving England something she can't defend might not really help her much... It seems like we have some unclaimed land to the NE of our core. We could settle that and gift it to Lizzy... at least that way she'd have us for a buffer zone between her and France/Russia. (I believe it was Russia that smacked England around for a pretty good long while in this game...)

    Alternatively, we could check to see what England's resources look like, if we're looking at propping up England.
     
  3. scoutsout

    scoutsout Minstrel Boy

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    Sorry for the double... I found an OCN calculator. I will post an Edit here when I have the magic number.

    Edit: According to the discussion thread, this is a "standard" map, which seems a little hard for me to believe.

    According to MapStat, we have 37 cites. According to the OCN calculator, our OCN is 25.

    Something else to consider: With our current level of settlement, we claim 26.7% of the world. The 25% threshold is of strategic importance in a diplomatic win.

    I am starting to think that abandoning cities is not really going to help us much from a strategic standpoint. I don't think abandoning one or two cities is going to help our corruption much, and I don't think we could abandon 12 without giving up a strategic edge somewhere else.

    Another factor to consider - this map has a pretty good amount of land, about 36% of the world is land, or about 300 more tiles of land than the map in GOTM31... that's room for 14 more OCN spaced 21-tile cities...
     
  4. Mistfit

    Mistfit Deity

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    per Gainy bo on quick answers:
    he said 28

    Is the increase in corruption the same if you are 1 over or 10 over?
     
  5. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Scout: 25% of the land/population is only the magic number if you don't own it. We've already pretty much decided we're taking it by storm just to make sure a vote gets called ASAP. You can have 1% of the land and if you have control of the UN, you'll be on the ballet.

    Bottom line is cash is the single most important thing in this variant at this stage in the game, we're throwing alot of gpt away.

    Mist: I'm of the impression that it compounds, but not positive.
     
  6. Mistfit

    Mistfit Deity

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    I'm going to back out of this disscussion because we are into things over my head. My only note would be to wait until NP and Tal can chime in to get their oppinions. NP seems to post mostly in the evenings, and I think Tal is lurking (and pouting) thru the day.
     
  7. Tallanas

    Tallanas Gunboat Diplomat

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    :gripe:

    I'm still sulking, and I will also be away all weekend. So unless you can't play the next turns this weekend, can I request a swap, Scout? I think I'm up after GK, right?

    Here'a a surprise. The referee in that England vs Portugal has a Portuguese wife, apparently... :rolleyes:
     
  8. scoutsout

    scoutsout Minstrel Boy

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    @Tal: I feel your pain, believe me I do. Last fall my team lost to kid brother #1's team in September, then to kid brother #2's team in November. November brought the longest Thankgiving holiday of my life.

    We'll figure out something on the order-of-go. I might even leave it alone, since the 12-turn sets (and last weekend's little flurry) seem to have caught us up a bit.
     
  9. Tallanas

    Tallanas Gunboat Diplomat

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    Heh, I guess it happens to us all at some point, Scout. :rolleyes:

    Now we need a :grumble: smiley, as I'm past the :gripe: stage...

    If Sunday night is soon enough to play, then that's ok. If not, you and I could jsut swap, but whichever we do, I'm sure we've made up a fair bit of ground recently ;)
     
  10. scoutsout

    scoutsout Minstrel Boy

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    I think Sunday will be fine. We're far enough along that one day isn't going to kill us. I think Gengis is taking his time to analyze this one anyway...
     
  11. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Actually I'm just waiting for NP to chime in before I start bulldozing cities. ;)
     
  12. Northern Pike

    Northern Pike Deity

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    Mad-bax, belated thanks for the clarification on ship chaining and the relevant exploits list. I like chaining because without it, the game fails to model one of the basic facts of history: that until the development of railroads, travel by water was far quicker and more economical than travel by land.

    Gengis, thanks for waiting, and I'm sorry that my response to your idea isn't more positive. You clearly think systematically about how to save every possible gp in a given situation, and I respect that approach a lot. But I don't think that we should be abandoning cities at the moment, for the reasons already given by others and for these ones:

    1. Since we still don't know what we'll need to do militarily when the time comes, I don't like the idea of losing tactical options by giving away territory. For example, Tallatown and Talsburg are probably on your list of useless cities, but they'll be important ports if we find ourselves ship chaining to the other continent.

    2. Our research capacity is so strong that it's possible we'll discover every tech we pursue for the rest of the IA in the minimum four turns. (Remember, our GA arrives in fifteen turns, with US.) From this perspective, it's not necessary to squeeze every possible gp out of our position at the expense of other considerations.

    3. As far as the OCN issue is concerned, I don't see that corruption is hurting us much, since we don't have a great many second-ring cities, and the ones we do have aren't badly corrupt. The cities which would benefit most from a reduction in our CN might be the ones we'd have to abandon to achieve that reduction. ;)

    Tallanas, I know the only thing which gladdens an Englishman's heart as much as an English victory is a French humiliation, so I hope you're feeling better now. :lol:
     
  13. Tallanas

    Tallanas Gunboat Diplomat

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    Much better, thank you!

    Actually, the main reason I am glad the French are out is that they have been playing awful football... Imho, the Czechs have played the best, most attractive flowing football, so I am now behind them :)

    Go Czech Republic!
     
  14. Tallanas

    Tallanas Gunboat Diplomat

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    By the way, just in case you guys from the US don't get the full picture of the whole soccer thing, France losing to Greece at football is on a par with America losing to Yemen at baseball. :D
     
  15. scoutsout

    scoutsout Minstrel Boy

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    That's even funnier than the Soccer War!
     
  16. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Alright, I'll refrain from razing. *grumble grumble* :lol:

    I'll try to get it played tonight, but might have to procrastinate finishing up till the morning.
     
  17. Tallanas

    Tallanas Gunboat Diplomat

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    Ah yes, the Soccer War!

    From memory, it was two South American countries who were old, old rivals... or was it Latin America? Bah, can't remember!

    Bolivia and Paraguay? Venezuela and Colombia?

    Put me out of my misery Scout!
     
  18. Northern Pike

    Northern Pike Deity

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    El Salvador vs. Honduras, 1969.
     
  19. Tallanas

    Tallanas Gunboat Diplomat

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    Thank you ;)
     
  20. Mistfit

    Mistfit Deity

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    I don't mean to rub salt in the wound but I am not a soccer fan so what is the American Equivilent of the English loosing to the Portugal?

    Boston loosing to Yankee's? Vice versa?
     

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