Suggestions and requests

[UnholyMudcrab]

Actually, on the subject of the Mughals, why do they start off with a -29 stability hit for lost cities? Is there a reason for that, or is it just a bug?

 

[DC123456789]

It's a bug. Quite a few civs have that.

 

[Leoreth]

I'll address the Moors/Arabia situation in 1.12 too.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

It's a bug. Quite a few civs have that.

Despite this bug, all of these civs (Brazil and Argentina in particular) can still be played just fine and easily get to Solid Stability even in the hands of an AI player.

That shows you just one reason why the current Stability system (especially its ridiculous "Normalization" scheme) needs a drastic overhaul.

 

[Pavel Chichikov]

If AI Arabia and the Arabia UHV goals are changed to include India and Arabia actually invades, maybe the Mughal spawn should be conditional, where it wouldn't spawn if Arabia didn't control Northwest India or if Arabia controlled Northwest India but had Solid or higher stability. It's kind of weird when the Islamic Mughals magically appear out of nowhere with no Muslim presence in the area, where in reality, there had been Islam in India since the 900s.

Yeah I've always felt that, but it didn't think putting this suggestion up was realistic. The 'most advanced civ in 1300' is quite ahistorical as well, could be something about controlling southern Italy as well, because it's not so difficult.

 

[Lennon789]

On the contrary, while I agree that the year 1300 is ahistorical, the goal of being the most advanced civilization in the world is not. I feel that this UHV references the Islamic Golden Age very well, and that we simply need to find another date. I was just throwing out 1200 to match my proposed expansion UHV date, but other years could work equally as well.

 

[BenZL43]

I think it should be reworded and re-coded to control & vassalize so Arabia shouldn't invade Moors, etc but can vassalize them.

 

[UnholyMudcrab]

I think it should be reworded and re-coded to control & vassalize so Arabia shouldn't invade Moors, etc but can vassalize them.

It's already like that. If I'm not mistaken, the wording for the UHV is "control [areas] directly or by vassal."

 

[BenZL43]

really? when was it changed? The last time I played Arab was like half a years ago though lol

 

[FinalLegendZero]

really? when was it changed? The last time I played Arab was like half a years ago though lol

It's been like that since vanilla RFC.

 

[giant49er]

Portugal Changes

I think that Portugal's first goal should be changed to:
-Perform two Trading Missions to East Asia and convert two East Asian cities to Catholicism by 1550. (East Asia being China, South East Asia, India, Indonesia, Japan, and Korea)
I tested this and was able to accomplish it quite easily by 1520 and could probably have done it sooner by putting greater emphasis on merchants and missionaries in Lisbon.

I think that Portugal's Trading Company should target (in addition to the cities it already targets):
-Mumbai, Cochin (it says it already does in the civilopedia but I've never seen it), Mombasa (A.I. only), and Colombo (I know it already does but Colombo should be at the start of 600 A.D.) Because of these suggestions, I think we should make the A.I. receive 8 cities from the trading company (A.I. Portugal is usually too weak anyway) and the human should receive 4.

-Rename Carrack to Nau. This is just for flavor. From what I understand, both the Spanish and Portuguese used Carracks, although the Portuguese called theirs Nau.

-Portugal should have at least some contested territory in Morocco as they did control part of it at one point.

-Portugal should start out with Calendar so that it is easier for both the A.I. and the human to get Astronomy, but not Optics.

 

[Lennon789]

Aztec military units have a chance to enslave defeated enemy units. I think this mechanism should be extended to Islamic civilizations and the Vikings, as these groups were well-known for their taking of slaves in battles against the Christians (Moors, Arabia, Turkey, Vikings) and Hindus (Mughals).

Some caveats: when I say "Islamic civilizations," I specifically mean civilizations that are canonically Muslim, not any Civilization who happens to convert to Islam. Also I think Vikings should lose this ability once they convert to Catholicism (or whichever state religion), which in-game represents their transition from polytheistic raiders to a more agricultural, Christian society.

It also occurs to me that the Aztecs would need a new UP if this suggestion is implemented in whole or in part. I don't see a problem with this, as taking slaves as spoils of battle certainly isn't unique to the Aztecs. If this isn't already the case, perhaps the Power of Sacrifice UP can be modified to allow the Aztecs to sacrifice slaves for production in their cities and either leave happiness unaffected or even increase it.

 

[Leoreth]

It's been like that since vanilla RFC.

The mechanism of how it is determined has changed, though.

I think that Portugal's first goal should be changed to:
-Perform two Trading Missions to East Asia and convert two East Asian cities to Catholicism by 1550. (East Asia being China, South East Asia, India, Indonesia, Japan, and Korea)
I tested this and was able to accomplish it quite easily by 1520 and could probably have done it sooner by putting greater emphasis on merchants and missionaries in Lisbon.

Sounds interesting.

I think that Portugal's Trading Company should target (in addition to the cities it already targets):
-Mumbai, Cochin (it says it already does in the civilopedia but I've never seen it), Mombasa (A.I. only), and Colombo (I know it already does but Colombo should be at the start of 600 A.D.) Because of these suggestions, I think we should make the A.I. receive 8 cities from the trading company (A.I. Portugal is usually too weak anyway) and the human should receive 4.

Existing cities are targeted before empty tiles.

 

[giant49er]

Existing cities are targeted before empty tiles.

I don't catch your meaning. Mumbai and Mombasa always seem to be there, while Cochin is always in 600 A.D. and Colombo is usually in 3000 B.C. My proposal is for Colombo to start at the beginning of the 600 A.D. scenario as an independent city and that Mumbai and Cochin are added to the possible cities for Portugal's Trading Company, with Mombasa being for the A.I. Trading Company only.

 

[UnholyMudcrab]

Mumbai and Cochin would pit the British and the Portuguese against each other, though.

 

[adhiraj.bose]

Is there a plan to make the Mughal/Ghorid spawn conditional or at least changing the flip zone ? Because the idea of the whole North India and East india flipping to the mughals is ahistorical. The Mughals originated around Tajikistan and had to conquer their way into india and keep conquering up to east India. It was only after Aurangzeb that the Mughals managed to break into Southern India and after that it became too instable and collapsed. This should be reflected in the game in an Indian or Cholan respawn around 1660 as the Maratha rebellion.

If such a plan is not there please do think about it. It makes an India game extremely unflexible if the Mughals spawn as they are right now. Additionally, it's quite unnatural to associate the Mughals with pakistan when switching to a republic. In my opinion this should happen only if the state religion is still islam. if it is not so, then the dynamic civ name for an all india republic should be just that, the republic of India. Pakistan itself emerged only as an abbreviation for Punjab, Kashmir, Sindh and Balochistan.

 

[giant49er]

Mumbai and Cochin would pit the British and the Portuguese against each other, though.

2 things:
First, it wouldn't be unrealistic for Portugal and England to fight over Mumbai. It was originally Portuguese, but for some reason or another, they handed it over to the English.
Second, I don't think France and England should target Cochin in the first place. It was never controlled by France and it wasn't conquered by the British until the 1800s.

Some other Trading Company targets should probably be changed. Here is what I think it should be for each country.

Spain: Manila (same)

France: Madras/Pondicherry (no Bangalore or Cochin)

England: Calcutta, Mumbai, and Madras (again, no Bangalore or Cochin)

Portugal: Mbanza Kongo, Quelimane, Mombasa, Masqat, Mumbai, Cochin, Colombo, Malaca, Guangzhou, and Makassar (if these are the target cities, then I think that the A.I. should receive 8 cities and the human should receive 4)

Netherlands: Jakarta, Colombo, Cochin, Taipei, Malaca, Makassar (no Palembang or Borneo)

Edit: Oh and the A.I. Dutch shouldn't require Rifling for their Trading Company

 

[apenpaap]

Aren't Portugal and England pretty much the only two European countries that have never been at war with each other, though? (Except when Portugal was part of Spain)

 

[therox]

yep , they have the oldest defensive agreement to date

 

[iOnlySignIn]

http://dspace.uta.edu/handle/10106/1093

^ When I play as England, the Anglo-Portuguese Alliance certainly works this way.