I've written a detailed update, hopefully people can read and consider it before we play the next turn.
I will prob start a new thread about this... At some point we might consider a reorganization of our Civ's government that is to say Each city (or group of cities) could have an elected (or appointed) governor, who is responsible for making decisions about what that city would produce, work etc.(obviously the turnplayers would execute the commands), maybe we could even set one city "free" as a test city, to be free to produce whatever the governor decides and then decide in X turns if the system is working, or maybe make the production subject to a vote. I could go on and on about the numerous possibilities but I think you get the point...Should we make a thread where our moves for each turn are finalized/posted? If we are having difficulties already with only two cities, we are going to be lost when our empire expands.
The +50% from the academy is a greater benefit than +2 extra commerce from the cottages and one extra population.
I Agree that we need to certify/verify the actions for each turn... unless of course ... we start choosing our nation's Generals, Governors, President, etc... Isnt DEMOCRACY fun?!!!I nominate Kaleb.
I agree on both points. Really glad we have horses!! woohoo! And also great we can get sheep and deer in the small cross.Next city should be by sheep, we have a second resource there and it will make a good city site with 2 food resources for intense whipping...4th city should be towards horses but propably south of horses (there might be river in range) and not where provolution marked...lets decide after we explore more...
myself said:Just to be clear, I'm not necessarily saying that we should do things as per these models, as you are right about the need to expand west. At pace, especially if good build sites appear (site 3 is now looking like a very nice GP farm!)
The two examples above were based on comparing what we would do with pottery and writing. We will either need to build settlers or run specialists in order to avoid going over our happy-cap in the short run anyway.
The new worker in the capital should chop for the settler and then mine, so it's not going to be building cottages anyway. The first worker will likewise also be busy for a while. Either way, we aren't really going to be needing pottery straight away, and by the time city 3 is built we can get pottery after writing, for a granary.
I would not build a library in city 2 right now (as in the model above) but build a worker or a settler at pop3 and chop for it.
So we can get 2 more settlers easily enough and a library in the capital for a quick GS.
I am not so sure we should continue with pottery since I do not see us being in a position to build cottages in four turns. The vote was very close between writing and pottery and with some more time we might have had a clearer vote result. Do we not have 24 hours to play our turn? Can we not also ask for an extension once in a while? Let's begin to take our time here especially when we are not clear on what we want to do.
Now that we have horses close by we can forget archery, right? Pottery will take 5 turns. Let's begin now to decide what tech we want next. It seems to me the choice will be between writing (for libraries) and mysticism (for monuments and maybe a try at an early religion). Writing will take about 10 turns, mysticism about 5. Any ideas how many turns for meditation or polytheism after that?
In general our two cities will be building units to explore and fog bust (a workboat, scouts, warriors) and workers and settlers in the next, say, 15 turns?
Are you sure what the losses are from not having hamlets/towns faster?
Yes I am. For my reasoning I am assuming 100% science rate and that beakers and commerce are interchangeable. I am also ignoring the 25% science bonus from the library. I know this is not completely true but it makes the math easier.
Initially a river cottage and a scientist can each generate 3 commerce/beakers. In the time it takes to get a GS and build an academy (~10 turns) a cottage could grow once and produce 4 commerce.
Hence by working 2 cottages at the end of 10 turns we can produce 8 commerce with these 2 cottages.
By generating a GS 1st and building an academy we get a +50% bonus to science. By starting to work the 2 cottages at this point we generate 6 base commerce and 9 commerce after the academy is factored in.
Over time, both sets of cottages will continue to grow, but the 50% bonus will always be bigger than the incremental increases in growth.
This should prove my point that building an academy 1st is always better than building cottages 1st.
The academy of course also give a 50% bonus to all other science generated in a city which makes this an even more clear decision.
The only reason to tech pottery before writing is to build a granary before a library. I think getting an earlier academy is better but this issue can be debated. The cottage vs academy issue is pretty clear in my mind.
Getting an extra city instead of an academy this early is always better.....have you calculated that?
The only reason to tech pottery before writing is to build a granary before a library. I think getting an earlier academy is better but this issue can be debated. The cottage vs academy issue is pretty clear in my mind.
Getting an extra city instead of an academy this early is always better.....have you calculated that?
Thanks Damnrunner, I appreciate the logic of your breakdown. But aren't we also talking about the ability to build granaries in the other cities as well? Also, what about the fact that we can get the academy later? Surely you agree that we are better off having the towns AND the Academies? If we build the cottages first, we get to towns with academies faster, no?No I had not and I agree. We should build one more settler in our capitol before building a granary or a library. I suggest a library before a granary in the capitol.
My point is granary and cottages vs library and academy.
A granary and cottages does not get us a faster settler.