Leonel
Breakfast Connoisseur
I wish I could go back to 1984. All the partying and music and all the awesomeness of the 80's!
Truly it was the Age of Aquarius...
Truly it was the Age of Aquarius...
the 1984 thread
- Thread starter hossam
- Start date
bob bobato
L'imparfait
'Brave New World' wasn't really that dystopian. The only reason why so crap happened to the main characters was because they cared too much. If they hadn't, they would have lived almost sixty years of constant pleasure. Thats more than what most of use could say.
Integral
Can't you hear it?
I'm sorry, BNW was quite distopian. It was a dystopia quite far removed from the traditional totalitarian dystopia, but it was one nonetheless.
Integral
Japanrocks12
tired of being a man
Hedonism ruling the world is most certainly a dystopia.
Harbringer
Your A One Flower Garden
I love dystopic ficion, but I cant seem to really find any besides the popular few. Can someone please a reccomend me some more sytopc fiction? I pretty much just read Dystopic litterature and Science Fiction.
As for Orwells 1984, Orwel was a gy who had seen communism and totalitarian rule first hand, I beleive I read somewhere that using his wealth he visitied these eastern block countries. He knew what was capable and simply wanted to warn the world(perhaps mostly britian who tend to play follow the leader/guy with biggest stick) that this isnt the rte way to go.
As a side note, after reading Farenheight 451 and 1984 and war of the worlds(the wells version) I have to say that these novels are oddly detailed, especially war of the worlds. I realize Wells was mostly using real life situations at the time and using them in his book metaphorically, but the little details he hits on, and the way he describes them is scary good, its almost as if this actually happened to him, and then he went back in time, prevented it, and then wrote about his expieriences in the future.
As for Orwells 1984, Orwel was a gy who had seen communism and totalitarian rule first hand, I beleive I read somewhere that using his wealth he visitied these eastern block countries. He knew what was capable and simply wanted to warn the world(perhaps mostly britian who tend to play follow the leader/guy with biggest stick) that this isnt the rte way to go.
As a side note, after reading Farenheight 451 and 1984 and war of the worlds(the wells version) I have to say that these novels are oddly detailed, especially war of the worlds. I realize Wells was mostly using real life situations at the time and using them in his book metaphorically, but the little details he hits on, and the way he describes them is scary good, its almost as if this actually happened to him, and then he went back in time, prevented it, and then wrote about his expieriences in the future.
Irish Caesar
Yellow Jacket
1984 is a classic, If any of you have not read it I would strongly recommend you go read it.
For the ones who dont read books anymore im sure you could find a audio book version.
I've not read it; would one of you be so kind as to give me a reason for putting it on my list? Being "a classic" isn't a good enough reason.
Harbringer
Your A One Flower Garden
I've not read it; would one of you be so kind as to give me a reason for putting it on my list? Being "a classic" isn't a good enough reason.
Is good writing, just like Wells and Bradburry he knows how to create a very convincing sounding world. He hits on the tiny details of his future that make you wonder if he had actually gone through this or not. Its a story that describes this totalitarian state and leaves the reader oblivious as to what is actually going on and leads you dow another path from the start. Honestly, you get hope built up and then at the end of the book you feel silly for honestly beleiving in that hope. Im trying not to spoil anything here.
Irish Caesar
Yellow Jacket
It's okay, I've read synopses and seen it discussed here and elsewhere; I know it's not a happy one! I appreciate the review, but I still don't see why it should be required reading for everyone in the world...
Harbringer
Your A One Flower Garden
It's okay, I've read synopses and seen it discussed here and elsewhere; I know it's not a happy one! I appreciate the review, but I still don't see why it should be required reading for everyone in the world...
I beleive he was exagerating to make a point on how great he thinks it is. The thing youl notice when reading it, and I also mentioned it earlier, was that up until the matrix, 1984, Brave New world and Farenheight 451 established the only three types of distopias there are in literature and anything. So when reading them youl be going "hey I saw that in a movie once" or "hey I read a book just like this before" so they probably can seem pretty dated.
Snowball
Chauvinist Pig
I've not read it; would one of you be so kind as to give me a reason for putting it on my list? Being "a classic" isn't a good enough reason.
Because its doubleplusfreakinawesome.
I've not read it; would one of you be so kind as to give me a reason for putting it on my list? Being "a classic" isn't a good enough reason.
No, I wasn't exaggerating. It should be required reading for high school or grammar school students.
The reasons to read 1984 are:
1. It convincingly shows a society which could happen, with today's technology. This society focuses on thought control and has already happened in several places. Iraq under Saddam and North Korea are two. It already happened in Iraq because everyone was watching everyone else, and children were encouraged to snitch on their parents to the government if the parents were doing something against the government. Saudi Arabia is another society which contains thought control. The communist nations of the Soviet Union and Mao's China also heavily resembled Ingsoc (the nation in 1984). So 1984 has many relevant parallels to today's world.
2. It shows the power of propaganda and lies to convince the populace of whatever you want it to believe. That has happened in the US to get the populace behind the war. As you can see, many Americans still believe all manner of nonsense about Saddam and his Iraq.
3. It's fun reading.
4. Certain propagandistic techniques are used in the story which are harder to describe. Ingsoc is at war with Eastasia, and then they switch to being at war with Eurasia. When this switch happens, the announcements are "We've always been at war with Eurasia." This sort of thing has happened in the US.
a. "Saddam has WsMD and that's why we're invading."
b. No WsMD are found.
c. "Saddam is a tyrant and we're trying to liberate the Iraqi people. That was our reason all along."
Stalin's Russia also did this. There are some famous photographs of Stalin with a group of other men. This was a group of his buddies or fellow communist comrades in the Soviet government, or whatever it was. You can see successive versions of the photograph. In each new version, one of the men is missing. The official explanations were, "This guy was never a real communist! He's been removed from power."
5. A central part of Ingsoc is that the war must be continuous. It must not be won nor lost. Just continuous. It doesn't matter if the war is real. This has happened and is still happening in several countries:
a. The US is permanently at war with terrorism. It doesn't matter if the enemy is real.
b. All communist nations have a permanent revolution (permanent war).
It's really the communist nations which have always resembled Ingsoc the most. The US has some parallels too, but it's nowhere near as bad as it is under communism.
If you think Iraq under Hussein and North Korea are equivalent and uniquely terrible, I'm sorry to say you've been a victim of propaganda and poor education. North Korea is an Orwellian nightmare virtually unique in the world now that Pol Pot, Mao and Stalin are dead.
Hussein's Iraq was a squalid third world thugocracy roughly on par with at least twenty others over the last several decades. There's several states which end in -stan, alone, that're on part with Hussein's Iraq (or worse) right now.
Hussein's Iraq was a squalid third world thugocracy roughly on par with at least twenty others over the last several decades. There's several states which end in -stan, alone, that're on part with Hussein's Iraq (or worse) right now.
I did not say that Iraq under Saddam and North Korea are equivalent. I don't see how you can think I said that. EDIT: I reread what I wrote. Now I can see you say that. It's poor wording on my part.
As I said, Iraq under Saddam had some parallels with Ingsoc.
Yeah no worries, wasn't taking issue with your basic points, just with your location of Iraq in the relative spectrum of "degree of Orwellianness".
Do a bit of reading about Turkmenistan for example... creepy friggin country.
Do a bit of reading about Turkmenistan for example... creepy friggin country.
I already know about Turkmenistan. I obviously didn't list every single place with Orwellian parallels.
Yuri2356
Test Screening
Just a little nit-pick, the Country was named Oceania. Ingsoc was specificly the name of their political system. (Shortened from "English Socialism")
Ug! Thanks for the correction.
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