UF student gets tasered...

[Che Guava]

Or maybe they didn't want to hurt him to bad. They could have easly bunched and kicked and drove thier knee into the back of his neck. Instead they asked him to comply and warned they would taze him. He didn't listen. So instead of breaking bones and really using force they tazed him. Something that wasn't to bad considering he got right up after being cuffed and continued acting like a moron.

What?! We're supposed to give them a big hand for resisting the urge to beat him to a bloody pulp? He was on the ground, asking them to stop, saying he would leave. What more could they ask of him at that point?

They could have strangled him to death too, should they get a reward for not doing that?

 

[C~G]

Or maybe they didn't want to hurt him to bad. They could have easly bunched and kicked and drove thier knee into the back of his neck. Instead they asked him to comply and warned they would taze him. He didn't listen. So instead of breaking bones and really using force they tazed him. Something that wasn't to bad considering he got right up after being cuffed and continued acting like a moron.

There's no need to do any punching or kicking if you have five guys against one guy. Surely he can make struggle if he's being aggressive and is I'm Hard-Muhammed Ali-Bruce Lee but that wasn't surely the case here.

It was pathetic display of use of force by these wannabe police officers.
And they did hurt him with that taser.

I'm not sure that a taser, used on an adult, could ever be excessive use of force. Tasing should become commonplace. If police rules of engagement included: "tase first, ask questions later", I bet a few people would manage (at least after a couple enlightening lessons) to stop being complete and total jackasses in public. Like automobiles, a few unfortunate accidents in which people are killed should not stop this very useful device from being used.

Could you please shift yourself back to the reality?

I mean thinking of using taser as "pre-emptive"-method of force and then calling it not of as "excessive use of force" is a parody in itself.

 

[skadistic]

They couldnt have pinned his arms behind his back? Thats pretty easy, especially with the element of surprise. From there he is unable to do jack all and can be cuffed.

What part of resisting don't you get? They had one hand behind his back and cuffed. They asked him and he fought back refusing to put his other hand behind his back and kept trying to roll over. They could have used alot more physical force but didn't. Would you rather they hit him a few times in the kidney?

 

[skadistic]

What?! We're supposed to give them a big hand for resisting the urge to beat him to a bloody pulp? He was on the ground, asking them to stop, saying he would leave. What more could they ask of him at that point?

They could have strangled him to death too, should they get a reward for not doing that?

He was on the ground being arrested. Should we just let every criminal free who says they will just go away? Heres what more they could have asked for: Its called stop resisting arrest! He was under arrest and resisting. Why is that so hard to understand? He had his chance to leave and didn't then started committing crimes and was placed under arrest which he resisted. They should get a reward for not using any more force then needed.

It was pathetic display of use of force by these wannabe police officers.
And they did hurt him with that taser.

Because they didn't use alot of force so as not to hurt the kid, thats pathetic. Maybe they should have really forced him to comply with physical force These trained and deputized 'wanna be ' cops. That tazer hurt so bad he wasn't able to scream like a girl or get right back up and walk away.

 

[Ecofarm]

And they did hurt him with that taser.

Did the big bad po-po give pooooor innocent little smoochie a boo-boo?

I bet his feelings got hurt too.

 

[C~G]

What part of resisting don't you get? They had one hand behind his back and cuffed. They asked him and he fought back refusing to put his other hand behind his back and kept trying to roll over. They could have used alot more physical force but didn't. Would you rather they hit him a few times in the kidney?

Again, no need to hit him any way. One guy keeps the arm with cuffs, couple can be used to hold his legs and rest of the body and you still have TWO guys bend the other arm from the front to the back.

But obviously you're missing the point and making statements that have zero truth value to support your opinion.

And holy crap, this guy wasn't even massively aggressive, didn't know how to wrestle or wasn't on drugs. These guys and gals probably would had shot such a person if that would had been the case in their absurd unskillfulness.

Because they didn't use alot of force so as not to hurt the kid, thats pathetic. Maybe they should have really forced him to comply with physical force These trained and deputized 'wanna be ' cops. That tazer hurt so bad he wasn't able to scream like a girl or get right back up and walk away.

And the same continues...

Did the big bad po-po give pooooor innocent little smoochie a boo-boo?

I bet his feelings got hurt too.

The question is about how to subdue of person that must be get on control without hurting him and do it without using additional tools when you have HUGE advantage over the person. If you don't get it, don't try me with that "you get what you ask kid"-attitude. It doesn't impress me. Obviously you missed the point by a mile.

 

[skadistic]

Again, no need to hit him any way. One guy keeps the arm with cuffs, couple can be used to hold his legs and rest of the body and you still have TWO guys bend the other arm from the front to the back.

But obviously you're missing the point and making statements that have zero truth value to support your opinion.

And holy crap, this guy wasn't even massively aggressive, didn't know how to wrestle or wasn't on drugs. These guys and gals probably would had shot such a person if that would had been the case in their absurd unskillfulness.
And the same continues...
The question is about how to subdue of person that must be get on control without hurting him and do it without using additional tools when you have HUGE advantage over the person. If you don't get it, don't try me with that "you get what you ask kid"-attitude. It doesn't impress me. Obviously you missed the point by a mile.

Are you cop? Ever subdued a resisting criminal? Ever been arrested? How about resisted arrest? Please enlighten me with your expert knowledge. You have all the answers so you must be a pro or have some first hand experience right? Tell us all how easy it is to arrest some one who is resisting. Give me some "truth value".

 

[Ecofarm]

Perhaps you missed my point. There was no reason the believe that the person did not mean to harm the officers. He was resisting arrest even after being floored by the officers. At this point in a confrontation - where the arrestee strugles to free himself beyond reason - what is reasonable action? Is this person resisting for a reason? Can they actualy DO something as a result of their apparently irrational actions? Should we assume they can (hidden knife/gun/button) or should we assume that they are just struggling irrationally? At this point in the confrontation - when the arrestee is being completely irrational and physically violent - I think a lil tase action is justified. Of course, this is comming from someone who is pro pre-emptive tasing.

Is that closer your point?

 

[Elrohir]

You'd make any fascist proud!

Unpopular speech is now "disturbing the peace." Awesome! 1984, here we come!

Trolling doesn't become you John. I'm not a fascist - I'm a rationalist who knows a proportional response when he sees it.

He didn't disturb the peace by asking an unpopular question. He disturbed the peace by breaking the rules of the event by cutting in line and not being fair or serious with his questions - not allowing Kerry to respond, and asking stupid questions in an obnoxious and loud manner - and then refusing to leave after his turn was up and causing a scene when the police tried to get him to leave, and physically assaulting police officers when they attempted to usher him away from the mike.

If he had calmly waited his turn, asked a single question, and not fought the cops, he could have gotten his answer and this wouldn't have been a big deal. Instead he cut in line, was obnoxious and loud and assaulted the cops when they tried to relocate him. Speaking at a public event like this is a privilege, not a right, and he lost that privilege when he showed that he wasn't going to follow the rules of the event.

Free speech is a right. But speaking in a controlled setting is a privilege. Get it straight John. He has the right to speak his views, but not in all settings - if he wanted to go outside and yell about the Skull and Bones society and the Illuminati, then he could have, and no one would have cared. But by disrupting this town hall meeting he lost his privilege to speak there and he deserved to be kicked out. He wouldn't have been arrested if he hadn't physically resisted.

This isn't fascistic, it is simply common sense. Saying that anyone has the right to disrupt proceedings of this kind with absolute impunity doesn't show that you embrace civil liberties, it shows that you're flirting with anarchy. There is a solid middle ground between the extremes of fascism to the one side and anarchy on the other, and I'm standing squarely on it. You, on the other hand, seem to be slipping off and away from the sane moderate position into the extreme.

 

[Che Guava]

If they aren't real cops, do they even have the right to arrest him? Can I put on a sherrif's hat and tackle people if they cut across my lawn?

 

[Ecofarm]

Fascism and anarchy are opposites on the political scale?

I disagree. I see the political scale in the form of an omega symbol/character. At the top is pure democracy. On the left tip is communism, on the right is fascism, and between those tips is anarchy.

 

[Ecofarm]

UF police are real police. Unlike most colleges, UF has a real police department. They work in conjunction with the Gainesville PD and county PD.

40k undergrads: that's probably a majority population in gainesville. + grads + admin + professors + maintenance + construction + public research...

= PD

 

[skadistic]

If they aren't real cops, do they even have the right to arrest him? Can I put on a sherrif's hat and tackle people if they cut across my lawn?

Sure you can. You can also expect to be arrested for impersonating a cop.

 

[fishjie]

Most Ignorant Post of the Year Award (2007)

You just remember to go quietly when its YOUR rights that are being trampled.

so what rights were being trampled? the right to be an obnoxious moron who wasn't doing anything productive? I *truly* hope you are not trying to compare this guy to people like Rosa Parks. This guy had no point to make other than that he is a real life troll.

These people try and act like they are matyrs fighting for some higher purpose when really they are just public disturbances. He was asked many times to leave, but he wouldn't. He is a spoiled brat who was never beaten by his parents, and always got things his way. He finally got a taste of real life.

Enjoy your tasering.

actually i have seen police do some messed up things and have no love for them. I am a minority. I understand that police can wreck you. I'm actually asian, so I didn't think police would do anything bad, cause they're too busy racially profiling black people, but many years ago, I witnessed something that completely changed my perception. The problem is, there is no one to police the police, so they get away with instances of gross misuse of power. This was not one of them.

Yep. If only the Brits would have had tasers back in the 1770's.

i'm not sure if you had a point here. if you wanted to make one, you might have said, too bad they didn't taser martin luther king or gandhi. of course, those were real men standing up for real rights. this was just a moronic liberal getting the ownage he deserved.

 

[Elrohir]

If they aren't real cops, do they even have the right to arrest him? Can I put on a sherrif's hat and tackle people if they cut across my lawn?

Are you a licensed law enforcement officer? Read this.

UPD is accredited by the Commission on Accreditation for Law Enforcement Agencies (CALEA) and the Commission for Florida Law Enforcement Accreditation. Ten years ago, when the department first received CALEA certification, it was one of only 14 university police departments to do so.

Yes, the officers in the orange-and-blue-trimmed cars are real officers. Because they are real officers, they are allowed to dump out your keg and give you a speeding ticket like officers with the Gainesville Police Department.

 

[Ecofarm]

What makes the guy a liberal?

 

[Elrohir]

Fascism and anarchy are opposites on the political scale?

I disagree. I see the political scale in the form of an omega symbol/character. At the top is pure democracy. On the left tip is communism, on the right is fascism, and between those tips is anarchy.

Anarchy is the lack of control, fascism is total control by the state. They sound like opposites to me, although they are similarly loony in practice.

What makes the guy a liberal?

If you read his site or watch the video, it is pretty clear where his politics lie......

 

[C~G]

Are you cop? Ever subdued a resisting criminal? Ever been arrested? How about resisted arrest? Please enlighten me with your expert knowledge. You have all the answers so you must be a pro or have some first hand experience right? Tell us all how easy it is to arrest some one who is resisting. Give me some "truth value".

Have no need to show my list of experience to convince anyone. Anybody who knows anything about subduing can recognise taser as excessive use of force.

But I have mentioned earlier that I do work on private security business. I have worked example as security guard and have been subduing people alone and in group, in practice and in reality. Is that good enough for you?

But of course that statement doesn't hold any real "truth value" since as this is internet I might be lying.

The guy in the video is pretty big but the man power and how easily he eventually goes down suggests that there is simply no need to use taser. Like I said, I really fear what these officers might do if somebody would be aggressively resisting them if they are already using taser in this case. If that is the "normal policy", it sucks.

BTW, it can take quite organized effort of bunch of guys get someone really subdued who really is a big guy and is doped but this isn't the case here. Usually time and good stamina makes the difference if he's on the floor.

Perhaps you missed my point. There was no reason the believe that the person did not mean to harm the officers. He was resisting arrest even after being floored by the officers. At this point in a confrontation - where the arrestee strugles to free himself beyond reason - what is reasonable action? Is this person resisting for a reason? Can they actualy DO something as a result of their apparently irrational actions? Should we assume they can (hidden knife/gun/button) or should we assume that they are just struggling irrationally? At this point in the confrontation - when the arrestee is being completely irrational and physically violent - I think a lil tase action is justified. Of course, this is comming from someone who is pro pre-emptive tasing.

Is that closer your point?

I'm just valuating between using simple man power and skill of those officers of subduing any man resisting even aggressively them without hurting him compared to using taser and hurting him. Obviously their unskillfulness leads to the use of taser...

It's right from the start apparent they work as disorganized unit and don't have clue what they are doing and then obviously they want to handle the situation fast so they grab into the easiest choice for themselves, the taser, which was simply unnecessary.

UF police are real police. Unlike most colleges, UF has a real police department. They work in conjunction with the Gainesville PD and county PD.

Which IMO makes it even worse. These guys aren't really even guards but actually police who are supposed protect the public!

If they would be some untrained guards I could give them slack but police officers...geez.

actually i have seen police do some messed up things and have no love for them. I am a minority. I understand that police can wreck you. I'm actually asian, so I didn't think police would do anything bad, cause they're too busy racially profiling black people, but many years ago, I witnessed something that completely changed my perception. The problem is, there is no one to police the police, so they get away with instances of gross misuse of power. This was not one of them.

Well, I wouldn't call it "gross misuse of power" either (the other taser incident was such BTW) but simply misuse of force from lack of skill.

 

[Ecofarm]

Anarchy is the lack of control, fascism is total control by the state. They sound like opposites to me, although they are similarly loony in practice.

Fascism is not total control by the state; it allows private property. Communism does not. Both are totalitarian, communism more so. If your depiction of political ideologies is correct, communism would be a more suited 'opposite'. How could anarchy be the opposite of both communism and (slightly less so) fascism?

See again: circular or omega political diagram.

 

[Elrohir]

Fascism is not total control by the state; it allows private property. Communism does not. Both are totalitarian, communism more so. If your depiction of political ideologies is correct, communism would be a more suited 'opposite'. How could anarchy be the opposite of both communism and (slightly less so) fascism?

See again: circular or omega political diagram.

*Sighs* Whatever. This is all semantics anyway - my point was simply that I wasn't being fascistic.


Note on this whole situation: If you want to say they were right to subdue him, but using the taser was just going a bit too far, then I don't have much of a problem with that. but if you're going to suggest, as John as, that it was wrong for the police to interfere at all and that they "kidnapped" him....well, that's nuts.