Unique Ability Elimination Thread

[Gucumatz]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 13
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 13
Patriarchate of Constantinople 3 (-2). A very limited UA. Nearly useless on higher levels, no synergy to help it, to make the best use of it you often have to ignore the UUs, start bias won't give you any advantage and as Byzantium you can't always get to use your Dromons anyways. A quite poor UA in practice
Phoenician Heritage 29
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 21
Viking Fury 16 (+1) The best or one of the best no matter how you cut it War UAs there are. Start bias guarentees you some water somewhere and there will always be coast or cities that are 6-9 tiles inland from water that you can use to blitzkrieg with. Lakes are always around the map somewhere and basically become mobile turrets for your units. You almost always want to station a unit in a lake as Denmark
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 22
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 20
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 10
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 8
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19

 

[jacksone7]

Viking Fury 16 (+1) The best or one of the best no matter how you cut it War UAs there are. Start bias guarentees you some water somewhere and there will always be coast or cities that are 6-9 tiles inland from water that you can use to blitzkrieg with. Lakes are always around the map somewhere and basically become mobile turrets for your units. You almost always want to station a unit in a lake as Denmark

So, no response to my questions? You are content to continue voting for a UA that relies on what seems to be a bug?

 

[Tabarnak]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 13
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 13
Patriarchate of Constantinople 3
Phoenician Heritage 29
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 21
Viking Fury 16
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 20
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 10
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19

Sun Never Sets : Can shave you a lot of turns when exploring the seas or simply rushing another civ. Way better than...

Barbary Corsairs : I can play seek and hide with England and will always lose.

 

[Gucumatz]

So, no response to my questions? You are content to continue voting for a UA that relies on what seems to be a bug?

I haven't seen your questions - will look at them now.

 

[Gucumatz]

Correct me if I am wrong here, but a berserker with 7 moves and ignoring ZOC is the result of a bug, no? And, if the unit starts in the water and uses 1 move to get to land (to get the 6 land MP) how would it attack 6 times and still go back to water?

Plus, more importantly, if you are attacking 6 times and pillaging 6 times that means you are moving onto 6 different tiles, which means you are killing 6 units. That is some pretty sweet injured warrior spam you are facing.

If you are attack a city, then pillage, then attack the city, then you are on a tile with no improvement to pillage. I am sort of doubting you have ever pulled off a 6-attack & 6-pillage turn.


EDIT:
Also, because I am unsure of exactly how it works, doesn't Blitz only allow you to attack 2 times regardless of remaining move points?

Well the UA's function/utility has been known for a while [Ever since Denmark has been out] - and we haven't seen any responses from firaxis that this is a "bug". So at the moment I suspect its a feature. The UA specifically says it will only cost "one movement point" to move onto land. The ZoC ability works like this - that it removes the maximum points for normal land movement off of a unit. Supposedly greg used Denmark with the extra movement (so as far to that I don't think its a bug) but as for the ZoC I am not sure if it is a bug or not.

Blitz works for multiple attacks (beyond 2 even) - logistics only works for 2. And yes I am listing the optimal condition (attacking 6 times + healing 6 times) with killing the unit on it. But the point is its still "theoretically" possible. Using ranged units to flank can help .

And if I said you could attack 6 times/pillage 6 times and still move into the water obviously was a mistype then, I apologize. But the point still stands you can attack multiple times and pillage multiple times (up to 5) and still return to the water. Obviously the setting won't allow always for the maximum ability but that mobility gives you a TON of options. I haven't had a Janissary city state as Denmark so far but - it could be potentially quite fun with the extra movement points and once blitz is earned. And yes I have had plenty of blitz units as Denmark in regards to your earlier point.

 

[Snoopaloop]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 13
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 1
Phoenician Heritage 29
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 21
Viking Fury 16
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 20
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 10
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19

-2 PoC - I think you all know my reasoning by know. An ability that loses almost all value on higher difficulties.

+1 Ingenuity - A great science UA. Get that free early scientist, and then pump out more!

 

[Seabastian Civ]

-2 PoC - I think you all know my reasoning by know. An ability that loses almost all value on higher difficulties.

Not just on Immortal/Diety, either. Even on Emporer, If 3 religions get founded before you, there's likely not a great "UA" remaining for you. God, that's annoying.

 

[jacksone7]

Gucumatz - fair enough, just thought the hyperbole was getting a bit heavy.

 

[Rooftrellen]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 13
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 1
Phoenician Heritage 30
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 21
Viking Fury 14 (-2)
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 20
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 10
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19

Carthage's free harbors give gold, potentially production, and just generally help maintain a large empire so long as there is some coast along which to put cities, which helps with anything, since you always need production and cash.

Viking Fury is more restricted and just generally unimpressive. The AI won't be very good at stopping your invading force from sea regardless and pillaging actually requires improvements, improvements that haven't been pillages yet, so free pillaging just isn't all that useful, even taking the patch into consideration.

 

[callan]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 13
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 1
Phoenician Heritage 30
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 21
Viking Fury 15 (+1 People who have never used this often underestimate it. Going to be even better soon.)
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18 (-2 Not a great ability pre G&K, made to look Mickey Mouse now by Austria)
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 10
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19

 

[Wabango]

Manifest Destiny 15
Trade Caravans 13
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 1
Phoenician Heritage 30
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 21
Viking Fury 15
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 10
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 25
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19

Moderator Action: As noted in the opening post and in my quite clear warning in the thread: please do not just post numbers but give some reason for your vote. Else these posts are just spam, if these threads are supposed to continue they should at least offer some value besides number spam. - ori
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Lordleoz]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 11
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 1
Phoenician Heritage 30
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 22
Viking Fury 15
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 10
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19

Art of War: providing more and better generals is great

Trade Caravans: 1 extra gold for each trade route isn't very useful. The bonus is too small.

 

[Gucumatz]

Gucumatz - fair enough, just thought the hyperbole was getting a bit heavy.

Its a fair question to ask if its a bug (like the ability Hwacha currently has for example) or if its a feature.

I don't think its hyperbole though, Denmark's UA is just that damn good - mobility/extra movement/extra range/synergy and soon to be a pillage boost - possibly the best of all combat UAs

On paper it sounds pretty mediocre - in practice its amazing. I would still rate the Inca UA higher than VF (because of the combat AND economic bonuses) - but I don't think any of the down votes VF has gotten have truly been "deserving" in my humble opinion. [And once again I am sorry if I sound pushy - I can do that at times ]

 

[ori]

Moderator Action: I really do not wish to police these threads for pure spam, I am quite frankly not convinced of the discussion value of these threads to begin with. However, just spamming your votes without giving any reason is most certainly no longer fit for a discussion forum. So if you wish to continue with elimination threads please do at least give reasons for your votes.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[woodshadows]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 11
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 1
Phoenician Heritage 28
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 22
Viking Fury 15
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 12
Bushido 11
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 20
River Warlord 19


bushido is pretty great, especially for navy, it really can help you stay in the game if you're behind in tech or units, or it can be dominating if you're already ahead - also, though the samurai and zero both aren't super impressive on paper, combined with bushido they both make nice additions and work well with the trait.

phoenecian heritage - i dont like long empires, they are difficult and expensive to protect and coastal cities tend to not produce as well as inland cities, i dont like being forced into a strategy which pushes me to very restrictive city placement and i dont really want to not build roads either to take advantage of a gold savings per turn, i like roads, i like my land units and workers being able to move between cities along roads. crossing mountains is okay, in a few situations i've definitely wished i had that ability, but overall it doesnt impress.

 

[The_J]

Moderator Action: 2 posts deleted.
You're not allowed to respond to moderator actions in public.
If you want to say something regarding a mod action, then do it via PM.

 

[Seabastian Civ]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 11
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 1
Phoenician Heritage 28
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 22
Viking Fury 15
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 10 (-2) Too terrain dependent. I've seen many maps with start bias ON, that the Iroquois UA is worthless due to lack of contiguous forests. This one can't hang around much longer, I'd much rather have Bushido or Spirit of Adwa.
Bushido 11
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 21 (+1) More Great people helps any kind of VC. Additional way to use them adds to this flexibility. Also, one of the only non-religious civs that can dominate religion. Going Honor and gifting that general to a religious city state basically ensures a pantheon and a great head start on a religion. Fantastic UA.
River Warlord 19

 

[Gucumatz]

Well time to finish PoC
Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 11
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Patriarchate of Constantinople 0 (-2) It potentially offers a lot of combinations but offers very little ability to get there. A UA that can barely be used if at all on higher levels and limited in multiplayer as well. Maybe with the national temple it could become better in singleplayer if AI don't go for it - but at this point I doubt it.
Phoenician Heritage 28
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 22
Viking Fury 16 (+1) I would really like to quit upvoting VF as there are plenty of great UAs out there - the problem is this one I feel is so underrated and doesn't deserve to be under 20 that I have to keep voting it up as for the aforementioned reasons. My hope is people will be enticed by pillaging changes to explore the rest of the UA (The great ocean/lake/sea aspects of it)
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 10
Bushido 11
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 21
River Warlord 19

 

[Tabarnak]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 11
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Phoenician Heritage 29
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 22
Viking Fury 16
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 8
Bushido 11
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 14
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 21
River Warlord 19

Phoenician Heritage : Awesome UA when having multiple cities near the coast. In 1 of my GMR games, i play as Carthage and i'm making over 100 gpt without a ga around the turn 80(quick speed). I can tell that is some incredible stats at that point of the game! I also built Macchu Picchu

The Great Warpath : Useful in the beginning when moving units and save turns but forests mean to be cutted most of the time. It becomes useless pretty fast.

 

[Rooftrellen]

Manifest Destiny 17
Trade Caravans 11
Diplomatic Marriage 17
Sacrificial Captives 23
Ingenuity 14
Phoenician Heritage 30 (+1)
Druidic Lore 8
Art of War 22
Viking Fury 16
Monument Builders 23
Sun Never Sets 23
Spirit of Adwa 5
Ancien Regime 24
Hellenic League 18
Scourge of God 6
Great Andean Road 25
The Great Warpath 8
Bushido 11
Scholars of the Jade Hall 21
The Long Count 17
Mongol Terror 6
Dutch East India Company 24
Barbary Corsairs 6
Achaemenid Legacy 25
Wayfinding 12 (-2)
The Glory of Rome 29
Siberian Riches 20
Father Governs Children 25
Seven Cities of Gold 12
Nobel Prize 21
River Warlord 19

Don't make the mistake of thinking every city as Carthage needs to be on the coast. Not every Spanish City will be next to a natural wonder and not every Incan city will be surrounded by hills. To take full advantage of free harbors, actally, I would claim you don't WANT every city coastal. The savings can be amazing with coastal cities connecting to a few inland cities to take strategic inland areas.

This is mostly a pot shot at Wayfinding to do something a little different. My issue is that if you want to go out and explore the oceans early, you do so with units that can't go so far or see so well (comparing to the caravel at astronomy), and if you go exploring later, you can already have astronomy. I can see the benefit, but...it's not that massive of a benefit, particularly with Great Admirals, which aren't so hard to get even early if you have a coastal neighbor you don't mind going to war with.